Brenden Aaronson at Leeds

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by ShaftBrewer, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Wolves are relegated and they know that, but Edwards has got them showing fight over the last few matches. They've become hard(er) to beat and there's some intelligent play emerging as well. 2025-26 is about laying the foundations for a promotion push next season, maybe with a side of giving the likes of Brun-Larsen an auction platform. They're in "win the second half", playing for pride territory. That's always been a potent combination in football.

    Nuno has improved West Ham but the squad is ridiculously unbalanced and, Jarrod Bowen apart, critically lacking in leadership. Their mathematical chance of overhauling Forest at least means they have to attack - and win - both Wolves games. Wolves will set themselves up to be compact, play their own game and let the pressure get to the Hammers.

    Advantage Wolverhampton. Significant advantage IMO
     
  2. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Yeah - we had a friends stateside. He was a United fan from Manchester, she was a Yorkshire lass. Sweetest couple around - except when ManU played Leeds.

    But all that said, most everyone at Leeds would trade 2x ManU for 2x Wolves right now without blinking an eye.
     
  3. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    That's what gives it the real animosity. Even back in mid 80s Boston, blue collar people knew about Man U in the same way that Irish guys knew who the New York Yankees were. The better-informed had heard of Liverpool but that's about it. Leeds, like everyone else, were "yeah, that's a big town so I guess they have a soccer team. Are they any good?"

    Now, imagine having to put up with that, in England, from other English football fans.

    I used to joke that Leeds were the Russia of English football. Perennial also-rans who had a (very serious) golden era but never established themselves at the top table before fading into irrelevance and are embittered and enraged about it.

    Used to joke . . .
     
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  4. felloveranddidanadu

    Plymouth Argyle FC
    Dec 12, 2009
    Club:
    San Jose Frogs
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Jerrod Bowen is the worst captain I have seen at a professional level. He's done nothing to lead, nor lift his teammates, nor console them, nor defend them in various moments. The fact that he's captain shows that either the squad is pathologically allergic to leadership, or Nuno is merely picking the biggest English name he has. To go from the likes of Scott Parker and Mark Noble to Bowen is quite the drop.

    The squad has the talent and pedigree to do well, but they're stuck in this turmoil that they can't get out of. As you say, they're improving, but so too are the teams around them. I think Leeds are safe. I think West Ham is f-ed.
     
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  5. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    #5255 The Irish Rover, Dec 29, 2025
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2025
    Noble was eligible for Ireland and received numerous approaches, at least until he nixed the idea by stating that he felt thoroughly English and doubted his ability to give Ireland his all, before adding
    "for me to turn up to play for Ireland without it having been a dream of mine, and there's an Irish kid out there who might miss out when it's their dream to play for Ireland, I couldn’t do that.”
    Noble by name. Noble by nature.
     
  6. 6 ft. Leprechaun

    Dec 9, 2003
    Baltimore, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  7. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Bowen misses the long list of prerequisites for being a leader you've given, and a few more besides, but by being the one player who will "rage, rage against the dying of the EPL light" he shows (some) leadership by example.

    A pretty low bar, I'll admit but it's West Ham. TBH I expect them to finish below Burnley who are 2-3 decent players short of the quality needed to stay up but show plenty of character and no lack of organization. West Ham have (some) individual quality, no character and only some organization.

    As you say, fcuked
     
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  8. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    #5258 The Irish Rover, Dec 29, 2025
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2025
    The Old Firm has its basis in the Irish-British enmity that goes back, well, a little while . . . o_O and Real-Barca has a similar nationality-based dynamic but medieval rivalries rearing their heads in modern footy is not uncommon.

    Mackems and Geordies will tell you that the Newcastle-Sunderland rivalry dates back to the English Civil War, when Newcastle was royalist and Sunderland went with the roundheads, before both switched sides in the Jacobite-Hannoverian struggle of the early 1700s.

    Bologna has fierce rivalries with Fiorentina, Parma and Modena but the fans will tell you that there's an extra edge with little old Modena, with Bologna having been fiercely Guelph and Modena implacably ghibelline while the other two were mostly ghibelline but could switch sides. Almost nobody has ever worked our what that was about but they do know that it's very important to their grandfathers, who remember how important to their grandfathers, who remembered . . . :rolleyes:

    @usnroach would know more about Italian rivalries than I do, but he'd be the first to tell you that hatred is the most criminally underrated joy of being a football fan. The more irrationally ancestral, the merrier :cool:
     
  9. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So the Boston New York thing goes back to New York being a Tory stronghold in the Revolution?
    I mean,maybe...
     
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  10. usnroach

    usnroach Member+

    Jul 5, 2009
    SoCal
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not italian or italian-american for that matter, so a lot of those ancestral/geographical/cultural rivalries within Italy are lost on me. Your callout for some of the tuscan clubs was news to me, so thanks! I only know Juventus like that. I'm sure there might be some stuff in the Piemonte region that could get more nuanced, but because of the support country-wide those types of rivalries don't really exist with Juve. We just reserve all of our hate for Toro and inter. It's one way hate for the provinciales like Roma, Fiore, and Napoli.

    Thanks for the call-out though!

    break break
    Keep up the great work BA!
     
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  11. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nate Jaqua became an ultra runner after he retired. Aaronson should consider it.
     
  12. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    I'd bet he's one of those guys who likes to be competing for something and pushing his limits, but with his maximum salary (in the final 2 seasons of his career) was $211k, I'd say he may also have needed the money :(
     
  13. olephill2

    olephill2 Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Club:
    Watford FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Really interesting metrics for Brenden Aaronson this season, per fbref. He's in the 80% percentile for assists among attacking midfielders and wingers in the top-5 leagues. That's quite good and surprising, albeit the sample size is small (1000 minutes). Less surprisingly, he's elite among players in his position in all of the defensive metrics.

    Now that said, his main negatives according to the metrics are:
    • Not a goal-scoring threat
    • Low usage rate -- this has been a persistent issue with Aaronson dating back to his Philly days, as first written about by Matt Doyle back in the day.
    https://fbref.com/en/players/5bc43860/Brenden-Aaronson
    upload_2025-12-29_13-45-54.png
     
  14. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    What does "low usage rate" mean??
     
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  15. olephill2

    olephill2 Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Club:
    Watford FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    May have been a term Matt Doyle invented, but here's where he talked about it in 2020: https://www.mlssoccer.com/news/armc...ould-follow-trail-blazed-alphonso-davies-tyle

    Here's a quick AI summary from Gemini:

    When you look at Aaronson's fbref metrics I shared above, the low shot-creating actions, touches, passing, and progressive carries metrics would suggest he's not getting on the ball enough for an attacking midfielder/winger. And that when he does, he's generally not being aggressive enough at moving the ball forward and taking players on.
     
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  16. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Doesn't track the player we've seem in the last few weeks. He's been quite good on the ball in terms of progressing it and getting the ball into the box.

    The not being so good at taking players on does though. The goal he set up for Calvert-Lewin by taking on the LB is unusual for him
     
  17. olephill2

    olephill2 Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Club:
    Watford FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, it's why – outside of goals and assists – some of these metrics have to be taken with a grain of salt especially when you compare it to the eye test.

    Still, Aaronson hasn't always been the most effective at ball progressing or making incisive passes historically. Here's hoping he continues the strong run of recent form. I've always been a fan of him.
     
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  18. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    There is no way they will finish below Burnley.
     
  19. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    "Provinciales like Roma, Fiore, and Napoli." Beautifully vicious shade. Hats off to you sir.

    Ant time.

    I still hate Juve though ;)
     
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  20. FC Tallavana

    FC Tallavana Member+

    Jul 1, 2004
    La Quinta
    They display those metrics based upon the past 365 days. He’s playing well now.
     
  21. Stan Collins

    Stan Collins Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Silver Spring, MD
    Yeah this is a player who had 3 assists in his first 46 career Premier League games. . . and then 3 in his last 4.
     
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  22. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    From an article I enjoyed on Dominic Calvert-Lewin (and Leeds' recent upswing) ...

    "The goal they scored concluded a passing move from back to front that involved all 11 of Leeds’ players – only the second goal involving all 11 players scored by any team in the Premier League this season, after Rio Ngumoha’s goal for Liverpool against Newcastle in August."

    [​IMG]
    "It goes without saying that Farke’s decision to switch formation and alter his side’s approach isn’t the only reason for Calvert-Lewin’s hot streak, but it has certainly helped.

    Leeds have gone from playing 11.5% of their passes long before the City game to 13.8% in their last six games. They were averaging 10.3 open-play passing sequences of at least 10 passes per game, but that has dropped to 6.7 per game. Their average possession has gone from 48.3% to 43.8%. They are playing 381.3 passes per game, down from 427.8."

    [There's a lot more. I wish I had all day to consume articles like this one.]
     
  23. felloveranddidanadu

    Plymouth Argyle FC
    Dec 12, 2009
    Club:
    San Jose Frogs
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's a hard but necessary adjustment to go from swaggering Championship team to survivalist Prem team.
     
  24. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    #5274 TimB4Last, Jan 1, 2026
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2026
    Aaronson starts! Leeds (16th) visiting Liverpool (4th).

    My schematic shows a 3-5-2, with Aaronson and Nmecha up top. Calvert-Lewin, Okafor, Tanaka, Piroe, and Gnonto are all on the bench.

    [​IMG]
     
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  25. msilverstein47

    msilverstein47 Member+

    Jan 11, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    12:30pm EST on USA network vs. 'pool
     
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