Can Ronald Koeman Lead the Oranje Crush to Victory

Discussion in 'The Netherlands' started by Orange14, Dec 10, 2022.

  1. Given the shit build up= non existence by van Dijk and Gravenberch, it's impossible to give an opinion on the attacking performance of the front line.
     
  2. richsavare

    richsavare Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jan 28, 2003
    New Jersey
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    The lack of proactive running and movement off the ball by the attackers was completely the cause of not getting enough link play.
    Xavi on Right tucks in and constantly checks for the ball while Zirkzee was pretty much useless with his movement so.
    Gakpo was wide and came inside with some early links with Van de Ven, but there was no flow and overall lacking.
    Again I blame Zirkzee who had low energy.
    Pitiful performance tonight.
     
  3. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Average performance. 6/10 for me
     
  4. wilson00

    wilson00 Member+

    Oct 14, 2015
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I think the inverted wing system will suit zirkzee allowing him to play in the hole. If you look back at bologna that’s how motta used him orsolini and Ndoye used to terrorize the flanks Stretching defenders and creating space in the middle for zirzkee to lurk in and around. Unfortunately in NT this is not a feature.

    I have said this before gakpo is one trick pony and always cuts into traffic and again this was a highlight in this game given how compact the Hungarian played and easily closed him off when ever he tried cutting inside. Zirzkee was basically getting sandwiched in the heavy traffic. Dumfries did put in some good through balls and this is where zirkzee’s poor anticipation came under spotlight. I think one on the low cross and the other over the head which missed Reijnders and zirkzee standing behind him stood ball watching. Looked lethargic as somebody said.

    if he doesn’t take his chances very soon he will find himself gone with the wind

    let’s see how the team copes without Van dijk.this is what I was earlier referring to the impact on the team when there is injuries or in Van dijks case non availability.
     
  5. wilson00

    wilson00 Member+

    Oct 14, 2015
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I was also surprised with Til substitution. Again koeman trying to prove critics wrong and justifying his selection but if you think about it kluivert plays 10 at Bournemouth and he would have been a more impact player.
     
    richsavare and Brilliant Oranje repped this.
  6. richsavare

    richsavare Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jan 28, 2003
    New Jersey
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Due to Virgil Suspension Van de Ven should play his normal LCB vs Germany.
    Hato will likely get the nod at LB having been given some mop up time last night.
    Regarding Zirkzee his False 9 or in the hole 10 play was anonymous after a promising showing against Bosnia.
    There was very little movement from everyone with not enough runners and almost no combination play.
    Playing a False 9, or in the hole 10 which is Zirkzee’s game won’t function well against these defensive tactics especially with our lacking movement last night.
    Hungarian low block was not penetrated enough and our pathetically slow buildup was frustrating to watch.
    If I was Koeman I’m shouting from the first minute to get our boys out of their fog.
    Let it be said all of the Hungarian fouling was ridiculous, and I hate to suggest this but you wonder if Oranje were worried about getting hurt?
    Whenever we showed some quick skill or run at them we were generally getting hacked down.
     
    gabrielguilarte repped this.
  7. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  8. richsavare

    richsavare Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jan 28, 2003
    New Jersey
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    #1008 richsavare, Oct 12, 2024
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2024
    They mentioned that on the broadcast yesterday.
    Going down memory lane here I recall watching that match In Spanish on a Saturday via taped delay from earlier in the week which was nearly 40 years ago, and it was our first World Cup 1986 Qualifier at Home losing 1-2.
    Wim Kieft scoring to put us up 1Nil.
    We wound up finishing second behind Hungary and going to the Play-Offs which of course we blew late in the Second leg home match vs Belgium thanks to a very late Georges Grun goal.
    INCREDIBLE PAIN
     
  9. 42715


    Injury list of Germany:
    Nagelsmann, who already had to miss Marc-André ter Stegen, Jamal Musiala, Niclas Füllkrug and Kai Havertz, Benjamin Henrichs, David Raum and Robin Koch and just before the kick-off of the Nations League match in Bosnia, Aleksandar Pavlovic also joined them. The Bayern Munich midfielder was supposed to make his debut in the starting line-up, but was dropped in the warm-up.
     
    Brilliant Oranje repped this.
  10. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Now is the time to beat them. No excuses!!
     
  11. Uhm....
    upload_2024-10-13_1-21-1.png
    If they play this set up and Koeman plays Hato against Wirtz, we're gonna lose big time.
    Hato gets beaten at Eredivisie level one on one duals far too often. Making him do that facing Wirtz is suicide.
    Dumfries against Undav will be challenging too and I don't see much attacking contribution from Denzel in this match.
    Thankfully 100% accuracy sideway passer van Dijk is absent, so a CD with a long pass can deliver it to for instance Brobbey if Cowman dumps Zirkzee. I've no clue about the long range passing quality of vdVen.
     
  12. wilson00

    wilson00 Member+

    Oct 14, 2015
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Very well said and the faster ten hag gets sacked from MU the better for NT. So that he can take over from koeman.
     
  13. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    We shall see
     
  14. Kelvin Cheung

    Kelvin Cheung Member

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    May 13, 2019
    #1015 Kelvin Cheung, Oct 13, 2024
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2024
    I could only see how bad Virgil organized the defence for the 1st goal conceded. He lost his man he supposed to mark and Micky had to cover that man and thus left the Hungarian striker behind him exposed. Coupled his mistakes in the previous matches, I started to question my faith in him as a regular starting as to whether he is still that solid and reliable.

    I was a bit disappointed by Quienten as he was playing way too conservatively. He needed to pass forward instead of sidewards. Wth the very disciplined organization of and marking of the entire Hungarian team in this match, you needed to take risk in order to break down their balanced structure. Possession alone did not create any worth. As Frenkie is not yet ready, I look forward to Ryan to dribble forward which in my opinion has been a main threat to cause the opponents errors and fouls to our advantage.
     
  15. 43107


    When you read my remarks concerning VvD the last two years I've been right out demanding him being dumped on the bench for his shit performances.
    This highlighted part was due to Hungary having 3 men more than the Orange Squad in the Hungarian half of the pitch.
    Because Vvd kept on playing the ball sideways or back to the keeper or to back passing Gravenberg, the 3 Hungarian attackers were the extra defenders to block the midfield as VvD, MvdV and SdV stayed on our part of the pitch..
    Only de Vrij occasionally tried a longer ball.
    What Koeman lacked for intervention after 20 minutes of 100% accurate sideway passing was to order (something VvD should have grasped himself anyway, but iirc van Basten called him out several months ago for lacking that capability) them to penetrate WITH the ball into the Hungaryan half, which would have the 3 Hungaryan attackers and the midfielders to make a choice to remain covering their Orange player (which would result in for instance van Dijk/vd Ven or de Vrij move up into a dangerous position close to the 16 meter box) or to attack the man in possession, which would release Orange midfielders or even attackers for being free to receive the ball passed.
    Neither Koeman, nor VvD did anything of that sort until the break whistle.:rolleyes:
     
  16. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  17. I rather not read anything about players transfers to Barca, as it depends on whatever room they have in their thight financial situation, so most of it is just noise, interfering with real info.
    So preferred MO is to report an actual transfer.
     
    Orange14 repped this.
  18. wilson00

    wilson00 Member+

    Oct 14, 2015
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    #1019 wilson00, Oct 14, 2024
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2024
    Koeman is a rotten potato. He was asked quote:
    Ronald Koeman gets a painful Ian Maatsen question
    Maatsen remained on the bench again against Hungary (1-1) and is therefore still waiting for his orange debut. At the press conference in Germany, Driessen said: “Maatsen has been there for a long time now, sometimes you call him up later. But you don't see it in him, it seems."

    Koeman refutes that reading. “Well, if I didn't like Ian, I wouldn't select him.” The journalist from De Telegraaf has his own opinion. “No, but you haven't given him a minute yet. You often gave other debutants minutes.”

    The national coach attributes this to 'the course of matches and choices'. “But I will think about it tomorrow,” said Koeman. Micky van de Ven will almost certainly play centrally against Germany, allowing Jorrel Hato or Maatsen to start as left back."
    Clearly he is under pressure now and I won't be surprised he gets a late cameo only and for the sake of it given now it come under spotlight.

    His reponse , it's due to the course of matches and choices is so amateurish and stinky. Hato is neither offensively or defensively good but gets the nod before him based on what. Absolutely nothing.

    If this continues, you just have feel pittyful about dutch football and the boat they are in. They will never win anything and will just be big mouthing about their legacy which has long being done and dusted.

    You can just tell they prefer Hato to jump ahead of him regardless of who has a better ceiling and playing better/ form. O heavenly father when will this madness end
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    According to AD.nl these will be the lineups.
    Gald too see Brobbey start, lets see what he can do

    Duitsland: Baumann; Kimmich, Rüdiger, Tah, Mittelstädt; Stiller, Pavlovic, Gnabry, Wirtz, Undav; Kleindienst

    Nederland:
    Verbruggen; Dumfries, De Vrij, Van de Ven, Hato; Reijnders, Gravenberch, Timber; Simons, Brobbey, Gakpo
     
    gabrielguilarte repped this.
  20. 43348


    We're stuck with this tactically inept coach until after the WC 2026, maybe sooner if he fails to qualify.
    So your wish for ten Hag being sacked to replace him isnot going to materialize.
    Koeman only changes course if confronted with consequences of his bad choices and then still he's stubborn as a proverbial donkey.
    If he plays Hato, my guess is the Germans are aware of his inability to defend one on one against a tricky attacker. This goes down to Hato's personal qualities, not because of being part of a shaky Ajax defense.
    So if we're unlucky, we might get a de Ligt against Czechs performance from him.
     
  21. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Ajax defense under Farioli is NOT shaky.
     
    Brilliant Oranje repped this.
  22. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    You realize Ajax have given up the least amount of goals so far this year in Eredivisie, right??
    So please explain where you get the idea our D is shaky

    Standings: https://www.flashscore.com/football/netherlands/eredivisie/standings/#/KCMrEcSo/table/overall
     
  23. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  24. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Correction: Hato at LB
     

Share This Page