http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/070516&sportCat=nba here's the relevant part. 3. The single most disgusting NBA development of the past few years? The flopping. Slowly, regretfully, inexplicably, the sport is morphing into soccer -- as exemplified by Kirilenko's swan dive near the end of Tuesday's Jazz-Warriors game that fouled out Matt Barnes, or Kirk Hinrich's perfectly designed flopparoo to draw Chauncey Billups' fourth foul in Detroit Tuesday. I blame the influx of European players for this trend because flopping has always been an acceptable part of soccer; they grew up watching that crap and understood that it could work in basketball as well, especially if you have a group of largely incompetent referees calling the action. So it started a few years ago, it's gotten worse and worse, and now, it's affecting the overall competitiveness of these games. Here's the problem: Because we don't have any anti-flopping rules, it behooves defenders to fall backward every time a low-post player lowers his shoulder, and it behooves them to slide under airborne players and plant their feet for a charge (even if they might end up breaking the guy's neck in the process). Not to keep bringing up the pickup basketball analogy, but geez ... can you imagine if somebody pulled this crap during a game among friends? The prevailing reactions would be, "What the hell are you doing?" and "If you do that again, I'm gonna sock you." But because the NBA refuses to do anything about the flopping, it's evolved into a savvy defensive maneuver. For instance, if you're Barnes and you're giving up 50 pounds to Boozer on the low post, there's only two ways you're stopping him: Go for a strip if he puts the ball on the ground, or jump backward if he's dumb enough to lower his shoulder as he's turning around. Those are your two options. Is that basketball? Hell, no! In fact, when I was a little kid -- and I swear to God, this happened -- a guard named Mike Newlin flopped to draw a charge from the great Dave Cowens, a fiery Hall of Famer who played with a remarkable level of passion and fury, to the degree that he burned himself out after 7-8 years. Completely and utterly outraged that Newlin committed such a phony act of sportsmanship, Cowens berated the ref who made the call, yelled at him some more, then started running back on defense when he noticed Newlin dribbling up the court. Now, our seats were at midcourt, so this happened right in front of us and nearly caused me to pee my pants -- as Cowens was running, he snapped and suddenly charged Newlin like a free safety, bodychecked him at full speed (much, MUCH harder than Horry's foul on Nash) and sent poor Newlin careening into the press table at about 35 mph. Then he turned to the same ref and screamed ... "NOW THAT'S A F------- FOUL!" Did Cowens get kicked out of the game? Of course. But there's a moral to the story. Once upon a time, these guys had a code of honor. They played hard, respected the game, defended their teammates, and if anyone stepped out of line, there was always someone that would take care of them -- whether it was another player, a referee, a coach or whatever. When fights or altercations happened, they were considered natural side effects of a physical sport. When two players talked smack, it was considered a good thing, a sign that the game was heating up, that we were potentially headed for a more competitive place. ---- I thought this was perhaps the best written reason on why Americans are turned off by soccer, I know it's been brought up many times - but Simmons might be the best representative of Joe Soccer Fan out there and he's an admitted soccer fan. IMHO - US Soccer should be paying attention to this stuff. my question - should US Soccer as an entire whole, meaning from the USSF and MLS all the way down to youth soccer, make an official stand against diving?
I take a little bit of an exception to this statement: "I blame the influx of European players for this trend because flopping has always been an acceptable part of soccer;" Flopping, diving, feigning injury, whatever you call it, is NOT an an acceptable part of soccer, and in my opinion every effort should be made to stamp it out of the game. It's ruining things.
but look at it from his perspective. He's experience watching soccer has come from the world cup, where diving was at an all time high, and the random Tottenham match. From that - I think one would come to the conclusion that diving is acceptable, and if Simmons thinks that - you can bet a LOT of American sports fan think that as well
While I agree that it's not an acceptable part of soccer in the US, I have read somewhere that the South American and African fans don't mind it, and some of them even crave it. It is the single-most aspect of soccer that I despise. It turns the beautiful game into an ugly game.
If this was really the case, FIFA would crack down on it a lot more and yes, it is easily my least favorite part of the sport and it does turn people away. Tangential to this, whatever happened to the Youth Tourney no-tolerance rules about not touching the ball after a foul or after the ball is out of play. Did it work so well that FIFA decided to drop it?
The big difference between diving in basketball and soccer is the number of points involved. In basketball its worth only a couple of points out of 80 plus per team where as in soccer the dive that results in a converted PK may be the only goal of the game not to mention it could get a player sent off w/o being replaced. Thats why its a much bigger deal in soccer than in basketball.
The misguided part of the whole thing is to believe that flopping in basketball is a new development. Players have been doing it for many years. Heck even the huge Karl Malone would fake the impact of being touched and then cry foul. For decades the acceptable way to fall to the floor is to push off immediately upon hitting the wood so your long slide makes it appear the impact was more than it was. Flopping has been used for many years in all kinds of sports. It's a crappy part of playing, but it's nothing new. The terrible flopping and refing during WC 2006 did take away from the game, but I don't agree that soccer is to blame for flopping in basketball.
Yep, in NBA and College Basketball, taking the charge has been a huge part of the game. I remember the "Big E", Elvin Hayes, was notorious for his flopping. He would take contact, snap his head back, and grimace in "pain" to draw the foul. Truly one of the greatest players to step on the court and one of the world's great floppers. And then there is Greg Paulus against VCU in the tournament. http://www.clipstr.com/videos/DukePGGregPaulusFlopDuringDukesFirstRoundLossToVCU/
Simmons needs to get his facts right. Diving has NOT "always been an acceptable part of soccer". It is a problem which started regionally some years ago and has now grown to infest the entire sport. It is exactly as the phenomenon in basketball exept that soccer is a larger sport and diving has taken longer to spread throughout the leagues and tournaments of the world. Watch any number of older Premier League matches or older World Cups and international matches and you'll see diving present at a minimum, if at all. In places like the UK diving has not been a part of the culture until fairly recently with the influx of players from countries where it has been more acceptable. Soccer has been struggling with the same dillemma now infesting the NBA which he points out. Simmon's statement is factually incorrect and he needs to issue a retraction, get his facts right and show that he has actually learned something from the past year over which he has supposedly been following the Beautiful Game.
I'm not buying this one. Flopping has always been a part of basketball,. Rick Barry fell when breathed upon. Nobody cares much, except for sportswriters looking to fill a column.
I agree. The payoff is just too big for diving in soccer. Having extra refs behind the goals just to watch the penalty area might clean it up some.
The nicest thing I can say about this article is that it is unintentional cultural propaganda. - Paul
Well diving is worse in soccer than other sports in that it can produce 100% of the scoring in a given match. Anyway, whatever the sport, until suspensions are handed out for diving based on video replay (even if it wasn't called in the match) nothing will change. Telling refs to crack down simply doesn't work, as there will always be doubt in their minds.
Ignoring the soccer comparisons, I can somewhat understand flopping on defense in basketball. The rules of that sport (NBA level) are ridiculously tilted in favor of offence. Illegal defence, what a load of crap. And just beathing on a guy in the act of shooting earns you a foul. Currenly almost all real and perceived contact is called in favor of the offence. It is just too much. Just imagine those rules translated to soccer. There would a penalty kick on every corner.
Flopping is worse than guys going into the stands and beating up fans? More disgusting than the general thuggery of the NBA? Yeah, right.
The level of "thuggery" is actually much higher in the NHL which tacitly condones fighting versus the NBA which punishes and sanctions violent behavior. Now on to floppery and football! First- True soccer fans dislike flopping because it compromises the integrity of the game. Second- American soccer bashers love flopping, because it gives them ammunition to attack the beautiful game. Truth be told if there was no flopping in soccer they'd find something else to hate. Anyway as I've mentioned in other posts the American media soccer basher is a dying breed. Good bye and Good luck in your retirement. Sincerely, Perry Stein
honestly, I think killing off diving would go a long ways to making the sport more popular for adults in this country. The whole fake injury thing is often where the ammo for the insults thrown at soccer players come from.
Almost every sport has a tendency toward these sorts of problems. When the stakes are as high as they are in the top leagues all around the world people will push the rules to the breaking point. NBA players are no different in this regard. This is why leagues have annual reviews of such things. If there is a problem with flopping in the NBA it is because the league is willing to tolerate it. Whether it was introduced by Europeans or Americans it is the leagues responsibility to enforce the rules. If referees are calling fouls that never happened then they should either be corrected or replaced. If the rules favor unsportsmanlike behavior then the rules need changed. But to pretend that athletes bending the rules of a game is somehow unique to one particular sport is either naive or disingenuous.