BL MD 17: Leverkusen - BVB

Discussion in 'Borussia Dortmund' started by hava, Feb 8, 2020.

  1. BvB_Peon

    BvB_Peon Member

    Apr 14, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Exactly the result expected of a Favre led team. Who could have predicted that? Well most of us really, but not the board ...
    Another trophy for Bayern I guess
     
  2. Scheherazade

    Scheherazade Member

    Jun 4, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    @astrophyz
    Brandt probably got injured hopefully it's not serious.
     
    astrophyz repped this.
  3. HockeytownHeel

    HockeytownHeel Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    Jul 23, 2018
    I dont understand Favres mindset..

    I like watching Reyna and have been on him since we signed him and think he will be special one day...

    But my god all these blowouts have been great chances to get those young back line players some chances to get on the pitch and Favre has always went to Reyna. I dont get it. I see value in Reyna that others dont and liken him to a lot of our other young players that will be rewarding profit wise or will give us some great wing play but my god defense is whats killing us. Not Reyna scoring a goal.. The defense is what needs to be worked on, not the offense....

    Favre is a true moron
     
  4. hava

    hava Member+

    Apr 30, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Ok, so the Brandt sub was forced. Will be a huge loss if he can't play in the coming games.

    And I agree that testing out other defensive options should be on Favre's list. Not only Balerdi who is rotting on the bench forever but also Morey because Hakimi will leave and LP will retire. We need to know where we are before these two leave. But it cannot only be the defense why we allow this amount of easy goals.

    And btw, Bremen who kicked us out of the Cup, lost at home against Union and are 17th now. We made them look like a team competing for the CL spots in the first half.
     
  5. Alex C

    Alex C Member+

    Oct 27, 2015
    Chatham
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    It's frustrating because this season could have been so much better. Too many mistakes have been made. Above all his questionable tactics and stubbornness with regards to selection Favre's biggest problem is his inability to instill the sort of winning mentality/steel you need to win trophies.

    The club has now missed two big chances to win the BL, as from here I think Bayern will win it.
     
    Obsidian repped this.
  6. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    The worst of all is that this clown Favre will do just enough to stay on the job.
     
    Obsidian repped this.
  7. Blueberry_night

    Blueberry_night Member+

    Apr 5, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    You guys have to admit it, for neutral this match was fantastic. I happened to watch this with my EPL fans friend. It was his first time watching bundesliga and he might started to watch more thanks to this match.
     
  8. Alex C

    Alex C Member+

    Oct 27, 2015
    Chatham
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    No chance of beating PSG over two matches. The defence will not cope.
     
    Obsidian repped this.
  9. HockeytownHeel

    HockeytownHeel Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    Jul 23, 2018
    Im not sure we win one single match against them. We just dont defend well.
     
  10. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    I just looked the history of bundesliga table in the past few years..
    We had major defence problems in the past 3 years and too many concede goals..
    18/19 season 44 goals in 34 matches
    17/18 season 47 goals in 34 matches
    16/17 season 40 goals in 34 matches
    This season already 32 goals in just 21 match, we will probably concede around 50 till the end..
    In the past 4 years we conceded more than 180 goals.... WOW!
     
  11. Jiri Havran

    Jiri Havran Member

    Apr 8, 2016
    Oslo
    Club:
    Shanxi Baorong
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    PB : LF = 1:0. And regardless bad coaching and hopeless defense, I think also Bürki seemed very passive on all goals, in contrary to Hradecky.
    So Hradecky : Bürki = also 1:0
     
  12. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    Burki is a solid gk, but thats all.. He is not great..
    Its interesting how Dortmund can't produce or buy a top class GK.
    When you look at the past 10 years, we had great defenders in Subotic, Hummels,Lukasz; midfielders in Sahin, Kagawa, Gotze, Gundogan; forwards in Reus, Dembele, Sancho, Lewy, Barrios, Haland.
    All of them were or are on of the greatest in their position, but its very interesting how we cannot bring that kind of quality on goal.
    We had Klos, he was good, but not one of the best, we had Roman, also good, but far from best, now Burki...
    How cant we produce or buy young wonderkid that is next Neuer, Casillas, Buffon, Donnarumma... Thats so strange, i guess we dont have a good scouts for that position or great GK coaches when it comes to GK...
     
  13. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    Bayern: Koepke, Kahn, Neuer
    Schalke: Neuer, Nubel
    Juve: Peruzzi, Buffon
    Inter: Toldo, Julio Cesar, Handanovic
    Milan: Abbiati, Dida, Donnarumma
    Atletico: Courtois, De Gea
    United: Van der Saar
    And i didnt mention a bunch of clubs with good goalies in the past 20-30 years...
    This all are or were top class in some part of their careers (only Nubel not, but he will be), and we had Klos, Lehmann, Roman and Burki, none of them were/is superstar goalie, not even close, only maybe Lehmann was the most famous, but he was not a WC quality goalie.
    What i want to say, this is not luck, that those teams had that kind of GKs, it has something to do with scout vision and GK trainers
     
  14. hava

    hava Member+

    Apr 30, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    We also have to compare for how many seasons we could consider ourselves playing in the same region as these teams. For instance, during our bad years, I thought Weidenfeller was above our level and while he was no Neuer, he had some amazing matches.
    Bayern also has it easier to aquire the best German players and still had several fails finding a successor for Kahn. Köpke didn't play for them but no scouting vision or luck was needed for Kahn or Neuer. They just bought them when their talent was visible to all. They even get players like Nübel for free.

    As for our youth teams producing quality keepers, a lack of success on our part is true. Currently there is Unbehaun who is held in high regard but who had injury issues. We'll have to wait how he works out but I believe the club thinks he has the talent to replace Bürki.
     
  15. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    Only defence that can "compete" with us is Barca, their defence and choice of managers is somehow similar to our case.
    Its tragic that you spent the best years of Messi with low quality coaches and horrific transfers. Their FO is 2x worse than ours..
     
  16. Scheherazade

    Scheherazade Member

    Jun 4, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Barcelona and RM like Bayern and Juventus are expected to win the league regardless of the coach even in an underperforming year because they are just that far ahead of the competition in revenue, squad talent, stadium capacity, fanbase.

    When Porto won the Champions league in 2004, it was attributed to Mourinho's coaching rather than Porto being ascendant in Europe. People who do not support Dortmund see us like Porto, that we overachieved in the Klopp years because of Klopp but fans and even the board expect new BVB coaches to be as good as Klopp and always get disappointed. Neutrals and reporters think the FO is very good at finding talented players, which is opposite to how the fans see it.
     
  17. Obsidian

    Obsidian Member

    Apr 22, 2012
    near Munich
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Well, as it was pointed out numerous times: BVB have an world class attack, but their defensive line (including GK) is mediocre at best. The Hummels-Transfer was fine in my opinion, but not even closely enough.

    Instead of always seaching for new attacking players on the transfer market, Zorc should finally see that the backline is Dortmund´s problem since YEARS. Schulz was an joke of an transfer at that sum (which pretty much everyone saw coming), Akanji is stalling, LP is way too old and Balerdi seems to have slept with Favres wife (same as Goetze) as he´s not seeing live minutes at all.

    If there are transfers that have to be made from you guys this summer, it should mainly be about defensive stability. I do not mean to buy another 4 defenders in Zorc´s usual "Quantity over Quality" standard.
     
  18. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    When it comes to Barca, they have the same problem as we do - they cant find a new Pep, just like we cant find a new Kloppo..
    They are lost when it comes to managers and they hire some Valverdes, Setiens, coaches that are quality enough to train that kind of squad, just like we had Bosz, Stoeger and now Favre..
    And you can see that on results, Barca fans are unhappy for years now, they lost that killing attack, they look kind of boring, their defence is terrible
     
  19. Scheherazade

    Scheherazade Member

    Jun 4, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    @Oliseh lol you conveniently forget to mention that Barcelona won the treble with Enrique.

    Where are the similarities between us and Barcelon? Is our academy half as good? Check the Deloitte charts, Barcelona is a club all players want to join regardless of the manager because of the revenue and salary. Dortmund even when Klopp was here, is a stepping stone club for players.

    As said, I don't see the need to compare every subsequent manager to Pep or Klopp. It's like Man U or Arsenal trying to find the new Ferguson or Wenger, a pointless burden on managers who join the club. Every player who gets labelled as the new Messi ends up disappointing. The idea that a new Pep would solve all of Barcelona's issues is illogical. Barcelona had a golden generation of La Masia talent, even Pep would struggle to repeat his previous results without players as good as Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, Puyol.

    Pep cannot win a treble without top talents (which is why he spends billions at Bayern and City with a blank cheque for the exact players he wants but still can't win another CL yet), but Barca's golden generation can win a treble with Pep and repeat it with Luis Enrique. So success is not as straightforward as having Pep or Klopp, you need a bottomless money pit or a golden generation of talent to come through.
     
  20. Oliseh

    Oliseh Member

    Borussia Dortmund
    Croatia
    Nov 29, 2019
    The fact is that Barca at the moment has a serious problem with Bartomeu and FO, their club vision is under big question.
    They cant produce shit from La Masia, they are spending like crazy on players that are not worth that amount of money, hiring coaches that are not suited for them..
    They had 2 epic fails against Roma and Lpool in the CL, i think even our comedy defence wouldnt be able to do that...
    And when Messi leaves, they will be in some serious shit
     
  21. astrophyz

    astrophyz Member

    Sep 23, 2016
    Boston, USA
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Egypt
    I think we do just fine in terms of transfers. That's not the problem. We are just asking for a better coach at this point. The talent on this squad is amazing.

    I would even think that our defense and Burki are not that bad either. I think the defense can potentially do better with better defensive coaching. I mean it's just a guess, but I think I've seen enough talent in these guys to think that.
     
  22. Obsidian

    Obsidian Member

    Apr 22, 2012
    near Munich
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    "Not that bad" is pretty much exactly the term that you can use, which is the main problem ;) Don´t get me wrong, I have a opinion on Hummels and Hakimi/Zagadou. The rest is pretty much bang average if you compare them to your outstanding attacking line. Time to buckle up and bring both lines to an more equal level.
     
  23. astrophyz

    astrophyz Member

    Sep 23, 2016
    Boston, USA
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Egypt
    My point is that someone like Akanji showed higher potential up to just last year. So it could be that he just needs a good manager, or that he's having a bad year.
     

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