Can your High Schools blackball referees?

Discussion in 'Referee' started by LawFiveTarHeel, Aug 28, 2012.

  1. LawFiveTarHeel

    LawFiveTarHeel BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2010
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Here in NC I am told that High Schools can blackball up to two referees per season. Just curious to learn, do other state associations give schools this prerogative? And what about other sports? Say HS football with larger crews?
     
  2. NC Soccer United

    NC Soccer United BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jan 25, 2011
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    It all depends on your assignor. If I were your assignor, I would completely disregard that because I am not spending all my time dealing with coaches and AD's on who they want to blackball. It is a real slippery slope that once you slide down, there is no going back.
     
  3. camconcay

    camconcay Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Feb 17, 2011
    Georgia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In GA there is no blackball or number of referees a coach/school can limit (no formal policy) but for every match the schools can submit a report. Our assignor does not see them but the committee does so I would think if there is a valid reason to not send a ref back they would communicate that but I do not know for sure.
     
  4. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    I know that some states have formal policies allowing schools to 'black ball' or 'scratch' officials. We have nothing like that. Having said that, if a school asks the assignor not to send a particular official back there, the request will usually be granted, at least in the more urban areas of the state. In the more rural areas, the assignor may not have a lot of alternatives. In the more urban areas, there are enough games at enough schools that you can still keep a referee plenty busy and never have him go to a particular school.

    I know that I was blackballed at one particular school. A smaller town on the fringe of the Portland area, with one high school struggling to be competitive in a league where they were the smallest school. Almost always last in the league for every sport. Not a school that most referees are willing to serve, both because of the travel and the low quality of play and resulting complaining. I'm doing a league game there, boys' varsity, on a semi-damp night. The ball goes into touch and across the track, between the benches, chased by a player from each team. They get on the track and start to slide. Visiting team player grabs the home team player to keep from falling. Home team player decides that isn't fair and tries to punch him in the face. Awkward position results in a miss. I send off the home team player. As the athletic director escorts us to our cars after the game, he is riding me about what a terrible decision that was, yahda, yahda, yahda. Turns out, the player is his son! The next day, he told the assignor that they didn't want me to go back there again. Oh, I feel so sad that I can not go back to that school! :rolleyes: As several of my friends said when I told them, "How do I get on that list?" Within a year or two, the AD got fired. I don't think the assignor feels constrained from assigning me there now, but, fortunately, I have not had to go back there since. Yeah!
     
  5. espola

    espola Member+

    Feb 12, 2006
    Yes in San Diego area - coaches and/or ADs can request certain referees not be assigned to to their home games. However, they may still show up on the road or in tournament games.
     
  6. aaronriley

    aaronriley Member

    Jul 9, 2011
    I just graduated High School in NC and played at my school for 4 years. The only referee I remember us asking not to have again came after an incident where he called a foul against our player, who apologized and started to get back into his position. The referee, instead of stopping the quick free kick and talking to him sprinted 40 yards while yelling at him. And when the player stopped to talk to the referee, the ref bumped into him and then threatened to send him off for touching the ref. So it wasn't so much a single decision as much as unprofessional conduct.
     
    BlackBart repped this.
  7. nonya

    nonya Member

    Mar 2, 2006
    They may not blackball in GA at the local level, but they certainly do at the state level.
     
  8. SA14mars

    SA14mars Member+

    Jan 3, 2005
    Dallas
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not sure about my current HS chapter but in my old chapter they could. Referees could do the same with other referees too. Unfortunately everyone (coaches and referees alike) blocked one guy who then started complaining at meetings about not getting any games. The board sat down and had a "chat" with him about it. No idea what came of it though because I moved away before the next season.
     
  9. IASocFan

    IASocFan Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 13, 2000
    IOWA
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In Iowa, ADs and coaches have the capability of sending the state and assignors comments on the referees they see. The assignors may take input into account in assigning. We assignors rank games and referees and try to give appropriate coverage where possible.
     
  10. strikerbrian

    strikerbrian Member

    Jul 30, 2010
    Queensbury, NY
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We are allowed to ask that particular refs not do our games but where we are beggars can't be choosers. There just aren't enough refs around to do the games that are available. It's a problem every year.

    The varsity games of course get referees and then JV and then if there are any available the modified games are assigned officials.

    Can't tell you how many times I have seen games officiated by one ref. No linesman just a single guy. Tough assignment.

    Not sure if the girls side of things has the same issue. We have seperate ref associations for the two and I believe there is very little overlap.
     
  11. Wahoos1

    Wahoos1 Member

    Oct 31, 2004
    In our area, a ref can be refused by the AD, although it is wise for them to have a valid reason and discuss it with the assignor or they will be even less happy with the replacements. Post season the coaches submit the names of the 3-4 refs they have "liked" the best. If the assigner is lucky he gets teams that both submit a similar name and they get him/her. If anyone complains... "Hey, you guys both asked for him/her."
     
  12. refmedic

    refmedic Member

    Sep 22, 2008
    The assignor for our HS chapter doesn't put up with it when coaches and/or ADs try to do this, and the coaches know it now and don't even try. Several years back, a coach tried to blackball a referee for sending off his daughter after she punched another girl in the face. The coach went through the AD, the principal, even through to the league. After telling them all to stick it, that referee was assigned to officiate every single one of that team's games, both home and away, for 3 straight weeks. That was the last time I know of that anyone tried to blackball a referee. The point was made, and it appears that everyone else took notice. The assignor now assigns the referees that he wants to the games, whether anyone likes it or not.

    That is not to say that his ears aren't wide open to complaints such as the one above where referees are completely unprofessional or abuse players. The whole "you did something that I don't like so you can't come here anymore" stuff is gone.
     
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  13. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    I love it! An old school assignor. "Coach, obviously this referee needs more experience doing games at your level of play."
     
  14. fairplayforlife

    fairplayforlife Member+

    Mar 23, 2011
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wished I reffed there. We are told that supposedly there is a law saying they get to blackball refs. I believe they quote it as saying 10% of registered officials. For my association that equates to 7 refs per coach. Sadly enough some of our coaches use this to the fullest and it causes issues. Rather than stick it to these coaches and give them some, let's say lesser officials, our assignor will accommodate and this makes his life hell for certain match ups. I will add that most of the time the scratched officials are in our top 10 for rankings.
     
  15. meyers

    meyers Member

    Jun 11, 2003
    W. Mass
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, here in our area, Varsity coaches can blackball X number of refs. (I thought I heard up to 5???). But that's only for regular season games, they may get them in the post season. Ref's aren't told they are blackballed, but if you don't get a certain school...ever, it becomes pretty obvious.
     
  16. Tim Brice

    Tim Brice Member

    Sep 22, 2005
    Little Rock, AR
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The assignor that I worked for in AR allowed each school to blackball one ref per season. One school scratched Matt Forestor, who is now working games in MLS.
     
  17. Paper.St.Soap.Closed

    Jul 29, 2010
    I think that sometimes it makes sense for a school to request not to see a referee and a referee to request not to see a school. What it should not be is leverage to be held over the heads of the referees. I know some people feel that way within the NISOA ranks (on NCAA games) but I have never felt that pressure. If a HS or college coach wants to block me from coming back, whatever, I probably don't want to come back anyways. Sometimes its just better for everyone.

    Our local assignor has an unwritten rule that if a school complains over and over again, they get the worst referees for the season. Not sure that's the best conflict resolution but apparently its effective.
     
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  18. Kit

    Kit Member+

    Aug 30, 1999
    Herkimer, NY, USA
    Club:
    Everton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In my area of New York (Utica), coaches can list up to 5 referees that they don't want to do their games. Most coaches don't even bother. If they do, it's only one or two and referees aren't told. A couple years ago, one coach listed the maximum 5. All 5 were local referees that didn't get paid mileage to do games. Because the school had to have referees from farther away, they had to pay more in mileage and that coach was gone after the season.
     
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  19. kicker1

    kicker1 Member

    Jan 31, 2004
    St. Louis
    in our area (eastern MO) we use Arbiter....so we, the referees, can Block schools we wish to avoid. I'm not sure how coaches/AD's block officials they don't want to do their games....but both coaches are instructed to agree on the referee crew 30 prior to the game.
     
  20. John F.

    John F. New Member

    Jun 30, 2012
    I used to live in a very rural state, and there was such a referee shortage that schools had to take whoever they were sent. Referees, however, could tell the assignors which teams they did not want to officiate.
     
  21. grasskamper

    grasskamper Member

    Feb 22, 2010
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    In Arbiter, can you block specific assignors?
     
  22. Gary V

    Gary V Member+

    Feb 4, 2003
    SE Mich.
    I'm still wondering how that works.

    AD calls assignor: "Mr. Assignor, our game starts in 34 minutes and we've got a referee here that we don't like. Would you please replace him?"

    Assignor: "Sure, give me 3 or 4 hours to round up a replacement and get him there."
     
  23. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    Wouldn't be surprised!

    One Saturday, our high school assignor gets a call. "Ah, I forgot to arrange for referees for our league playoff game." "When is the game?" "Today." "Okay. What time is the game?" "When can they get here?" Yeah, the teams were there warming up before the AD realized that the third team wasn't there. To her credit, the assignor had two referees there within 45 minutes. :D Nothing like great customer service.
     
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  24. Gary V

    Gary V Member+

    Feb 4, 2003
    SE Mich.
    I got a call from a coach one time: "Gary, we don't have a ref - can you do the game so we don't have to reschedule?"

    Me: "What time?"

    Him: "2:00"

    It was already about 2:05. I told him I'd be there as soon as I could. I think we got started 15-20 minutes late. The coach knew me because we were both on the local rec soccer board, and he knew I lived only 1/4 mile from the park.
     
    dadman repped this.
  25. MrRC

    MrRC Member

    Jun 17, 2009
    In my state the schools may block two referees in each different sport. It doesn't matter how many officials are on a typical crew for whatever sport--the block number is just two.
    The block applies to both home and away games for the regular season, but isn't good for the postseason. Also the block must be submitted prior to the season. It cannot be done in mid-season because the coach is upset over a particular game or a particular call. Other than through the blocks, the schools and coaches have ZERO say in the assignments or rating of referees for the regular of postseason.

    I've seen a few occasions in which the blocked referee was assigned to a team's first playoff contest.
     

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