Climate, grass and SPEED OF PLAY

Discussion in 'MLS: General' started by nikefan, Nov 14, 2004.

  1. nikefan

    nikefan New Member

    Jul 14, 2003
    RIC
    The best leagues in the world are that way because they are exciting. More specifically, England, Italy, Spain, and germany. There must be a formula, besides fan base and money that make top european leagues far more exciting that our north and south american leagues?. WHY? I'll tell you why.

    Speed of play.

    The way that the ball moves along the playing surface allows for a better all around and more exciting game. When it is hot and humid outside the ball sticks to both the foot and the grass. This makes the whole game change. It is hard to take people on one vs one. Playing first time balls is also more difficult because the weight put on the ball is that much more difficult. When you want to play a ball on the floor first time under such conditions, the ball does not leave your foot with pace, rather it is slowed by the grass. To compensate the player must over strike the ball and if by any chance the ball leaves the ground you more than likely over hit your target.

    When we watch any respectable european match, the ball moves with pace and certainty. Either the grass has been watered by the grounds crew, or the night dew naturally waters the playing surface. In any case the players are forced to play at a high speed, which separates players who know how to play from players who don't.
    Speed up the play and speed up the rate at which MLS will be a first choice league for domestic and foreign players.
    Speed up the play and watch people flood the stands.

    there is obviously a limit though, to explain: Artificial fields like in NJ/NY metros.
     
  2. eejit

    eejit Member

    Jun 10, 2004
    It is not easy to run around in the heat such as in California. Some of the leagues you talk of are not that fast e.g. Spain, Italy.

    England is quite fast but at the expense of technical ability. Also the league suffers from a lack of parity.

    MLS is doing quite nicely IMO except for the need to give more meaning to the regular season. The problem should be reduced next year with the expansion teams but I would like to see 6/12 for the play-offs personally.
     
  3. nikefan

    nikefan New Member

    Jul 14, 2003
    RIC
    I agree with the six of twelve, but how about playing those "hot" games at night, and like most sprinkle the surface with a bit of water before both halves.
    Also when one vs one the little quick movements of the ball which allows creativity is eliminated from the game when grass is high and dry.
     
  4. christhestud

    christhestud Member

    Jun 4, 2004
    It might be nit-picky, but I would not call Serie A entertaining soccer. In fact, the only thing I find uglier than Serie A is watching the Italian nats play. Let's pack it in on defense and send longball after longball!!! Then we'll pretend like we're still the elite soccer force in Europe and talk with such arrogance (like that moron Italian commentator who covered the '02 Cup on ESPN) that no one notices our complete lack of creativity. I would rather watch MLS any day of the week than Italian soccer - I know the players aren't as individually skillful, but it's far more entertaining to me. That's my rant for the day, but if MLS is going to emulate the top European leagues, England/Germany should be the speed/style they emulate. Particularly the EPL, as it is the most entertaining because it's played at a breakneck pace and they still maintain a pretty good level of skill at that speed. Of course, I did watch Arsenal - Tottenham this weekend.
     
  5. nikefan

    nikefan New Member

    Jul 14, 2003
    RIC
    I too hate serie A for the same reasons, but my point wasn't tactical, it was surface of the pitch.
     
  6. fischerw

    fischerw Member+

    Sep 15, 2004
    Joplin, MO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You raise some good points here. But I think the MLS Is already well on its way to addressing a lot of them. First of all, my favorite three letters, SSS. Next year there will be three of them, the next two years there will be, what, three more (Chicago, Colorado, New York, right?). This helps a lot. Sharing with a football team is bound to ruck up the pitch and slow the ball down. Plus there aren't those damn lines, which even if you play on them every home game, have to still be confusing.

    I agree, however, that a little more watering looks like it could stand to be done. And heat is a problem we'll never really get over, since the MLS is an April-November league rather than a late-august - june one.

    By the way, does anyone know the info on the actual grounds crew methods used on MLS pitches versus pitches in England, for example? Like grass types, the lenght they cut it, etc? Because as nice and flat as the HDC looks, it doesn't look like the golf greens they seem to play on in England.

    Finally, does anyone remember what MLS was like back in 1996? I'd say the speed has already gotten far better since back then. I'm confident it will keep getting faster. IMHO. :)
     
  7. Calexico77

    Calexico77 Member

    Sep 19, 2003
    Mid-City LA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not really sure where to begin. . . but. . . . What about when it's raining? It rains constantly during EPL games. Does that help things?

    And I will disagree with you that the Euroleagues are the best because of speed of play. They have considerably faster play because they have the best players, because they have the most money, because they've been doing it for 100+ years.

    I mean really. . .the biggest problem with the MLS is groundskeeping? Mow the lawn and they will come? Something tells me that humid balls are not the reason SJ has attendance problems (insert joke here).

    -adam
     
  8. nikefan

    nikefan New Member

    Jul 14, 2003
    RIC
    compare south american leagues to european, and tell me that there is no difference in the speed of play, and where do most skillful players come from?
     
  9. kingjackdaniel

    Jul 16, 2004
    Dyer, IN
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    there is obviously a limit though, to explain: Artificial fields like in NJ/NY metros.[/QUOTE]

    While we're talking about fields and grass; what was with the diagnal lines through the center at the HDC for MLS Cup? I thought it looked a bit odd. The shadows were a pain in the butt, but can't really do much pertaining to that.
     
  10. GutBomb

    GutBomb Red Card

    Aug 28, 2003
    Outside Boston
    i have seen the grass cut in many different ways at HDC, a checkerboard, lines, a strange circular pattern. i thought maybe the diagonal line was an homage to the sash on the galaxy shirts.
     
  11. IASocFan

    IASocFan Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 13, 2000
    IOWA
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The most notable difference between the Spanish, English, German, and Italian leaues and the rest of the world is money. The top teams in those four leagues have considerably more financial resources and better players than the others. Sometimes you'll have a Porto and Mourinho sneak through, but notice how those two are doing this year. :)
     
  12. Calexico77

    Calexico77 Member

    Sep 19, 2003
    Mid-City LA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In terms of shear numbers? Europe.

    Brazil and Argentina produce a 5-10 stars a generation, but they all leave to go to Europe because of money, not because the pitches are more manicured.
     
  13. ButlerBob

    ButlerBob Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 13, 2001
    Evanston, IL
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Then why do you list England as one of these places. How many games are called because of frozen or water logged pitches. And how often can teams in England play a short passing game between November and Febuary.
     
  14. galperin

    galperin Member

    Feb 1, 2001
    Maineville, OH
    In MLS Cup 2004 at HDC the grass seemed to be too long. I've seen the same thing at most MLS games, with the exception of at RFK.
     
  15. Aljarov

    Aljarov Member

    Sep 14, 2004
    fmnorthamerica.com
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Well, you lived up to your name on that one. They've got to have good technical ability to play at that speed, you've really missed the point.

    MLS is lethargic, not in a sophisticated way, as in Italy for example, but just essentially because it lacks any skills to up the pace. Ball control - both dribbling and touch - are lacking in MLS, can you imagine how bad it would be if they actually ran about a bit?

    I must admit, though, that the last two MLS games (E.C Final and Cup Final) were much more entertaining than the usual fayre, mainly because there was a little urgency to the play. Shame I had to endure a 30 game regualr season before the playoffs started....
     
  16. Iancam03

    Iancam03 BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Aug 8, 2003
    So CAL
    I agree, RFK has an excellent surface and is reflected in an exciting style of play and 4 MLS cups for DC United. HDC was well taken care of the beginning of the season, but since seems to be inconsistent. One week it is long, next week it does not look good. At times this season HDC had the fastest turf I had seen in the world at that time of year. The ball was rolling perfect with pace and no bounces, like a putting green. Still was very acceptable yesterday and a very exciting match.
     

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