News: Blatter: Teams Will Be Seeded In UEFA WC Qualifying Play-Offs

Discussion in 'FIFA and Tournaments' started by scaryice, Oct 2, 2009.

  1. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
  2. Michele

    Michele Member

    Mar 18, 2008
    Copenhagen
    Because teams have already been seeded in the group stage. Actually, if you fail to win your group as a first seeded team, you should rather be punished for your inability rather than awarded with a new seeding. The teams who reach 2nd place from a 3rd, 4th or 5th seeding are those who have really achieved something special and deserve to be rewarded for it. Of course it doesn't matter who are seeded and who are unseeded if we're talking about the same group of teams belonging in one category, so the only viable thing to do would be to make an open draw. We would then run the risk of a France - Germany match up, but would it really be so bad since these teams could just have won their groups if they wanted to be at the WC?
     
  3. glennaldo_sf

    glennaldo_sf Member+

    Houston Dynamo, Penang FC, Al Duhail
    United States
    Nov 25, 2004
    Doha, Qatar
    Club:
    FL Fart Vang Hedmark
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would like to see the teams drawn due to their overall performance in the wc qualifiers... for instance, the team with the best 2nd place record would play the team with the 8th best record, 2nd best v 7th, 3rd v 6th, 4th v 5th and so on.... For instance if the draw were made today, Sweden would be out and you'd have...

    Russia v Ireland
    France v Norway
    Slovenia v Greece
    Croatia v Bosnia & Herzegovina

    Of course this would change in a couple of weeks as some teams like Sweden, Ireland, Bosnia, Greece have only played 6 matches while Norway have already played all 8. Norway will most likely drop out of this table.

    I just hope that they don't use the world ranking system.... :rolleyes:
     
  4. Ric_Braz

    Ric_Braz Member+

    May 13, 2009
    Wiltshire, UK.
    Club:
    AFC Wimbledon
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Agree with you entirely why the heck should Germany, France and certainly Portugal etc. be given any favours? having said that it is refreshing that probably only 1 team will qualify from the world's most boring group in which the run away leaders have already lost at home to Luxembourg. No one should qualify from this group.
     
  5. Dr. Gamera

    Dr. Gamera Member+

    Oct 13, 2005
    Wheaton, Maryland
    Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate.

     
  6. JLSA

    JLSA Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    It seems mildly ironic that there are so many posters who complain that the qualifying systems in Africa (and Asia sometimes) prevent those confederations sending their best sides - yet when UEFA implements a system to assist getting what should be (according to the rankings anyway) their best sides to the finals they get complaints as well.

    J
     
  7. DenzilTFF

    DenzilTFF New Member

    Mar 7, 2009
    Raleigh, NC
    Club:
    Millwall FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    And yet countries like Latvia, Slovakia & Slovenia have still qualified from European sections...
     
  8. JLSA

    JLSA Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    I know. It's just so remarkable that ASSISTING through seeding doesn't actually GUARANTEE you anything - you still have to win. Imagine that.

    J
     
  9. Panfilo

    Panfilo Member+

    May 9, 2003
    INLAND EMPIRE
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    I saw when Blatter announced this.

    It will be the Fifa Rankings

    Top 4 in one pot the other 4 obviously in another pot.

    Then they will draw to see who hosts the first and second legs.


    If Portugal does make its way to the playoff there is good chance they wouldn't crack the top 4 since they are behind Greece in the rankings.

    Right now it would be

    Russia/Germany
    Croatia
    France
    Greece

    Sweden/Portugal
    Ireland
    Slovenia
    Bosnia Herzegovina
     
  10. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Yeah, couldn't agree more. UEFA is over-seeding.

    NO offence but I think your system is worse than using FIFA rankings. Ranking teams based on group records sounds good in theory, but in practice the 2nd-place teams with the best records usually just end up being those teams that were lucky enough to get drawn into a group with the most minnows. Its no surprise that the worst 2nd-place record will come out of Group 9 where there are no minnows. So everybody just beats up on each other.
     
  11. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Yeah Switzerland had a poor match, but it was their only loss in qualifying since 2003 (if you count their two-legged victory over Turkey as a win)! They consistently qualify for every major tournament.
    Also its amazing how people are still able to argue that Greece is weak. They were dominant in Euro 2008 qualifying and they will be favoured to qualify for South Africa even if they get stuck in the playoffs.
     
  12. Ric_Braz

    Ric_Braz Member+

    May 13, 2009
    Wiltshire, UK.
    Club:
    AFC Wimbledon
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Yes I know I am being unfair and I was very excited about Greece winning in 2004 it is just every game of the last two tournements the Swiss have bored me rigid. the fear is getting to see Switzerland v North Korea or something like that. To say they regularly qualify for every major tournament is a bit loaded as they did not in 2002 and had a little bit of help in 2008.
     
  13. Father Ted

    Father Ted BigSoccer Supporter

    Manchester United, Galway United, New York Red Bulls
    Nov 2, 2001
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    The problem with this is that they are making up the rules now. I would have had no qualms about this if they had stated this before qualifying began but they are making up the rules as they go along so that the likes of France and Germany have an easier chance to qualify over other second placed teams.

    Also the other thing is that teams were already seeded for the groups and are now being seeded again under a different criteria.
     
  14. Caesar

    Caesar Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 3, 2004
    Oztraya
    You know all too well there's a balance to be struck. Otherwise you may as well just send the top ranked sides.

    I have no problem with seeding sides at the beginning of a tournament. Seeds have earnt that advantage. What have they done since then to earn a seed in the knockouts? Nothing - if anything, they deserve it less than the other sides who did not have the advantage. Re-seeding halfway through is just giving them two bites at the cherry.

    The fact that the rules are being set as we go along just makes things taste even more bitter.
     
  15. Andy TAUS

    Andy TAUS Member

    Jan 31, 2004
    Sydney, AUS
    Those who believe that FIFA should state up front the selection process (ie seeding) for the UEFA playoffs are having themselves on. FIFA won't do this for the MAIN WC Finals Tournament so why would they do so for the lead-up to the Finals?

    The Old Septic Bladder and his cronies (like Michelle Platipuss) would NEVER relinquish ANY opportunity to engineer what they see as being the CORRECT world order of football teams. They'd never leave this choice to chance (like on the field or a blind draw).

    Nothing will change until these FIFA execs are long dead & buried or the Swiss police grow some balls and bring them to justice.
     
  16. JLSA

    JLSA Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    This is the same system as was used last time AND they didn't say there wouldn't be seeding at the start of the process.

    Maybe they just don't obsess about these things as much as the crowd here do? CAF actually announced one thing and then changed it to this (FIFA Ranks) DURING the process, which seems far less fair.

    J
     
  17. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    I have nothing against re-seeding when the luck of the draw is as significant as it is for UEFA's groups. Asia, likewise, seeded its final round groups (using the same seeding as the previous round).

    Agreed. All seeding formulae - including for the final competition - should be announced before the start of the qualfying competition.
     
  18. JLSA

    JLSA Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    Of course, that could be difficult for the finals given that there are many possible sets of teams that could qualify. Effectively you are asking for FIFA to announce how the seeding formula would work to get Pot 1 (seems fair) but also for all the possible ways they might divide up Pots 2-4 given:
    who wins AFC/OFC
    who wins Conmebol/Concacaf
    who is seeded from UEFA/Conmebol and Concacaf (the mix of teams in Pot 1 determines who would be in other pots).

    I can't really imagine that anyone in FIFA could be bothered and that more than a few people would actually care.

    J
     
  19. scaryice

    scaryice Member

    Jan 25, 2001
    Figuring out the remaining pots is something that can be done just before the draw and has nothing to do with setting the formula for seeding the top one. Your comment really doesn't make sense.
     
  20. JLSA

    JLSA Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    If you want to know how the draw works you presumably want to know how the whole thing works. Or only part of it, apparently. I can assure you that if FIFA announced the seedings for Pot 1 you would have to wait about 38 seconds before people here started whining that they didn't know everything and that it was rigged to hurt their team's chances.

    Given Edgar's latest post it appears that FIFA may have answered to your satisfaction right from the start - they just didn't tell feel the need to bang on about it.

    J
     
  21. Dage

    Dage Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 4, 2008
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Mönchengladbach
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    How obviously, you wish a UEFA powerhouse failed to reach an additional seeding place for your federation, maybe the USA (rofl). D:

    See it that way: Germany would be in the relegation with 1 lose (if this will happen, of course) against another big team in all qualification matches. Why this team shouldn't be seeded to make care that they don't have to play against another very unlucky UEFA powerhouse.

    Every federation wants to send their best teams to the world cup, so I don't really see the problem with seeded teams in relegation.:rolleyes:
     
  22. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Can't really say it any better than that.

    They didn't say it because they wanted to keep their options open (to rig it essentially).

    Yeah but they are not seeding based on unluckiness. The fact that Germany would have only 1 loss and be seeded is just a coincidence.

    I wouldn't say France is unlucky for drawing Serbia and losing only once.
     
  23. Lascho

    Lascho Member+

    Sep 1, 2008
    Hannover, Germany
    Club:
    Borussia Mönchengladbach
    And it's obvious they are doing it for the money, not for reasons based on sports.
    Compare the seeding procedure for the qualifying for the U19-EC 2009: There was absolutely no seeding.
    Consequence: A group of 4 in the first qualifying stage with Germany (winner 2008), Spain (winner 2007), Czech Republic semi-finalist 2008) and Estonia (or Latvia, don't remember exactly). One-legged group stage, only the winner goes to the second qualifying stage. Great idea...
     
  24. Lusankya

    Lusankya Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 14, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    So Germany is already confirmed as the second placed team, despite leading the group with no losses and a single draw??? :confused:

    There was a seeding, but a stupid one.
     

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