Pre-match: Concacaf Nations League Quarterfinals @ Jamaica (Nov 14) & v Jamaica (Nov 18)

first mistake was hiring a coach to play basically the same style (with some tweaks) of what the guy you just fired did. and i understand one guy has far better results than the other, but we've gone down this road fairly far with little success.

second mistake is this guy is apparently not going to do any of his own homework and is just going to accept USSF's analytics department's idea of a call sheet, which at this point is getting regressive. like we're gonna start re-learning old lessons now. ream? steffen? zendejas? i saw someone posting on social media give guzan a try based on the atlanta upset. dude's value was a fresh set of eyes, if not a fresh formation and system. if we are literally going to run out the same people played the same way, the definition of crazy is........

third, this euro/MX fanboy club form allstar team has been flubbing games since roughly 2022. i mentioned regression? well, i realize we can place kids at big clubs now, but reflexively picking them as a team even as they lose soccer games into their mid 20s?

fourth, we barely beat jamaica in march with 10/11 of the likely lineup. scally and jedi got backdoored. we got a last second own goal then basically threw names on the field to win in OT. plus this summer. plus the indiferent fall games. plus a year or so before that. that was the first friendly win in roughly a year!

fifth, i realize the schedule is set up these days to be mostly "games that count" which result in roster conservatism, but this needs a fresh look. like we lose half the time then pretend the schedule argues against tinkering with it. as though your best chance to win is guys who can barely manage it less than half the time.

 

I have little doubt that we'll see the 3-2 setup in the back for build up this time around. I don't really see why we'd change based on the players we see. Obviously, if Jamaica does something defensively, I could see it flipped (2-3, etc) but the 3 ATB + the box is both fairly common for Poch and the in tactic.

That still brings two questions.

The first is defensive. Will we play a defensive 3/5 ATB? And in particular, it's LB that is the real concern. Will we play Ream at LB if Jedi goes down, and how much defensive help do we give him against a Leon Bailey?

And on offense, what is the adjustment by Pochettino? Without Jedi to play wide, do we swap Christian to the right side? Or do we ask him to provide width but take him out of the middle. How does build up work there if we are completely anchored at the back. He may just flip the plan, but it's worth thinking about.

It's not hard to think of alternatives, but it's also not as simple as "we played 3 ATB last time" when we only did in certain phases of the game.

I am not surprised nor bothered that they were called in. But I think people do have to realize that part of the reason Busio and Morris did so well against Panama and didn't look as much the problem against Mexico is the limited role.

You call it out with the CBs, but it's true for the CDMs as well. Pochettino set up the build up for the CB/Keeper line to have short passes, and the CDMs to have short passes, and that left the CAMs (inc. Pulisic) to do the heavy lifting on the build up.

Christian was up to it; Aaronson and Tillman weren't against Mexico. That's what happened ... but also, they were asked to do more.

It will be really interesting to see how the midfield box looks this time around. Where does McKennie slot in if he does there (I think there's a chance he's at RB). Johnny likely takes one of Morris and Busio's slots.

I don't think anyone in the back line is a very good passer. Ream is the only one with consistent skill, and he was poor in the last window. I don't think Richards or McKenzie or whomever people want to hold up as a better passer are good enough to change the dynamic I have above -- they aren't consistently allowing us to push the role of the CDM line forward or to skip it.

Miles is an excellent defender and one of our few guys in space. I don't really know why Trusty would be ahead of him -- Miles was a better MLS defender, and Trusty was good in a league similar to MLS, terrible in the EPL and now plays at Celtic ... which ... as we know, is not exactly hard. It's my issue with CCV as well -- he's got big holes as a player that are never challenged there and I think it has held back his improvement.

The guy I would have loved to see in camp was Walker. Loves to play for the shirt, looked very good once healthy in MLS, owns the air and is never pushed around, and actually probably has the second best long ball out of our CBs.

 

(a) they need to decide if the point of emphasis is offense or defense. the backline choices tend to favor technical attacking play. the midfield choices, conversely, are diesel hustle players.

(b) if the idea is possess the ball, then we need technical mids. if the idea is win midblock and transition, then DMs are ok but you need mids who can hustle to ballwin, then hit a 30 yard ball on the dot to take advantage of the opposition being caught up. that is not weston or musah.

is any of this sounding like our play the first two poch games? exactly. we go out there with the diesel mids and can't string passes. and the one outlet ball was pulisic running back, winning it, and making the pass for himself.

personally, as a defender, i want a better team defense. the people we are picking are the lousy defense that helped get berhalter fired.

nor do we seem that interested in finding a new 6 even semi-capable of filling adams' shoes, which is necessary to a defense first 433 trying to win and go in transition.

and if you want to just attack like mad, as ream and jedi hint at, then a sloppy MF is the attacks sputtering out halfway there. anything that happens will be up the wings. and pray to god it's not just flag keepaway then a cross.

 

I wasn't super impressed with Maloney on either side of the ball when he came in last time but I would like to see him again.

I'd be surprised if Pefok got another call up, but I will say that if we're going down this "guys who desperately want to play for us" that could bring him more around.

I'm guessing Johnny grabs one. I would really like to see Tessman get a shot, though -- I think he's the most likely to make a pass that creates real danger.

I would like Weston forward. If he plays back, then I hope we adjust the role to get him forward.

 

For me, this really highlights the right midfield logjam. If McKennie and Musah don't fit his deep midfield spots, we are going to have to decide what to do with some guys. McKennie can slide into the 10 spot, especially without Gio around. But, then Weah vs. Musah is a though call. Very different players for different looks, or does one get stuck at right back? I could see Scally back to the bench if Poch wants to play one of the three in the back. If Gio ever gets back into the groove, things get even more crowded as then you have him fighting with McKennie for a spot.

 

I think Johnny and Tessman back there would give us some really nice options and I think Tessman has a unique passing range in this group that could really be useful back there. But, Busio and Morris were a couple of the better performers last window so it should be really interesting seeing what happens in those spots.

 

I think it is absolutely bizarre to think of this as some massive directional change from Berhalter. Berhalter called in the most talented players for a long time now -- this is very much a Berhalter roster except that he usually went two deep positionally.

We've actually had rosters with Ream as the backup LB. Hell, we had rosters with Ream as the starting LB! So it's basically dropping Fossey and bringing Steffen back again? These are not massive changes.

Which we shouldn't expect, because Berhalter picked on talent and performance and Pochettino is going to pick on talent and performance, and it should not shock anyone that the likely largest changes will be at the margins.

Berhalter clearly had players he'd be flexible with, like Reyna or Chistian, and then guys who really had a limited role and position. Poch might be more flexible on that ... or a guy like Musah might simply be in his first group.

We'll see.

 

and to go meta and link up my 2 sets of critiques, we generally seem to have fanboy TV viewer all star team over here (waves one hand) then fanboy TV tactics over there (waves other hand several feet away). the two do not join up. basic soccer 101 which this team understood 20-30 years ago when it was in over its head -- is the best paper all star team does not necessarily fit the scheme. basic soccer 101 which this team understood 20-30 years ago when it started getting players abroad -- is the club stats guy or the form guy does not necessarily translate to a country guy.

we have abundant history of pope being simply a better player than berhalter, regardless who played where. we have abundant history of mcbride or donovan being a better striker, even when lassiter was setting records. and this used to be a team where a guy might be talented but just be a misfit for scheme, and player would give way to team.

this is now becoming the wrong player with the right resume will start ahead of superior talent; the club numbers guy will beat out the regular country producer; and we will throw out a wannabe all star unit even if it is a horrible scheme fit, lose games -- THEN STILL TELL OURSELVES IT'S OUR BEST CHANCE TO WIN THE NEXT BALL GAME.

 

And the midfield logjam is with Adams not in the group either.

One player a little overlooked.
We have a player starting in central midfield, and playing really well, for the 2nd placed team in the Eredivisie.

[We also have a group of U23 type of guys performing well. Not at USMNT level, but we'll see a couple of years down the line. Central midfield was a real strength of the Olympic pool. Even with Buck and Vargas defecting. Oh, and Amir Richardson choosing not to play with us.]

 

It's a good problem to have. I don't really think Musah versus McKennie is a tough call for me at all; I really like Musah but McKennie brings so much more. Yes, he was not good in the summer but there's a larger body of work. That said, I don't see McKennie as a great fit for play like Busio and Morris did. Of course, that can change.

And maybe Pochettino solely thinks of Musah as a wide player right now ... His comments don't really imply that but this roster might.

If everyone is healthy, there is an odd man out. Or two, because I don't know how much he will let the double pivot roam. A lot of it will depend on how many guys Poch wants in attack.

And a LOT can change when Dest comes back. How Poch intends to use -- or not use -- Dest potentially completely changes everything. Maybe we get a preview this window if we see two fullback that can move up. I doubt it -- I suspect we only that the RB attack if the LB is Ream ... but two offensively capable fullbacks creates a lot of decisions.

But when are we 100% healthy and fit? When will this truly be an issue?

 

all due respect to "poch is picking based on performance,"
haha

WHAT PERFORMANCE? we got whooped by mexico. thoroughly. or are you doing the fanboy thing where we ignore mexico or the 10 other crappy windows lately, and try to revive the same 11/23 by discussing their club stats? regardless if every time they come back with gaudy numbers they look the exact same? which tells me they aren't being "scouted for performance," they are being "analyzed for stats." scouting would involve watching them play, and, say, analyzing if cowell is any more accurate a finisher, if mckennie or musah have become any better in tight MF spaces or hitting long passes, if ream can mark anyone.

and idiot -- even a non-soccer-playing fan i went to college with -- can pick you a reputation list of names. or read box scores and pick stats guys. it takes actual soccer grasp to pick toolsets and players who can combine well for offense or defense.

no, i don't buy poch spent much of any time at all watching tape, either of last window or of club scouting. or this would look different.

what i see is standard USSF picks, even regressive ones of guys who washed out years ago, then poch parachutes in and coaches them.

since part of the problem is the selection and its scheme fit, as long as he does no homework, this is going nowhere.

this either needs to go a lot more technical and attacking, where we can outscore teams. or it needs to be less leaky, where we can try and win 1-0.

right now this is 1-1 mush, a misfit unit to the scheme that tops out at 1-2 goals per game, and often sputters, conjoined with a defense that cannot pitch shutouts.

people who adore pep style tactics can applaud, pat the coach on the back, effectively flex their own soccer viewing.......

but this is poorly designed to win soccer games.

 

I do agree on Walker. I've said it here, on reddit, x, discord ect that the US has not had a consistently good CB pairing (or defense really) since Walker got dropped.

I admit I may be a bit unfair towards Miles. Honestly, I just think the CBs have been so consistently mistake prone that I'd like to see more guys get a chance. To me, our most in form CBs are Trusty and McKenzie and they do have chemistry together so I'd at least like to give it a shot, but I also don't really think it's a difference. I just think the Ream/Miles/Scally trio looked very uncomposed vs Mexico.

But yes with the AMs Brendo and Tillman were not up for the role they were asked to play. the CMs got the most hate and people talked about them getting bodied. I thought Buso/Morris were up for it physically vs Mexico but they just were not ready for how the match would be called. I do think they adjusted a bit.

 

the people discussing jedi and scally in the abstract, seem to have forgotten multiple games in recent years the wingbacks have been burned. now, this might be tolerable if you have committed to all out attack -- but we hardly have. and if you committed to all out attack you wouldn't use half cooked 8s and DMs in the MF. you'd have 2 much more technical mids who can possess and create, reyna, puli, luna, sullivan, green, ferreira -- closer to 10s -- with the idea we might give up some counters but win 3-2.

you put your lame already disproven musah mckennie MF out there, we cannot possess, no central creativity, ball goes wide and we hopeful cross it in and see what happens. 1-2 goals max. jedi, ream, scally, etc. then get burned for 1-2 goals themselves.

good way to tie and lose a lot. and you don't get to play st. kitts in the world cup.

 

@juvechelsea 's lineup:

--------------------CB--CB----------------------
----------CB-------------------------CB----------
-----------------CB----------CB------------------
CB----------CB------------------CB--------CB-
----------------------GK---------------------------

And none of those CB's have names.

 

I dont think its just a matter of a straight player to player comparison. But the drop off from who replaces them and I suspect the US has the advantage in that regards.

 

Not a suggestion. It was in response to questions about only having two outside backs...and by implication, what is his backup plan if Scally or Jedi or Scally became unavailable for one reason or another? So @Reccossu and I were discussing the possibilities and their ramifications. I believe Scally would be easier to replace by simply slotting in Musah or Weah in his spot...perhaps not ideal but no backup plan is ideal (by definition of a backup plan I think). The lineup you are referring to was one that I thought he might consider if Jedi were unavailable for one reason or another.

 

I tend to agree but I also think those two are the easiest to square by playing McKennie at the 10, at least for this window. We get a healthy Gio back or Tillman steps up his play in a 10 role and it starts getting tough again.

But the deep midfielders are really the most significant change we've seen under Poch so far and it opens up spots for a lot of passing center mids who weren't really so involved before like Busio and Tessman and to a lesser extent Johnny and the up and comers like Morris. If you assume a healthy Adams takes one of those spots, the competition for a single spot next to him gets pretty heated. It also creates lot of competition for the 10 and right wing spot where we have several options with Pulisic locking in the spot on the left. I'll be curious to watch if that style remains a hallmark of Poch's US team and what happens when we are fully healthy and we have to find a way to make it all fit together.

 

It slipped my mind that Weah will miss the first game due to suspension. That means my initial backup plan suggestion for Richards being unavailable for one reason or another is only applicable to the second game. If he were unavailable for hte first game, I have to replace Weah as well. Obviously more difficult now. A few thoughts off the top of my head: 1) move McKennie wide in place of Weah and put Morris in the middle. or 2) replace Weah with Cowell. 3) put Pulisic on left, Aaronson on right and replace Weah with Vazquez alongside Pepi. 4) I'll think about it.
I edited my original lineup

 

first off, you didn't read my posts. i said start some 10s or actually do the job on transition defense in he mdifeid. i explained how starting the hustling tanks that are musah and weston is not exactly the instant offense the UEFA fanboys think it is. they are sloppy as heck. they are box crashers, not possession guys. almost more forwards than AMs.

but dude, you're unwittingly doing that anyway. it's kind of laughable to think your little tessmann busio musah weston johnny MF is anything but an empty bucket which is a half step from what you're making fun of.

or do you not get the skill sets of the players you're advocating?

they pretty clearly aren't gio reyna in disguise.

and my point is either more gio reyna or more defense.

if you watched the mexico game we couldn't possess or defend in transition. wow, just great!

we were best just outright skipping the MF and playing vazquez difrectly.

ideally, handle both ends. but for now, can we get one end right? we'd start winning more often if this either got a lot more offensive and swashbuckling, or a lot more defensive where no one can score on us.

quit picking fashion choices. pick people to do a job. as i explained, the jobs we have players doing, are at cross purposes with each other. attacking backs, sloppy defensive mids. push the whole team in one or the other direction.

 

I don't know if people remember this, but Tim Weah has also played games at left back.

In fact, according to transfermarkt he's played as many games at left back as he has at right back in club soccer.

That was a stretch of games from January to May 2023 at Lille.

The USMNT's answer to Alphonso Davies? Tim Weah excelling as a left-back for Lille ahead of PSG showdown | Goal.com US

Who was the coach at Lille who played him there? Paulo Fonseca. Now Pulisic/Musah's coach at Milan.

So if Antonee can't go in game 2 for whatever reason, we do have options. Its not like we're devoid of guys on this roster who can play left back.

I know on these boards we always have to stress about something. it just wouldn't be right for us to go into any window feeling confident and happy a roster.

 

ANYONE can play left back. Duh!

 

Pefok hasn't scored for Union since February. He may be getting minutes, but that's not enough.

 

malik tillman has 15 caps and 0G 0A. when he gets a shot with the NT it usually ends up not even close to on cage, more like row Z behind the net.

quit picking fanboy favorites.

grow up.

the idea is not pick all star teams of people with nice stats or on your favorite UEFA teams, it's guys who play well for the US, which he doesn't.

 

I, too, love giving up on players when they're 22 years old.

Especially those who just had a goal and 2 assists against a La Liga team in the Champions League last week. Total bum, throw him out with the trash.

 

No kidding. Pochettino just called Tillman an "unbelievable talent" in an interview.

Mauricio Pochettino knows more about this sport than me. I'm fairly certain of it.