Pre-match: Can't believe it took this long for this thread, the 2024 Presidential election thread!

Are other people getting texts urging them to reach out to 3 or 4 friends who haven’t voted? I’ve gotten 3 since dinner.

Also here to post this. They like being lied to. They’re the grinning dipshits behind any bully, vicariously feeling his power.

NEW: In the latest issue of my #OurLand newsletter, I examine a top question about Trumpism: How does Trump get away with so much lying? One answer: His people like the lying.https://t.co/jRpxHzj9J4

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— David Corn (@DavidCornDC) November 3, 2024

 

It has already been pointed out, that Columbus was not allowed to buy down Zelarayan for….. reasons.

 

Clearly this indicates a massive sign shortage, another failure of the Biden economy.

 

More left wing loonies like Glenn Beck and Ted Cruz talking about how ridiculously unqualified he is to be president. This kind of talk is what forces Republicans to vote for the Republican.

Trump supporters. pic.twitter.com/SHpXl6aqoD

— (((Jew))) (@JoshMalina) November 3, 2024

 

Actually, it was Nagbe, which would have allowed to keep Zelarayan.

Anyway, the election…

 

Thank you.

 

But if you look at the regions, you can see it's down in most of the country and only up in the Northeast. How can a national policy be blamed for that behavior?

There was a real massive shift in the crime rate that certainly have nothing to do with incarceration rates. There were so many societal chances from the 1960's to the 1990's it's hard to pin it down, but I'm certain things like a healthier environment, greater equality, and more freedom to produce children that are actually wanted all have a far bigger impact on the amount of crime than prison time. If you want less crime, make a better society. And it's the small government solution too. Prisons are very expensive.

This is the disconnect I mentioned in my first response to you. You seem to think a guy going into a bank with a gun and robbing it for $1000 is a bigger problem than the bank executive stealing $10 million and I don't. To give a Trump example, World Liberty Financial, the crypto-ish project Trump has personally promoted, has sold at least $13 million in tokens. That money is gone. There's no way to redeem or sell the token. The money's in the pockets of the people that run the token and it's not going anywhere. What World Liberty Financial did isn't illegal, but clearly it's deceptive and immoral. The kind of person involved in something like this cares zero for people and only for themselves and there is no debate otherwise.

Trump is likely to go hard on the small-time crooks. He is not going to do anything against large scale ones. The money launderers and the billion dollar scammers are his constituency. It's him. And having a guy running a country that is ok with this is just going to give permission to others that think the same. The SEC has been (very slowly) going after the banks that deal in this world, like Silvergate and Signature. I expect that to stop under Trump. I expect the investigations into crypto crime to stop. I can say that because the people that want those things are pouring an ungodly amount of money into the Trump campaign, and they expect their money's worth.

 

I wasn't speaking to you. Stanger is a conservative -- an actual conservative -- and I was speaking to him about how I cannot wait for us -- him and me -- to go back to the real days of politics when we argued over policy.

You wouldn't know a policy debate if it bit you in the ass.

 

It was the actual quote that I recall. Quick and well-written. If it was yours, props.

 

I did not deny that incomes are up, I did not deny that the S&P 500 is up, and I did not deny that home values are up. Below is taken directly from the post you are quoting (but was left out of your response):

That does not say "incomes stayed the same". It clearly says "incomes did not keep up with inflation", which is a very different (and verifiable) claim. It does not deny that homes and stocks are worth more - it notes that people who do not have significant stock market holdings and do not own homes with significant equity and/or low rates don't get the benefit of that appreciation, and thus can still have significantly reduced buying power in a highly inflationary environment (where their incomes have, again, not kept up with said inflation). The entire focus of my argument is on these people - they are the 3 out of 5 Americans who think the USA is in a recession, even though it is not.

To be very clear about what is happening here (as it is a microcosm for most of this thread): I am saying one thing, and the response is to either (1) to ignore what I said, (2) to claim I said something else entirely, (3) use that something else entirely as a foundation for the claim that I don't understand anything at all or (4) some combination of all the above.

I am NOT saying the things you claim I am saying. I've been very clear about my assertions on this point about the economy. I gave you sourcing, from reliable non-right wing sources on said point. That incomes have NOT kept up with inflation is in evidence. That this inflation hit record levels during the last 4 years is in evidence. Everything I said is in evidence - I gave you the sources. They're right there. Even the term "technical recession", which you imply I just made up here, is widely used by economists and the very same sources you asked me to present to you - that is easily verifiable on the "googly masheen", just put it in and you'll see for yourself (the term "functional recession" is just a colloquialism to describe the dynamic I mentioned above, and I clearly stated that it is NOT an actual recession by definition).

I can't defend assertions I didn't make, which you keep assigning to me. If that is what will happen here then I accept that decision and you're welcome to it, but I can't partake.

I don't know how to talk to any of you either. @Khan is a respectful user who has engaged with me in good faith and whose arguments I have appreciated, and even we seem to talk past each other. It's not malicious, I don't think any of it is intentional, there's just a misunderstanding that is fundamental I think when the gap in where each side is coming from is this large. @luftmensch did a good enough job getting at that general issue earlier (even if we disagree on the details).

I think maybe there is no real dialogue to be had for people this far apart ideologically, and maybe that's unfortunate but needs to be accepted for what it is. I can't blame other people for refusing to accept reality - any refusal to do that is really on me.

 

In case anyone needs to refute this garbage.

 

I don’t even know why folks here are wasting their time with that dude. He is simply parroting the same lies, conspiracies and logical fallacies. To be a trumpet requires a complete suspension of disbelief to a point of embarrassment and this is the perfect illustration.

People like that, with a rotten veneer of intellect , are much worse and more dangerous than the rubes who are part of the cult. They are empty suits, completely devoid of good faith, dignity and integrity.

 

Speaking of complete lack of integrity and being so craven…….Nikki Haley twisting herself into a pretzel is a sight to behold.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/trump-i...ys-nikki-haley-presidential-election-b343f6ab

 

Completely laughable.

Republicans, and Trump, are tough on hooliganism, not on crime.

It's just one more vector to attack "the other."

 

Trump Campaign Memo Admits He Could Lose

“Behind the bluster, former President Trump’s campaign is preparing staff members to wind down the operation while privately acknowledging that Trump could lose Tuesday’s election,” Axios reports.

“It’s unusual for Trump or his campaign to portray anything but rosy scenarios. But an email to staff on Friday offered a clear-eyed view of what could happen in this coin-flip election.”

“Trump himself has been quick to belittle unfavorable polls and has vowed that the only way he could lose is if Democrats cheat. He has laid the groundwork for legal challenges if things don’t go his way.”

 

@soccernutter, good news from your former state.


Wisconsin Democratic party chairman Ben Wikler just said that Milwaukee has broken the record for early voting and that an astounding 13% of them were first time voters. He's on MSNBC now and he sounds very confident.