CLS: Quakes still looking for midfield help

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by nivla, Apr 9, 2009.

  1. Brian Glennon

    Brian Glennon Member

    Oct 29, 2008
    Bay Area
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Brazilian leagues are a bit hard to decipher as they have the national leagues in a table of Serie A,B,C.

    Then they have State leagues in a table of Serie A1,A2,A3 and so on.

    FC Mirassol is in Paulista A1, they play only teams from the State of Sao Paolo, in 2008 they were a mid table team in Serie A1 but were no where to be found in 2007, 2006 etc.

    The question then would be how does a Serie A1 team compare to a Serie A, B or C team? If someone has more forst hand knowledge of this odd table system it would be interesting to learn.
     
  2. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The teams in Series A, B, and C, also play in their local state leagues during the first part of each year. So Mirassol plays in Paulista A1, which includes famous clubs like Sao Paolo FC and Corinthians, during the "state league" portion of the year. They finished 8th last year and are right now in 7th place. Last year they also played in Serie C on the national level, but were relegated, which means they are out of a guaranteed spot in the national league system, but they could qualify again depending on how they do in the state league.
     
  3. Brian Glennon

    Brian Glennon Member

    Oct 29, 2008
    Bay Area
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So it sounds pretty safe to say that they are a lower tier team if they were relegated from Serie C to Serie A1

    Yes? :confused:
     
  4. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, they are a lower tier team, but they weren't relegated from C to A1. They were in both at the same time, then got relegated out of C. There are two different league structures played at different times of the year, each with their own promotion/relegation system.
     
  5. Colin McCarthy

    Colin McCarthy New Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, ok, I'll be a little bit different here. If the coaches are satisfied that we have what it takes up top, between Johnson, Weaver, Campos, and Amerikwa (I am not) and are giving up getting a proven goal scorer, then I say go with the Croatian.

    We've given up a lot of goals already this year and I think we are missing Lima's experience and ability to cover a lot of ground. Corrales was outplayed by Joseph in the NE game. We are also kind of small in the back so getting a big d-mid with national team experience on a free transfer would seem to me, barring any injury or head case problems, to be a no brainer.

    And those that know me will tell you and I will admit that yes I am biased in favor of Croatians. I married one.
     
  6. Brian Glennon

    Brian Glennon Member

    Oct 29, 2008
    Bay Area
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hey Cuz, I thought "G" was a Canadian heh? :D

    Honestly, I think we are in trouble and neither one of these guys will help much. Once Jason comes back I think our defense and our spine will be improved greatly, but to me, it doesn't matter much because we've shown once again that our offense is our problem area.

    There had better be back up plans to bring in some proven offensive firepower during the mid season transfer window or it's going to be another long frustrating season..
     
  7. KMJvet

    KMJvet BigSoccer Supporter

    May 26, 2001
    Quake Country
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wierd...thanks for the explanation. So, sounds like cut from a not particularly good team. Seems like a dev player or GA player and not the best use of our roster space.
     
  8. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    I think it's too early to say that the Quakes are going to be hurt by supposed deficiencies at forward this year.

    Soccer fans tend to be reductionist in their analysis, breaking down the team first by back line, midfield, and forward, and then focusing very heavily on individuals. How many of the BigSoccer debates about the game are about relative merits, or lack thereof, of individual players?

    People tend not to talk about how the whole thing works as a system. That's partly about the collection of individuals in the system but also about the way the team plays / strategy. For example, Quakes happen to have a couple of very creative offensive-minded outside mids. As a result the forwards can take more of a holding or poaching role, i.e. there isn't as much pressure for them to be creative.

    RJ and Weaver kinda fit a holding / poaching role. There aren't particularly creative type forwards. But does the thing work as a system - attacking outside mids and holding / poaching type forwards? What I look at is chances. Is the team generating chances? In the first two matches, there were plenty of chances. In the last match, nada. And that was a team effort, not just a forwards problem. So I would say that the "system" worked pretty well the first two matches, but not at all in the third match.

    Then there's the central midfield question. If the Quakes go with Corrales and Elliott in the midfield, they have more of a defensive and a holding central midfield - not a lot of attack. How is that going to jibe with creative outside mids, holding / poaching forwards, and a defense / keeper that tends to try to boot the ball to the holding forwards? To me, the Quakes' ability to score is more the result of these kinds of "whole team" questions, and less about the forwards. All of these guys are good enough to score with good service. And they're young and presumably getting better. It wouldn't surprise me to see one or two or them start to gain confidence with some good service and then start to come into their own.
     
  9. RobsterCraw

    RobsterCraw Member

    Mar 28, 2008
    I'll say what I said in another thread again. I don't think our forwards are our problem particularly. Their finishing was fine when the service was good in game 2. I found that the link up play in the midfield is quite poor. Getting the ball to the forwards' feet in such a way that they can actually get a decent shot at goal is key, and we haven't been doing that. Convey may eventually settle into the number 10 spot, but of all the positions on the field, that is the one that requires a good amount of time to settle and gel with the team. Of course there is the possibility that Convey will not be able to adjust to the position and may wind up being a fairly expensive left-back. Either way, I don't think we need another defensive mid, we have Elliot and Corrales. What we do need is a player with better vision and sharper passing than Convey has shown to be so far. The way we lose the ball in the middle of the pitch is what is getting us killed by counter-attacks, and we can't score because in the final third our passing isn't sharp enough or smart enough to find an opening in the defense. I don't know what our roster option are right now but I wish we had our own midfield maestro to conduct the game and control the pace. Someone who doesn't need two touches to control the ball, who can move play around quickly. I think Yallop thought Convey could do that. If he can't who can we bring in who will? I understand that the quakes were going for the long ball to tall forwards, but that won't always work, and it would be nice to have the versatility to attack differently and the strength to maintain possession.
     
  10. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    Yeah, I think what the Quakes need is a DeRo type playing attacking mid. He's creative and a threat offensively, but he's also a somewhat stout player and a good ball winner, not to mention having a great work rate. So he can win balls, hold them, start attacks, and finish himself as well. Those are the things I really appreciated about him in the a-mid role, and right from the get-go, from the very first game. He was immediately effective. That's why I'm a little skeptical of the idea that Convey would grow into the role. He's been playing for a long time, so I don't know how much his style can change. DeRo's style just happened to fit the position very well.
     
  11. Albany58

    Albany58 Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    Concord, CA USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And, it took a long time before that was realized.
     
  12. RobsterCraw

    RobsterCraw Member

    Mar 28, 2008
    It isn't very common for a wide player to adapt to playing central at the same level of competition. I'm a wide player myself, and I can play forward, and I can play fullback, but I'm like a fish out of water when the game is on all sides of me, its sad. It takes a big step up in awareness to play in the middle of the pitch.
     
  13. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    Well, I think we saw evidence of this today with Convey. We know he can play left mid, and he looks pretty good at left back, and workable at forward as well. He's looks better in all three of these positions than he does in central midfield.
     
  14. KMJvet

    KMJvet BigSoccer Supporter

    May 26, 2001
    Quake Country
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Baustitia could be signed GA and thus cap exempt. We'd have to take our chances on the lottery, but if no one else knows the player, perhaps not much competition. If cap is what worries Yallop with the signing, there is a way around it.
     
  15. ant0n

    ant0n Member+

    Jun 12, 2007
    San Jose, Ca
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Get both. Especially the Brazilian. We lack creativity in the middle.And let go of Cockrane to make cap room.
     

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