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Discussion in 'MLS: Rumors' started by Koz, Apr 17, 2006.
Yes or no?
well it depends on ......................................
................. ehh maybe
i can see it up to par with the mexican league, in ten years
Define top? Top 5? No. Top 10? maybe
Right now, my "top" leagues:
1) La liga
3) Serie A
5) Dutch League
6) French League
The rest of the top ten might include South American and Central American (Mexican) leagues, the lower division European leagues (The British League right below the Premiership is great because the teams compete to be promoted to the premiership) and even the Turkish league. Some of the African leagues fly under the radar but are highly competitive, and thats where a lot of the players like Eto'o, Okocha, etc who move on to European leagues get discovered.
Right now I would put MLS somewhere between 10-15 in the soccer world. The major hindrance to MLS is simply the popularity of the sport in America. Common sense, if a sport is popular, there is more of an interest in the league, which attracts more skillful player. To break into the top ten in 15 years is possible, but the top five, probably not anytime soon. MLS is very exciting this season, and if it can aim to reach the popularity of say...the NHL in America (a pretty high goal, but not out of the question), the league is in good shape.
Measured how? Attendance? Revenue? Viewership?
Oh, you mean quality of play. It doesn't matter how good the play gets, American Eurosnobs will always shit on MLS.
From figures I've seen, MLS is already 12th in the world in terms of attendance. It's probably in the top 10 in terms of revenue and viewership. That's not always a good indication of "quality", but it's one measurement of "top".
According to Wikipedia's section on soccer attendance, here are the approximate avg league numbers, from 2004-05:
1. Bundesliga (37k)
2. EPL (33k)
3. La Liga (28k)
4. Serie A (25k)
5. Ligue 1 (21k)
6. J-League (19k)
7. Coca Cola Championship (17k)
8. Turkey Premier Super League (16k)
9. Dutch Eredivisie (16k)
10. Scottish Premier League (15k)
11. MLS (15k)
12. Bundesliga 2 (13k)
I'm sure you could make the argument in most of these leagues that one or two super clubs skew the averages upward, ie Man U in the EPL, Ajax and PSV in The Netherlands and Celtic and Rangers in the SPL. MLS would probably be one of the more even leagues in terms of table-wide attendance.
The Japanese numbers surprise me for a league only a few years older than MLS. Impressive.
i think mls might be a few places down because the MFL, argentinian league, and iran league were not included and i think they might beat mls.
I'm surprised that neither the Argenine nor Brazilian leagues don't make this list. Although I have watched quite a few games from Argentina and the stadiums are virtually empty. Odd for a football-passionate nation. I think that MLS will definitely grow as a top league but the salary cap thing is going to have to change if the league wants to attract top names before the moce to MLS just before they retire.
I think it can reach the level of top league or considered one of the top leagues in the Americas by then..considered equal with Mexico, Argentina and Brazil.
I think it can reach or eceed the level of leagues in the european continent (the smaller ones)
But not the big 5 of europe...we just cannot finacially compete with them unles the sport here reached critical mass i dont see that happeneing short of a massive pop culture revolution.
I think it can reach a very respectable status in 10-15 years but not elite status.
The quality of play won't improve until the I/O's get serious and open up their wallets and pay serious money to decent players. In overall skill, MLS players are average, at best. A lot of speed, but not much else. I'm stationed in Germany at the moment and i watch the MLS game of the week on Sunday mornings. I can't get over the number of bad crosses and passes I see in every game. Plus, players lose the ball too easily and a number of goals are cheap. Maybe I've gotten spoiled living here; watching La Liga, Serie A and EPL games, but one can't help but notice the large gap in the quality of play between the leagues here and MLS. Oh, btw: I'm no Eurosnob. I follow the Earthquakes/Dynamo and I was a season tix holder with DCU before uncle Sam sent me out here.
In terms of quality of play i doubt it will ever be up there wiyth the EPL,La Liga,ect,ect because everytime a good young american player comes up through MLS they always wanna leave to go to theese other top leagues in europe because there the best quality of play. Its like a catch 22 situation, if they stayed in MLS this league would get better so then they would'nt have to leave for another top league but right now MLS isnt one of the best in the world so they all leave meaning it never will be a top league. I think a good example of this is Brazil. If you look at brazil in world cups there amazing they have won more than any other team quite easily, but how many of the brazilian players at the world cup in a couple of weeks are gonna be plying there trade in the brazilian league? I dont know the exact number but you know it aint gonna be many yet there the big favourites to win the whold damn thing, this is because they all left for spain and germany and france and england/
Good point. People seem to forget teams in England can lose money out of their ass.
of course there was that report discussed a week of so ago that suggested MLS crowd numbers were hugely inflated, by anything up to 35%. Now a lot of those above are also tickets sold rather than actual attendance, but the number of promotional tickets given away is almost certainly far less.
Revenue, on its own, isn't a particularly useful measure of anything. Because of high ticket prices, lower division clubs in england rake in far more than many top division clubs across europe, but hardly makes them better leagues.
Standard of play is a far better measure, but one that because of the lack of meaningful competitive games will have to be judged on a purely aesthetic basis. On that score I'd certainly give the average MLS team the edge over the average CCC team, but then again nobody regards the CCC as a top league.
but if you are to have a good league, the key is probably home grown players, not expensive imports. If you go down the import route, without a strong supporting cast of american players, then if money gets tight you'll having nothing to fall back on, and the league would all but collapse.
I think many Bigsoccer posters still aren't quite familiar with the J-League's structure and history, and that's ok.
Anyway, MANY of the current J-League clubs were around for decades before the J-League even launched. Japan had a professional league beforehand and a lot of the current J-League clubs played in that league. For instance, Urawa Reds used to be called Mitsubishi Reds. And the team was made up solely of Mitsubishi employees.
Every single inaugural MLS team was created totally from scratch, whereas a lot of Japanese clubs like Urawa that were still around, were simply moved up to the new J-League. That makes quite a bit of difference in terms of club history as well as established fan bases.
A lot of people like to compare the J-League to MLS, but you can't. Completely different infrastructure, business plan, and history.
In Brazil we have 12 "great" teams, and some 6-7 mid-power teams.
It's the most difficult league in the world, in 35 years the record of winning is 5 times (totally different from European leagues).
All televisioned games are top scored in the audience, something like 40-90% of "TV share".
The strenght of uor league is Same cities rivalries, Like Flamengo-Vasco da Gama, Corinthians-Palmeiras, Grêmio-Internacional, Cruzeiro-Atlético/MG these games are teh soul of the league.
if you don't have a big rivalry will not have a big league.
Higher revenue usually leads to better players and a better standard of play. Regularly watching both leagues I would say that most Championship teams are far superior to most MLS teams. This is paticulary true of the newly relegated clubs and some of the larger traditional clubs (Leeds, Southhampton, Derby, Norwich, Sunderland, Birmingham, Palace).
However, newly promoted clubs (Colchester, Southend) may be level with average MLS teams in terms of attendance and quality of play.
Thats just in line with a discussion we were having last night, that MLS is at the low Coca Cola, high 1st div level. Those big Championship teams would eat MLS alive right now.
I myself would be happy if in ten years MLS would be at the level of the Coca-Cola Championship, but they have a ways to go.
And if we can develop into a feeder league, and see more yanks in the EPL, Bundesliga, etc..I would be perfectly happy.
It may be my own nationalism, but as a nation of 300 million, I think we have way more "potential" soccer talent, and I don't want our players all throughout Europe if we can help it. That will not satisfy me. All of our other major leagues are the best in world, while it may not be realistic at this point to say soccer should be also, I think we can shoot to among the best 5 or 6 leagues in 15-20 years.
If you can make 30 or 40 millions of people really care about soccer in USA, you can make an league with level of euro top 4.
k, MLS is probably already in the top 10.
7.Serie B (Juventus lol)
8. MLS ?
like really think about it MLS teams have played teams from mexico and won
DC played REal Madrid and tied, the All Star team tied the best team in the World in Chelsea, and whats this about Coca Cola Championship, that is the worst soccer ive watched out of all the leagues in the list above
All depend on what constitutes the top leagues in the world imo.
Portugal, Brazil, Japan, Argentina, Colombia and maybe Korea are better than MLS, in quality of players and in tv audience.
the money of teams are bigger in this countries too.
Yes! And I would suggest that the United States is the ONLY country in the world that has the potential to host a league that could challenge the big five Euro leagues. Because we have the wealth, population, and most importantly, the cultural diversity to attract the top players from around the world. But that's a long way off.
In the near term the best that MLS can hope for is to become THE destination league for players in this hemisphere. To be able to compete for National Team players from any country other than Brasil and Argentina. And to be able to attract solid club professionals from those countries.
MLS is pretty close to being able to afford that type of player. A $500,000 per year salary will attract a lot of South and Central Americans. So if MLS clubs had a salary budget of $5 million, they could compete. But many of those players will not make the move until MLS clubs are integrated into competitions such as the Copa Libertadores.
MLS isn't better than the MFL. It's not close either. Brazil and Argentina are better than MLS. Also the Serie A league is better than Bundesliga and Serie B, who even with Juventus, shouldn't be near the top 10. Your list is garbage.
The MLS will not get better in 10-15 yrs. its to soon and it does not matter if they pay the players more because their is plenty of middle eastern teams that have the money to get the top players but they dont get them because top players what to play for teams ware they will become legends and teams that have history. Also the MLS will not go into the top 5 until their clubs play in the Champions league which is far from happening.