I've been going over bowl projections, and I have a question. Does anyone know just how they decide what team goes to which bowl game? Now I know that each conference has a bowl tie-in. How do the bowls choose the teams within each conference though. It seems as if actual record doesn't matter - as long as they are bowl eligible, a 4-4 team could be #2 pick in a conference if they are big enough and have enough alumni to travel and spend $$$$. I had always been under the impression that a team could be chosen ahead of another team with a better conference record only if they were 1 game behind them. Does this still hold? Or is this rule only for specific conferences? (I see this model might prove difficult in two division conferences.) Also, each BCS Bowl has a tie-in with a conference, except for the Orange, which has two - the Big East and/or the ACC. Now if one conference has the team playing in a national title game, does the bid automatically go to the other conference, or can the Orange Bowl declare that they want the Big East champion, thus in effect giving them two at-large bids? I've looked at several big sites, and have seen differing opinions. I'm really confused. Any help? - sorry the post is so long. Thanks --Tom
If Miami is still undefeated come season's end, they're in Tempe. ND goes to Orange Bowl and BE #2 Pitt or VTech, I think goes Gator.
I'm basing a lot of my answer on what happened last year, so this may be out of date this year, but I don't think so.... You are correct for the most part.... the Bowl tie-ins indicate the "rights" for bowls to choose teams. At the end of the season, the conferences have their rankings of teams. For example, last year in the Big East, the rankings went like this (I think): Team (Conference Record) 1. Miami (7-0) 2. Syracuse (6-1) 3. Virginia Tech (5-2) Miami received the BCS championship game berth, but that did not mean that the Orange Bowl got the Big East #2 - it is just out of luck that it's conference tie-in is in the big game - so they got an at-large team instead. The Gator Bowl, which has the "right" to choose the Big East #2 could have chosen Syracuse, however, they decided to choose Virginia Tech instead. The argument they made was that VA Tech would be a better draw in Florida. The Gator Bowl was "allowed" to do this, since VA Tech only had a conference record that was one game worse than Syracuse. (If VA Tech had a 4-3 conference record, then Syracuse would have gone to the Gator Bowl). Shafted by the Gator Bowl, Syracuse went to the Insight.com Bowl in Pheonix as the "Big East #3" where they proceeded to crush Kansas State 26-3. It was a great game. Hope that helps a little. isaac101 Syracuse graduate - Class of '96
I understand this. My question was, if Miami goes to Tempe (probable) does the Orange have to take the ACC champion because they have a tie-in too. Or can the Orange declare that they will use their tie-in to the Big East, which would give them two at-large bids in essence - as Miami would have to go to Tempe as BCS #2, which would likely send FSU packing to New 'Awlins (lucky bastards) or would the Orange have to take the 'Noles as ACC champs, in all probability sending the Irish to face Georgia. I have seen it stated both ways on major sites. that's why I'm confused. I hope I'm getting my point across here. Isaac - I know that's how the Big East did it (in fact, it was the basis for my question), I just also need to know if it is the same for all conferences, or do other conferrences have different criteria.
Different conferences and bowls have different arrangements. For example, the Pac-10 has a contract with the Holiday Bowl to send their #2 team there, or #3 team if 2 Pac-10 teams go to the BCS. The Holiday Bowl has to take whoever is #2. Then the Pac-10 has contracts with the Sun, Las Vegas, Insight.com, and Silicon Valley Bowls, and those bowls choose in the order listed from any bowl-eligible teams. I believe they could declare they select the Big East champion and then don't have to take the ACC champion. If Miami ends up #1, they would get the first choice of an unattached team. Things could get interesting as both Texas (if they finish #3 or #4 in BCS) and Notre Dame (if they finish in top 6) could automatically take both at-large BCS berths, which would exclude Iowa from the Rose Bowl if OSU goes undefeated.
To answer Thomas' original question: No. The BCS teams are decided by BCS standings and conference championships. If you are not 9-win Notre Dame, a conference champ, or in the Top 2 in the BCS standings, you can not go to a BCS bowl. Other than the Rose, no bowl has a pre-arranged contract with any conference. All of the BCS teams not in the Natl Championship game are in effect "drafted" by the bowls. There is a ranking with regards to which bowl picks second, which picks third, etc., and it varies from year to year, but I don't know what it is for this season. That's also partly why whichever picks teams first after the Fiesta will undoubtedly pick Notre Dame, a non-conference team. It's all about getting the best matchups for the most ticket sales. Nearly all bowls beyond the BCS bowls have deals with individual conferences, but it is up to the bowls to decide who they want. When you hear "#2 ACC" or "#5 Big Ten", what they're saying is that the bowls with the conference tie-ins get to pick bowl-eligible teams from that conference in that order. They are not obliged to take the second-ranked ACC team or the fifth-ranked Big Ten team if a more attractive opportunity is available. If, however, they have a conference tie-in to a bowl and there is a bowl-eligible team available from that conference, they must take the conference team.
That's not true. There are 4 BCS games and only 6 BCS conference championships. That leaves 2 at-large berths. Even if Notre Dame takes one there is still one more. The other one can be automatically taken by a non-champion that is ranked #3 or #4, but if there isn't such a team, any team with 9 wins in the top 12 can be chosen. Sugar has a contract with SEC. Fiesta has a contract with Big XII. Orange gets to choose one or both of the Big East and ACC champions. Whoever "loses" the #1 team to the championship game gets the first choice of a replacement. Unless the Rose Bowl picks first, which it will if the current rankings hold. They would prefer to choose Iowa to preserve a Pac-10/Big Ten matchup rather than have Notre Dame.
Okay, I think I found some answers at the BCS's official site: http://espn.go.com/abcsports/bcs/about/ The relevant paragraphs are these: "The BCS also notes the importance of regional consideration regarding team selection. Specifically, as participating members of the BCS, the four BCS Bowls will host the following conference champions in the years the national championship game is not played at their site. Regional consideration tie-ins include the ACC or Big East champion in the FedEx Orange Bowl, the SEC champion in the Nokia Sugar Bowl, the Big Ten and the Pac-10 champions in the Rose Bowl and the Big 12 champion in the Tostitos Fiesta Bowl. Should a BCS Bowl's regional tie-in champion be ranked number one or two in the final BCS standings, when such bowl is not hosting the national championship game, the number one or two-ranked team shall move to the national championship game and the Bowl shall select a replacement team from the BCS pool of eligible teams. The pool will consist of any Division I-A team that is ranked among the Top 12 in the final BCS standings and has achieved nine wins during the regular season excluding NCAA-exempted contests." So, to answer the original question by Thomas, the Orange Bowl could effectively choose an 'at-large' team if Miami makes the championship game. That 'at-large' team could of course be the ACC champion, which might be a good idea for ticket sales, but there is no requirement for the Orange Bowl to take the ACC champ (assuming Miami makes the title game). As for other conference tie-ins for non-BCS bowl games, I think that each conference (and each bowl game) do the selection of teams differently. However, the common practice would seem to be for a Bowl to negotiate the chance to select a team finishing in a certain place in a conference or to select a team with a similar record.
Thanks Guys Thanks for the answers. Basically, most non-BCS bowls are popularity contests then. So we have : Big East - each bowl picks in order, with the exception that they can only pick a team lower in the standings if they have one less loss. Pac-10 : #2 rated mut go to Holiday Bowl. Everyone else is chosen by bowls however they want. Anything else? Big-12, ACC, Big 10, SEC ? Side note : Noah, the only way Iowa gets shafted is if Washington State loses. if Oklahoma loses, Texas plays in the Big 12 championship game and Oklahoma would have to place top 4, which wont happen. If Ohio State loses, Washington State would play in the national title game, but Iowa would win the Big 10, hence they'd be in the BCS. However, if Ohio State falls to 4, Texas is still shut out. If Miami loses and falls to #4, Texas is still shut out. I don't see Miami falling to #5. --Tom
Re: Thanks Guys The other possibility is if Oklahoma loses the Big XII championship game. Then Colorado or K State gets into the BCS, and Texas probably moves into the top 4 and ND into the top 6. It would be interesting to see what the Rose Bowl would do if it ends up being Ohio State vs. Washington State in the Fiesta Bowl. The Rose Bowl would probably like USC vs. Iowa, but that wouldn't be possible if either Texas or Notre Dame gets an automatic at-large berth.
OK, I understand this, but the BCS has no choice but to take conference champions, correct? (I am definitely out of it, as the next paragraph shows.) I've obviously lost my mind. I thought that they did away with all of these affiliations (except the Rose, which demanded that it remain "special") a couple of years ago. What happened?
Yes. The wiggle room exists in finding the other 2 teams. I think they never went away when the BCS started. If it's not hosting the big game, the Sugar Bowl likes having the SEC champ just as much as the Rose Bowl likes having the Pac-10 champ.
Trying to simplify here. First choose 8 teams. 6 Conference Champions and 2 AT LARGE. 1. Automatic at larges a) Notre Dame with greater than 9 wins and ranked in the top 8 (i think its top 8) [I think they get the automatic currently] b) Non-Conference Champion who is BCS #3 or #4 [Texas doesn't qualify right now] c) Non-BCS Conference Champion who is in the top 8 of the BCS poll. (i.e. BYU from the Moutain West if they went undefeated, for example) This chooses our automatic teams. If the number is less than 8 it gets interesting. If the number is 8 no problem. If the number is greater than 8 we might have an apocalyptic scenario. (it can be greater than 8). Now taking these affiliations into account Big XII - Fiesta Big X - Rose Pac X - Rose SEC - Sugar ACC/BigEast - Orange (don't know about ACC, but I think the orange has the "rights" to both) So we start with the BCS #1 v. BCS #2 in the site of the national championship (Fiesta). Assuming that OSU is #1 and Miami is #2 (as it is today)..... The Big Ten Champ (OSU) was the first team assigned so, Rose gets the first pick. With this pick they can choose any of the automatics (see above) or any other team in the nation as its at large selection (assuming 6 wins). Rose chooses Iowa (AT LARGE TEAM - No Automatic) (hypothetically) Orange then chooses because they lost to Miami, they choose Notre Dame Then the conference champions fall out the rest of the way. Rose: WAZU v. Iowa Fiesta: Miami v. OSU Sugar: Georgia v. Oklahoma Orange: Notre Dame v. ACC champ - Fl State Then you have the bowl tie ins. Pac X is explained above. The Big XII works as a draft really. So the Cotton Bowl has the #1 pick (non-BCS obviously), Holiday #2, GalleryFurniture/Houston Bowl #3 (this year I think), Alamo Bowl #4, then either the Independence Bowl or Insight.com bowl and then the other one. That is how it works in the Big XII. I think this is the first time the Houston Bowl gets #3 billing whereas in the past it normally got lower billing. HOPE THIS CLARIFIES IT AND DOESN'T MUDDLE IT FURTHER.
a and c are combined into one rule, and it's top 6. The rule is that any non-BCS conference champion or any independent in the top 6 gets an at-large berth if one is available. The only way none would be available would be if both #1 and #2 are at-large teams, though it's theoretically possible but highly unlikely that more teams could qualify by this rule than slots are available, in which case someone would be out of luck. The rule doesn't specifically apply to Notre Dame, but realistically it's the only independent that could hope to get in the top 6. If there are any at-large slots available after this rule is applied, then BCS #3 gets in if they aren't already, and if there still is a slot available after that, BCS #4 gets it if they aren't in already.
Originally posted by MLSNHTOWN Trying to simplify here. You'd have better luck parting the Red Sea Now taking these affiliations into account Big XII - Fiesta Big X - Rose Pac X - Rose SEC - Sugar ACC/BigEast - Orange (don't know about ACC, but I think the orange has the "rights" to both) See above posts. In fact the Orange's affiliation is an either/or proposition. If they choose one, they don't have to choose the other, that one becomes an "at-large" team for purposes of choosing the bowl match-ups (In this case Fla St.) Note : This was one of the main cruxes of my confusion with the BCS. The Big Ten Champ (OSU) was the first team assigned so, Rose gets the first pick. With this pick they can choose any of the automatics (see above) or any other team in the nation as its at large selection (assuming 6 wins). Correct. Whatever conference goes to the Fiesta, that bowls tie-in gets first (BCS #1) and second (BCS #2) choice. After that, it is a rotating system (I totally missed this before because the Big 12's tie-in is the Fiesta and Miami's is the Orange.). This year the Orange chooses first, then Sugar, then Rose. But I'm sure there's a gentleman's agreement that Iowa will go to the Rose Bowl if at all possible. As long as the Sugar gets Georgia or LSU, I don't think it matters who they play - in any case, I think they would prefer a Southern team to Iowa. It is about the benjamins after all. So as of right now : Choice #1 - Rose - (for Big 10 team) Choice #2 - Orange - (for Big East team) Choice #3 - Orange - (At Large Pool #1) Choice #4 - Sugar - (At Large Pool #2) At Large Pool = ACC Champ, Big 12 Champ, 2 at Large teams Auto #1 - Fiesta - BCS #1 Auto #2 - Fiesta - BCS #2 Auto #3 - Sugar - SEC Champ Auto #4 - Rose - PAC-10 Champ BTW - Thanks for the info about the Big XII selection process. Appreciated
I've found this link to be helpful -- although it only lists the matchups and doesn't explain why: http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/news/bowlsked.html
The Holiday would probably be the one bowl I'd go to as a neutral fan. They have the reputation of putting on such a good event (activities for players and fans, you name it) that, combined with the fact that it always seems to be an amazing game that's decided in the final :30, makes it arguably the premier non-BCS bowl. Plus, you get to go to San Diego! Other bowls with good reputations are the Peach (once a dreg now always a sellout) and Outback.