BVB 2011-2012 General Discussion Thread [R]

Discussion in 'Borussia Dortmund' started by footyfan1, Jun 21, 2011.

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How Will Borussia Dortmund Fare In The Upcoming 2011/2012 Bundesliga Season?

Poll closed Aug 5, 2011.
  1. BVB Will Repeat As Bundesliga Champions

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  2. BVB Will Finish In One Of Bundesliga's CL Places (2nd, 3rd or 4th)

    0 vote(s)
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  3. BVB Will Finish In A Europa League Spot (5th or 6th)

    0 vote(s)
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  4. BVB Will Finish Between 7th & 10th

    0 vote(s)
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  5. BVB Will Finish Between 11th & 15th

    0 vote(s)
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  6. BVB Will Wind Up In The Relegation Playoff (16th)

    0 vote(s)
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  7. BVB Will Be Relegated (17th or 18th)

    0 vote(s)
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  8. I Don't Know How BVB Will Do, I Just Want The New Season To Get Here!

    0 vote(s)
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  1. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

    Aug 14, 2005
    Waimoana
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    That will totally depend on Kagawa and his decision to sign a new contract or not. If not, Reus will play on his position because Kagawa will be sold.
     
  2. Saku²

    Saku² Member+

    Aug 22, 2009
    Club:
    FC Salzburg
    yeah yeah no doubt about that. I was just answering about the posts talking about Kagawa being dropped or him being nothing without Dortmund (what a stupid and egocentric thing to say ...).
    I hope he keeps on here and creates a legacy.
     
  3. HarveyDent

    HarveyDent Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think anyone said he is nothing without Dortmund. I saw one post where it was said he owes who he is to Dortmund. That may be debatable but is at least worth thought. The part about being dropped, if you don't think it is down to him or Grosskreutz to make room for Reus, I don't know what to tell you. Reus did not sign for BvB to be a sub.

    And I don't think anyone here dislikes Kagawa. Everyone realizes what he means to the club and how he has helped get them to where they are. But, if Sahin has taught us anything it is that no one is indispensable.
     
  4. Saku²

    Saku² Member+

    Aug 22, 2009
    Club:
    FC Salzburg
    Never said someone did and actually it is not a problem, you are free to dislike anyone, I'm not here to argue about personal tastes.

    I read a comparison with Sahin which contained this sentence :
    Which is very close to "he wouldn't be who he is without Dortmund". You will agree. And this is wrong, Kagawa played good and similar football before and I don't think that is debatable at all. The only thing different is that he plays in Europe and so gets more recognition.

    Not sure it's a good thing to disturb the current order of the team just to make space for a new player. I hope this'll be a fair battle where price tag and nationality don't count but I don't really doubt it as Klopp is a great manager.
     
  5. HarveyDent

    HarveyDent Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I think you are right about the fact that what Dortmund really did for Kagawa was to enhance his recognition. That is why some people here will not be surprised at all if he is sold in the summer. He seems the most likely to be willing/ready to move on for his ambition, though if Dortmund were to win the bundesliga again that could be a moot point.

    As far as who gets dropped for Reus next year it probably depends on what sort of side Klopp wants for a certain game. I do believe, however, that Reus will start more often than not next season. The rest will ultimately depend on who is still at the club and who is in form.
     
  6. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think Kagawa's recognition has a lot to do with what Dortmund did last season as a team of young guns. Had BvB placed 8th or worse last season nobody would really give a shit about him. However, it was his impressive play in the 1st half of the season last season that played a nice role in putting BvB and most of the squad on the map and crowning them champs of the BL.
     
  7. Saku²

    Saku² Member+

    Aug 22, 2009
    Club:
    FC Salzburg
    Cris 09 > I don't really see the point you're trying to make.
     
  8. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    If BvB played like shit last year, no one would know who Kagawa was...
     
  9. Saku²

    Saku² Member+

    Aug 22, 2009
    Club:
    FC Salzburg
    But because Kagawa did play good the team had a great year so I don't really see why you have to mention it. Good players make good teams.
     
  10. Aztattooedsean777

    Aztattooedsean777 Tattooed Football Fanatic

    Liverpool FC
    Netherlands
    Feb 15, 2009
    Chandler, Arizona
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands

    Kagawa was one of many players who played well last year. Don't make it sound like Kagawa carried the club on his shoulders. That is what made the club work so well, every one did their share.


    That said, Kagawa was seen by many more people due to Dortmund being near the top of the table rather than just playing mediocre mid table football.
     
  11. Saku²

    Saku² Member+

    Aug 22, 2009
    Club:
    FC Salzburg
    That's why he wrote good players actually. I really don't see the point in wondering what would have been if those guys, including Kagawa, were average since they were not.
     
  12. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    And I mentioned that in my initial post too.
     
  13. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Thank you...he received a lot more exposure than he could have ever dreamed of because he was a part of that team. Oddly enough, when he went injured for 4 months - we were able to continue, for the most part, with that explosive form.
     
  14. tako

    tako Member

    Dec 11, 2003
    Yokohama
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    I don't say that it was only due to Kagawa's injury, still there was defference.

    First half of 2010-2011 season , Dortmund scored 39 goals and got 43 points.
    Latter half of 2010-2011 season, Dortmund scored 28 goals and got 32 points while Bayern got 36 points and Leverkusen got 35 points.

    Kagawa is lucky for playing under Klopp and for Dortmund, but it is same for any other attacking players.
     
  15. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Those numbers don't tell the entire story.

    BVB also "let up" with a bit more than a month to go in the season.

    All this talk is bullshit. We've become a very good team and Shinji Kagawa is an important part of it.

    Would we have done it without him? Yes, I think so, but it also might have taken a year longer.

    Whether Kagawa chooses to stay or go, he will have my appreciation for being a part of our resurgence.

    But this could have been done without him too. The team more than proved that in the second half of last season.

    And we also managed to win when Kagawa was crap for much of the current season up until a few match days ago.
     
  16. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    I noticed Schmelzers has gotten better throughout this season, looks to finally be completely comfortable as a fullback. Anyone else notice this?
     
  17. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Well, he started out badly this season. I believe because of injuries.

    However, he's really simply gotten back to previous form.

    He hasn't really improved on that form overall from what I've seen.

    I never thought he would not get back to this point.

    Still, it is good to see.
     
  18. RMCFkevin

    RMCFkevin Member+

    Nov 20, 2008
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
  19. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    It is true. However saying it "saved us from bankruptcy" is a bit strong.

    We would have gotten that money from somewhere else. It would have just cost us more interest.

    Did Bayern help us tremendously? YES!

    No doubt about that.

    However, they got their appreciation and their money back in full.

    The bigger question is: "What was Hoeness' purpose for bringing this up now??

    As far as I can see purpose-wise, the answer is "nothing" except to stroke his bruised ego because of events of the past season and a half....... :rolleyes:

    As far as I'm concerned, the best thing Uli Hoeness and Bayern have ever done for us is be dumb enough to sell us Mats Hummels! ;) :cool:
     
  20. HarveyDent

    HarveyDent Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I remember when he was on loan thinking there was no way Bayern would outright sell him to BvB.
     
  21. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    I never thought Bayern would do it myself.

    Not until they bought Breno.

    When they did that, I thought to myself, "Stupid, stupid, Bayern."


    I had no idea Hummels would be this good.

    However, I did figure Breno was all hype and would never be as good as Hummels.
     
  22. HarveyDent

    HarveyDent Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bayern bought into the hype themselves and didn't realize what they had. Even without thinking he would become as good as he has, it was just silly for them to spend that money for no real reason when they already had Hummels.

    I'm just glad the rumors about a hidden buyback were false.
     
  23. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

    Aug 14, 2005
    Waimoana
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I thought the same :cool:
     
  24. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Bayern didn't simply buy into the hype. They were convinced by their former player and now former South American scout Giovane Elber. He was the one who apparently bought into the hype.

    I think Elber let his Brazilan pride cloud his judgement.

    Just the few times I got copies of Breno's matches, I could see that he was all hype.

    Bayern paid 12M for Breno. I believe that's about 1.2M more than we paid for Hummels, Subotic and Santana combined.



    If you mean on the original Hummels deal, those rumors were not false. BVB lied and said they were. As part of Hummels' agreement to extend, that clause was bought out by BVB. BVB admitted that.
     
  25. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    It is the same kind of form that got him playing in the NT for a while. I am full of hope for him, he's young, strong and very spirited. If he maintains his form he'll be a contender for the euro for sure.
     

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