BigSoccer's Players of the Season: 1911-1912

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by elegos7, Oct 3, 2019.

  1. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Here are the main matches of the 1911-1912 season in chronological order.
    Any details about missing goalscorers and best players from match reports would be appreciated.

    ARG-URU 0-2, 15.8.1911, Buenos Aires, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Piendibene, Dacal

    Football League, Newcastle United-Everton 2-0, 6.9.1911, Newcastle, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    URU-ARG 2-3, 17.9.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Canavessi, Romano / A. Brown, E. Brown 2

    Challenge Cup Final, Wiener SC-Ferencváros 3-0, 24.9.1911, Vienna, Attendance: 2,000
    goals: Neubauer 2, Mayringer
    The best Austrian club, Wiener AC, who has beaten Hungarian champion Ferencváros in May, does not participate.

    FA Charity Shield, Manchester United-Swindon Town 8-4, 25.9.1911, Stamford Bridge, London, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: Halse (6), Turnbull, Wall / Fleming, Wheatcroft, Tout, Jefferson
    best players: ?

    Football League, Everton-Newcastle United 2-0, 30.9.1911, Liverpool, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    URU-ARG 1-1, 8.10.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Piendibene / Watson

    Football League, Newcastle United-Blackburn Rovers 4-2, 21.10.1911, Newcastle, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    Scottish League, Rangers-Celtic 3-1, 21.10.1911, Glasgow, Ibrox Park, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    ARG-URU 2-0, 22.10.1911, Buenos Aires, Attendance: 18,000
    goals: Piaggio 2

    URU-ARG 3-0, 29.10.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 8,000
    goals: Piendibene 2, Canavessi

    HUN-SUI 9-0, 29.10.1911, Millenáris Sporttelep, Budapest, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Bíró, Koródy 2, Schlosser 6
    best players: Schlosser

    HUN-AUT 2-0, 5.11.1911, Üllői út, Budapest, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Bodnár, Koródy

    Football League, Blackburn Rovers-Everton 2-1, 9.12.1911, Blackburn, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    Scottish League, Celtic-Rangers 3-0, 1.1.1912, Glasgow, Celtic Park, Attendance: 70,000
    goals: Quinn 3
    best players: ?

    British Home Championship, IRL-ENG 1-6, 10.2.1912, Dublin, Dalymount Park, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Hamill 35'/ Fleming 12', 40', 64', Holley 17', Freeman 50', Simpson 85'
    best players: ?
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0111Ire1912.html
    An accident to Frank Thompson soon after the second half started meant he had to retire, but he returned and Ireland effectively played with ten men for the rest of the match.

    Football League-Scottish League 2-0, 17.2.1912, Ayresome Park, Middlesbrough, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: 1-0 Freeman (52 min.), 2-0 Mordue (87 min.)
    best players: ?

    British Home Championship, SCO-WAL 1-0, 2.3.1912, Tynecastle Park, Edinburgh, Attendance: 32,000
    goals: Quinn (87)
    best players: ?

    British Home Championship, WAL-ENG 0-2, 11.3.1912, Wrexham, Racecourse Ground, Attendance: 14,000
    goals: Holley 2', Freeman 41'
    best players: ?
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0112Wal1912.html
    Holley replaced Swindon Town FC's Harold Fleming, who was carrying an injury, at inside-left.

    British Home Championship, IRL-SCO 1-4, 16.3.1912, Windsor Park, Belfast, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: 0-1 Aitkenhead (8), 0-2 Aitkenhead (23), 1-2 McKnight (42) penalty, 1-3 Reid (60), 1-4 R.Walker (70)
    best players: ?

    ENG*-NED 4-0, 16.3.1912, Kingston upon Hull, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Bailey 2, Woodward, Wright
    The match is a full international for Netherlands, but not for England, who played with their amateur side.

    British Home Championship, SCO-ENG 1-1, 23.3.1912, Glasgow, Hampden Park, Attendance: 127,0300
    goals: Wilson 7' / Holley 13'
    best players: ?
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0113Sco1912.html

    NED-GER 5-5, 24.3.1912, Zwolle, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: Thomée 2, Francken 2, (o.g.) / Fuchs, Hirsch 4

    FA Cup Semi-final, Barnsley-Swindon Town 0-0, 30.3.1912, Stamford Bridge, London, Attendance: ?
    best players: ?

    FA Cup Semi-final, West Bromwich Albion-Blackburn Rovers 0-0, 30.3.1912, Anfield, Liverpool, Attendance: ?
    best players: ?

    FA Cup Semi-final replay, Barnsley-Swindon Town 1-0, 3.4.1912, Meadow Lane, Nottingham, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    FA Cup Semi-final replay, West Bromwich Albion-Blackburn Rovers 1-0, 3.4.1912, Hillsborough, Sheffield, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    Scottish Cup Final, Celtic-Clyde 2-0, 6.4.1912, Glasgow, Ibrox Park, Attendance: 45,000
    goals: Gallacher, McMenemy
    best players: ?

    Football League, Everton-Blackburn Rovers 3-1, 13.4.1912, Liverpool, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    British Home Championship, WAL-IRL 2-3, 13.4.1912, Cardiff, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: T. Davies, D. Davies / McCandless, Brennan, Thompson

    HUN-GER 4-4, 14.4.1912, Üllői út, Budapest, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Schlosser, Bodnár 3 / Möller, Kipp, Worpitzky, Jäger (pen.)

    FA Cup Final, Barnsley-West Bromwich Albion 0-0, 20.4.1912, Crystal Palace, London, Attendance: 54,400
    best players: ?

    FA Cup Final replay, Barnsley-West Bromwich Albion 1-0, 24.4.1912, Bramall Lane, Sheffield, Attendance: 38,500
    goals: Tufnell 118'
    best players: ?

    Football League, Blackburn Rovers-Newcastle United 1-1, 27.4.1912, Blackburn, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    NED-BEL 4-3, 28.4.1912, Dordrecht, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: van Berckel, Francken 3 / Musch, Nisot 2

    FA Charity Shield, Blackburn Rovers-Queens Park Rangers 2-1, 4.5.1912, White Hart Lane, London, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    best players: ?

    Glasgow Charity Cup Final, Celtic-Clyde 0-0 (Celtic won 7-0 on corners), 11.5.1912, Hampden Park, Glasgow, Attendance: 25,000
    best players: ?

    AUT-HUN 1-1, 5.5.1912, Hohe Warte, Vienna, Attendance: 11,000
    goals: Fischera / Bodnár

    Copenhagen Select-Celtic 1-3, 3.6.1912, Copenhagen, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    Copenhagen Select-Celtic 4-1, 5.6.1912, Copenhagen, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    Celtic tour of Denmark & Norway

    Olympic Games, SWE-NED 3-4, 29.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 14,000
    goals: Swensson 2, E. Börjesson / Bouvy 2, Vos 2

    Olympic Games, GBR*-HUN 7-0, 30.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Walden 6, Woodward
    best players: ?
    Great Britain played with their amateur side.

    Olympic Games, NED-AUT 3-1, 30.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 7,000
    goals: Bouvy, Vos, ten Cate / Müller

    Olympic Games, DEN-NED 4-1, 2.7.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 6,000
    goals: Olsen 2, Jørgensen, Nielsen / (o.g.)
    best players: ?

    Olympic Games Final, GBR*-DEN 4-2, 2.7.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Walden, Hoare 2, Berry / Olsen 2
    best players: ?
    Great Britain played with their amateur side.
     
    peterhrt repped this.
  2. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Additions in red.


    ARG-URU 0-2, 15.8.1911, Buenos Aires, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Piendibene, Dacal

    Football League, Newcastle United-Everton 2-0, 6.9.1911, Newcastle, Attendance: 18,000
    goals: Low, Stewart
    best players: Waugh, Hay, Whitson, Duncan / Holbein, Scott (gk)

    URU-ARG 2-3, 17.9.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Canavessi, Romano / A. Brown, E. Brown 2

    Challenge Cup Final, Wiener SC-Ferencváros 3-0, 24.9.1911, Vienna, Attendance: 2,000
    goals: Neubauer 2, Mayringer
    The best Austrian club, Wiener AC, who has beaten Hungarian champion Ferencváros in May, does not participate.

    FA Charity Shield, Manchester United-Swindon Town 8-4, 25.9.1911, Stamford Bridge, London, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: Halse (6), Turnbull, Wall / Fleming, Wheatcroft, Tout, Jefferson
    best players: Halse

    Football League, Everton-Newcastle United 2-0, 30.9.1911, Liverpool, Attendance: 20,000
    goals: Burton, Davidson
    best players: Young, Maconnachie, Burton / Whitson

    Football League, Blackburn 2 Manchester United 2, 30.9.11, Attendance: 30,000
    Goals: Orr 2 / West 2
    Best Players: Crompton / Roberts


    URU-ARG 1-1, 8.10.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Piendibene / Watson

    Football League, Newcastle United-Blackburn Rovers 4-2, 21.10.1911, Newcastle, Attendance: 30,000
    goals: Stewart 2, Wilson, Hay / Latheron, Davies
    best players: Rutherford, Hibbert /

    Scottish League, Rangers-Celtic 3-1, 21.10.1911, Glasgow, Ibrox Park, Attendance: 40,000
    goals: Bowie 2, Gordon / McAtee
    best players: Lock (gk), Hendry, Bennett / Johnstone, Loney

    ARG-URU 2-0, 22.10.1911, Buenos Aires, Attendance: 18,000
    goals: Piaggio 2

    URU-ARG 3-0, 29.10.1911, Montevideo, Attendance: 8,000
    goals: Piendibene 2, Canavessi

    HUN-SUI 9-0, 29.10.1911, Millenáris Sporttelep, Budapest, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Bíró, Koródy 2, Schlosser 6
    best players: Schlosser

    HUN-AUT 2-0, 5.11.1911, Üllői út, Budapest, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Bodnár, Koródy

    Football League, Blackburn Rovers-Everton 2-1, 9.12.1911, Blackburn, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: W Bradshaw (pen), Chapman / F Bradshaw
    best players: Crompton

    Football League, Liverpool 0, Newcastle 1, 9.12.1911, Attendance: 20,000
    Goal: Higgins
    Best Players: Hardy (gk) / Higgins


    Scottish League, Celtic-Rangers 3-0, 1.1.1912, Glasgow, Celtic Park, Attendance: 70,000
    goals: Quinn 3
    best players: Quinn

    British Home Championship, IRL-ENG 1-6, 10.2.1912, Dublin, Dalymount Park, Attendance: 15,000
    goals: Hamill 35'/ Fleming 12', 40', 64', Holley 17', Freeman 50', Simpson 85'
    best players: / Crompton, Wedlock, Fleming
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0111Ire1912.html
    An accident to Frank Thompson soon after the second half started meant he had to retire, but he returned and Ireland effectively played with ten men for the rest of the match.

    Football League-Scottish League 2-0, 17.2.1912, Ayresome Park, Middlesbrough, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: 1-0 Freeman (52 min.), 2-0 Mordue (87 min.)
    best players: Wallace, Williamson (gk) / Quinn

    British Home Championship, SCO-WAL 1-0, 2.3.1912, Tynecastle Park, Edinburgh, Attendance: 32,000
    goals: Quinn (87)
    best players: Brownlie (gk), McNair / Meredith

    British Home Championship, WAL-ENG 0-2, 11.3.1912, Wrexham, Racecourse Ground, Attendance: 14,000
    goals: Holley 2', Freeman 41'
    best players: Meredith, Vizard / Williamson (gk), Freeman, Brittleton
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0112Wal1912.html
    Holley replaced Swindon Town FC's Harold Fleming, who was carrying an injury, at inside-left.

    British Home Championship, IRL-SCO 1-4, 16.3.1912, Windsor Park, Belfast, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: 0-1 Aitkenhead (8), 0-2 Aitkenhead (23), 1-2 McKnight (42) penalty, 1-3 Reid (60), 1-4 R.Walker (70)
    best players: Hanna (gk) / Sinclair, Templeton, McNair, John Walker

    ENG*-NED 4-0, 16.3.1912, Kingston upon Hull, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Bailey 2, Woodward, Wright
    The match is a full international for Netherlands, but not for England, who played with their amateur side.

    British Home Championship, SCO-ENG 1-1, 23.3.1912, Glasgow, Hampden Park, Attendance: 127,0300
    goals: Wilson 7' / Holley 13'
    best players: Bobby Walker, Wilson, Gordon, Hay / Holley, Crompton, Pennington, Simpson
    http://www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1911-12/M0113Sco1912.html

    NED-GER 5-5, 24.3.1912, Zwolle, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: Thomée 2, Francken 2, (o.g.) / Fuchs, Hirsch 4

    FA Cup Semi-final, Barnsley-Swindon Town 0-0, 30.3.1912, Stamford Bridge, London, Attendance: 48,000
    best players: Moore / John Walker, Fleming

    FA Cup Semi-final, West Bromwich Albion-Blackburn Rovers 0-0, 30.3.1912, Anfield, Liverpool, Attendance: 30,000
    best players: Pennington / Simpson

    FA Cup Semi-final replay, Barnsley-Swindon Town 1-0, 3.4.1912, Meadow Lane, Nottingham, Attendance: 18,000
    goals: Bratley
    best players: Downs, Taylor /

    FA Cup Semi-final replay, West Bromwich Albion-Blackburn Rovers 1-0, 3.4.1912, Hillsborough, Sheffield, Attendance: 20,000
    goals: Pailor
    best players: Pennington

    Scottish Cup Final, Celtic-Clyde 2-0, 6.4.1912, Glasgow, Ibrox Park, Attendance: 45,000
    goals: Gallacher, McMenemy
    best players: Mulrooney (gk), Dodds / Blair, McAndrew

    Football League, Everton-Blackburn Rovers 3-1, 1-3, 13.4.1912, Liverpool, Attendance: 35,000
    goals: Davidson / Clennell 2, Latheron
    best players: / Clennell

    British Home Championship, WAL-IRL 2-3, 13.4.1912, Cardiff, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: T. Davies, D. Davies / McCandless, Brennan, Thompson

    HUN-GER 4-4, 14.4.1912, Üllői út, Budapest, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Schlosser, Bodnár 3 / Möller, Kipp, Worpitzky, Jäger (pen.)

    FA Cup Final, Barnsley-West Bromwich Albion 0-0, 20.4.1912, Crystal Palace, London, Attendance: 54,400
    best players: Downs, Taylor /

    Football League, Woolwich Arsenal 5 Blackburn Rovers 1, 22.4.1912, Plumstead, Attendance: 9,000
    Goals: Flanagan 2, Grant 3 / og
    Best Players: Grant, Shaw, Peart / Robinson (gk)


    FA Cup Final replay, Barnsley-West Bromwich Albion 1-0, 24.4.1912, Bramall Lane, Sheffield, Attendance: 38,500
    goals: Tufnell 118'
    best players: Cooper (gk) /

    Football League, Blackburn Rovers-Newcastle United 1-1, 27.4.1912, Blackburn, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Latheron / Peart
    best players: Simpson / Lawrence (gk)

    NED-BEL 4-3, 28.4.1912, Dordrecht, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: van Berckel, Francken 3 / Musch, Nisot 2

    FA Charity Shield, Blackburn Rovers-Queens Park Rangers 2-1, 4.5.1912, White Hart Lane, London, Attendance: 7,000
    goals: Aitkenhead, Clennell / Revill
    best players: Bradshaw / Revill

    Glasgow Charity Cup Final, Celtic-Clyde 0-0 (Celtic won 7-0 on corners), 11.5.1912, Hampden Park, Glasgow, Attendance: 25,000
    best players: McAtee, McNair, Dodds / Collins, McAndrew, Carmichael, Blair

    AUT-HUN 1-1, 5.5.1912, Hohe Warte, Vienna, Attendance: 11,000
    goals: Fischera / Bodnár

    Copenhagen Select-Celtic 1-3, 3.6.1912, Copenhagen, Attendance: ?
    Goals: ? / Gallacher, og, Quinn
    Best Players: / Gallacher, McMenemy

    Copenhagen Select-Celtic 4-1, 5.6.1912, Copenhagen, Attendance: ?
    goals: ?
    Celtic tour of Denmark & Norway

    Olympic Games, SWE-NED 3-4, 29.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 14,000
    goals: Swensson 2, E. Börjesson / Bouvy 2, Vos 2

    Olympic Games, GBR*-HUN 7-0, 30.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 12,000
    goals: Walden 6, Woodward
    best players: Walden
    Great Britain played with their amateur side.

    Olympic Games, NED-AUT 3-1, 30.6.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 7,000
    goals: Bouvy, Vos, ten Cate / Müller

    Olympic Games, DEN-NED 4-1, 2.7.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 6,000
    goals: Olsen 2, Jørgensen, Poul Nielsen / (o.g.)
    best players: Nils Middelboe, Poul Nielsen / Gobel (gk)

    Olympic Games Final, GBR*-DEN 4-2, 2. 4. 7.1912, Stockholm, Attendance: 25,000
    goals: Walden, Hoare 2, Berry / Olsen 2
    best players: Walden
    Great Britain played with their amateur side.


    Newspaper sources: The Sportsman, Athletic News, Birmingham Daily Gazette, Derby Daily Telegraph, Leeds Mercury, Leicester Daily Post, Liverpool Evening Express, Manchester Courier, Newcastle Daily Chronicle, Nottingham Evening Post, Nottingham Journal, Sheffield Daily Telegraph, Sports Argus, Sunderland Daily Echo, Yorkshire Post, Dundee Courier, The Scotsman, Scottish Referee, Dublin Daily Express, Irish News, Northern Whig.

    Sources are from the British Newspaper Archive, managed by the British Library Board.
     
    elegos7 repped this.
  3. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    #3 peterhrt, Oct 3, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
    Suggested best XI 1911-12 (2-3-5):

    Williamson - Crompton, Pennington - Gordon, Roberts, Hay - Meredith, Bobby Walker, Andy Wilson, Pilat, Vizard.
     
    elegos7 repped this.
  4. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Thanks, this has been really quick.

    What about the best players in this match?

    British Home Championship, WAL-IRL 2-3, 13.4.1912, Cardiff, Attendance: 10,000
    goals: T. Davies, D. Davies / McCandless, Brennan, Thompson
     
  5. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Meredith and Russell for Wales. Hanna (gk), Houston and McCandless for Ireland.
     
  6. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Just came across a report of this game. Celtic goal was scored by McMenemy. Copenhagen goalscorers unknown.

    Tour report states that Denmark's best players were Nils Middelboe and the goalkeeper, presumably Sophus Hansen. Both were said to be on a par with the best of their British counterparts.

    Given that the same was said about Middelboe the previous year, I would put him in the best XI for the season in place of Jimmy Gordon.
     
  7. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    #7 peterhrt, Oct 4, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2019
    Revised best XI 1911-12 (2-3-5):

    Williamson - Crompton, Pennington - Nils Middelboe, Roberts, Hay - Meredith, Bobby Walker, Andy Wilson, Pilat, Vizard.

    A few words of explanation.

    Further investigation leaves no doubt that Charlie Roberts was left out of England teams by the FA from 1908 onwards because of his union activities. He was regarded as the ringleader in challenging the authority of the FA, who also ensured that he did not receive the benefit match he had been promised.

    The FA were fortunate that in Wedlock they had a centre-half who was probably as good as Roberts defensively. But Wedlock had little creative skill whereas Roberts was a fine passer and header of the ball. After Alex Raisbeck, Roberts was arguably the best all-round centre-half the game had seen to this point.

    The 1912 Olympic tournament in Stockholm did no favours to the standing of non-British players. England's amateur team (officially United Kingdom) won the competition easily on foreign soil. They played three matches, beating Hungary 7-0, Finland 4-0 and Denmark 4-2. Fourteen players featured, of which only Harold Walden of Bradford City had appeared in the First Division during the season just finished. Five played in the Second Division with the remainder drawn from Bromley, Ilford, London Caledonians, Northern Nomads, Oxford City, Portsmouth, Reading and Stockton. One would expect reasonably strong opposition to beat this team without difficulty. A similar England amateur XI, with three changes, had also defeated Denmark 3-0 in London in October 1911.

    Ten countries entered the Olympic tournament, the other seven being Austria, Germany, Italy, Netherlands, Norway, Russia and Sweden. Those that won a game also suffered a comprehensive defeat. The tournament was taken seriously. After Russia lost 16-0 to Germany in what was effectively the Plate competition, Tsar Nicholas refused to pay for the Russians' journey home.

    Apart from Nils Middleboe and Sophus Hansen, who had performed notably against Celtic, one has to look elsewhere for non-British candidates for the Best XI. Bohemia did not participate in the Olympic tournament. A Bohemian XI beat Corinthians 4-2 in April. That same month Sparta Prague twice defeated a London Select amateur team 5-1 and 2-1 in an Easter tournament in San Sebastian, Spain. Slavia Prague were less successful against British opponents, beaten 5-1 by Corinthians and twice by Celtic Belfast. They did beat Corinthians 3-1 in the return match. Pilat of Sparta therefore looks a stronger candidate than Kosek of Slavia.

    Southern League Swindon Town toured Argentina and Uruguay in June and July, winning six of their eight matches and drawing the other two against the Argentine League and a Northern Buenos Aires combination. They beat an Argentina XI 1-0, and defeated the Uruguayan league 3-0. Swindon had reached the FA Cup semi-finals that year, and standards in South America appeared to be improving, if still behind those in Britain.
     
    msioux75, Tom Stevens and elegos7 repped this.
  8. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Here are my suggestions for the season.


    23 Man Shortlist

    Brittleton, Thomas ENG The Wednesday
    Crompton, Robert ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Fleming, Harold ENG Swindon Town
    Gordon, James SCO Rangers
    Hanna, John IRL Nottingham Forest
    Hay, James SCO Newcastle United
    Holley, George ENG Sunderland
    McCracken, William IRL Newcastle United
    McNair, Alexander SCO Celtic
    Meredith, William WAL Manchester United
    Middelboe, Nils DEN Kjøbenhavns Boldklub
    Pennington, Jesse ENG West Bromwich Albion
    Pilat, Vaclac BOH Sparta Praha
    Quinn, James SCO Celtic
    Roberts, Charles ENG Manchester United
    Schlosser, Imre HUN Ferencváros
    Scott, William IRL Everton
    Simpson, John ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Vizard, Edward WAL Bolton Wanderers
    Walker, John SCO Swindon Town
    Walker, Robert SCO Heart of Midlothian
    Williamson, Reginald ENG Middlesbrough
    Wilson, Andrew SCO The Wednesday

    As peterhrt said, the 1912 Olympic tournament in Stockholm did no favours to the standing of non-British players. So I chose just three players from the Continent. Swindon Town’s tour of South America proved the standards there are still behind those in Britain. A couple of posters previously suggested Friedenreich as the best player from South America for 1912, but they probably meant the whole calendar year.

    A growing problem is how to handle a season in South America. Previously our seasons started in August and finished in July. But this cuts the traditional South American seasons in two.

    This will be even more problematic in World War years, when there was little organized football played in Europe.

    Everton's Irish goalkeeper Billy Scott could be replaced by another worthy candidate. I do not know why he was dropped by the national team after the match against England. Maybe he played poorly or was injured after that. His team Everton finished runner-up, so I kept him in the Top 23.


    Top 3:
    1. Crompton, Robert ENG Blackburn Rovers
    2. Simpson, John ENG Blackburn Rovers
    3. Pennington, Jesse ENG West Bromwich Albion
     
    Tom Stevens and peterhrt repped this.
  9. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Billy Scott was selected for Ireland's next game against Scotland but withdrew shortly beforehand. He then made himself unavailable for the match against Wales as Everton were playing Blackburn the same day, and Everton still had a chance of winning the league championship.

    Agree with Crompton and Pennington in the Top 3. Pennington was the better performer this season although Crompton captained Blackburn to the league title.

    My third choice would probably be goalkeeper Williamson, who continued to keep Sam Hardy out of the England team. Hardy played against Ireland, but only because Williamson was involved in a cup replay two days before the game and was not able to travel with the rest of the party.

    Williamson's real name was Reg. He was nicknamed Tiny because he was small for a goalkeeper. His nickname then evolved to Tim after Tiny Tim, the fictional character in Charles Dickens' novel A Christmas Carol.
     
    elegos7 repped this.
  10. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I would like to make my modest contribution to this list:
    Jan Vos: bronze medal in the Olympic games getting 5 goals in that match. In that tournament he scored 8 goals in the 4 games he played. I don't have much more information about this player. Any chance of entering the top 23?
    Anton Olsen: silver medal in the 1912 Olympic games with 7 goals in 3 games, including two in the semifinal against Holland. Could you live up to your partner Middelboe?
    Gottfried Fuchs: I know that this fact is fundamentally anecdotal, but for history there are 10 goals scored by Russia in the consolation phase of the Stockholm Olympics.
    Harold Walden: Top scorer and gold medal in the Olympic Games with the amateur team of Great Britain. According to some sources, he scored 11 goals in 3 games, including 6 for Hungary. Don't you really deserve to be at least in the top 23?
    Imre Schlosser: Your records this season are spectacular again. Between October 1911 and July 1912 he plays 12 games with the Hungarian national team, scoring 22 goals. Hungary had the misfortune of playing the quarterfinals of the Olympic games against Great Britain, losing decisively (7-0). For the rest, no doubt of being one of the best selections of the international season. Win the league with Ferencvaros. Play 17 games and convert 34 goals! (5 hat tricks and 8 goals in the last league match). Isn't there a possibility to include this player in the top 3?
     
  11. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Thank you for your input.

    The issue is that standards in the Olympic tournament appear to have been several levels below those in the English and Scottish leagues. The Great Britain winners were effectively an England 5th XI at best. Of the 14 who played for the team, only Woodward had ever been chosen for the main game of the season, England v Scotland, and that was three years previously.

    Gordon Wright had made a solitary appearance against Wales in 1906, and Arthur Berry one against Ireland in 1909. The rest had never been anywhere near a full England side. And yet this team was able to beat Hungary (with Schlosser) 7-0 and defeat Denmark twice during the season.

    You are right that non-British players should not be ignored. The reputations of Middleboe and Schlosser, for example, have survived the years. Two years running the British press have said that Middelboe, when playing against their teams in Denmark, was as good as the best half-backs in Britain. So far we have not found similar contemporary anecdotal evidence about Schlosser. His reputation for the moment rests upon what was said about him later. He certainly scored a lot of goals, but the standard of opposition at this stage of his career is questionable.

    Do you have any information about Spanish players around this time? There were 16 matches between Spanish and British teams this season, all in Spain. The Spanish teams won four and five were drawn. The wins were by Barcelona against United Hospitals and HMS Exmouth (Navy), by Bilbao also against United Hospitals, and by Español against Woolwich Polytechnic.
     
    msioux75 and elegos7 repped this.
  12. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    I have some books that I can consult and that way I can answer your question about Spanish football.
     
  13. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Schlosser is included in the Top23, but necessarily because of his Olympic performance.
    We should not give too much weight to the Olympic Games, which even a rather weak British amateur side easily won.
    We should mainly inculde players in the Top23 who proved themselves against British professionals.
     
  14. Titanlux

    Titanlux Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Nov 27, 2017
    Auckland Wanderers Vs. Barcelona

    MD19121219-001-001_redimensionar.jpg MD19121226-001-001 2_redimensionar.jpg

    Regarding the best Spanish soccer players, impossible to say with certainty. A Spanish team had not yet been organized and the various teams used to act in their corresponding region. Sometimes matches were organized between clubs from different regions with the logical expectation to judge by the chronicles of the time, and what did exist was a Spanish championship for qualifiers, in which many times there were multiple problems such as fortaits, mass withdrawals, Organizational chaos in general ... Keep in mind that football was still a very young sport is Spain. Therefore, when they were combined from amateur teams, there was a stir among fans.
    Returning to the players, here are some of the most popular in this time interval, or at least, the most cited in the bibliography of this sport in Spain:
    Real Madrid / Real Sociedad: Alberto Machimbarrena.
    Barcelona: Amechazurra, José Rodríguez. Highlighted the Scottish Alexander Steel. This team was the champion of Spain.
    Athletic de Bilbao: José María Belauste.
     
    peterhrt repped this.
  15. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Final results of the season.

    23 Man Shortlist

    Brittleton, Thomas ENG The Wednesday
    Crompton, Robert ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Fleming, Harold ENG Swindon Town
    Gordon, James SCO Rangers
    Hanna, John IRL Nottingham Forest
    Hay, James SCO Newcastle United
    Holley, George ENG Sunderland
    McCracken, William IRL Newcastle United
    McNair, Alexander SCO Celtic
    Meredith, William WAL Manchester United
    Middelboe, Nils DEN Kjøbenhavns Boldklub
    Pennington, Jesse ENG West Bromwich Albion
    Pilat, Vaclac BOH Sparta Praha
    Quinn, James SCO Celtic
    Roberts, Charles ENG Manchester United
    Schlosser, Imre HUN Ferencváros
    Scott, William IRL Everton
    Simpson, John ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Vizard, Edward WAL Bolton Wanderers
    Walker, John SCO Swindon Town
    Walker, Robert SCO Heart of Midlothian
    Williamson, Reginald ENG Middlesbrough
    Wilson, Andrew SCO The Wednesday

    Top 3:
    1. Crompton, Robert ENG Blackburn Rovers
    2. Pennington, Jesse ENG West Bromwich Albion
    3. Williamson, Reginald ENG Middlesbrough

    Best XI (2-3-5):
    Williamson - Crompton, Pennington - Nils Middelboe, Roberts, Hay - Meredith, Bobby Walker, Andy Wilson, Pilat, Vizard.
     
  16. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    I took a closer look at the South American players this season. In the 1911-12 season Jose Piendibene scored 6 goals in 5 caps, and also won the Uruguay Championships in 1911.

    I think he was the best South American in this season, and should be given at least an honorary mention. Maybe we could move him into the Top23 at the expense of Brittleton or Scott.
     
  17. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Yes, sounds reasonable.
     
    elegos7 repped this.
  18. elegos7

    elegos7 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Club:
    Liverpool LFC
    Revised Final 23 Man Shortlist

    Crompton, Robert ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Fleming, Harold ENG Swindon Town
    Gordon, James SCO Rangers
    Hanna, John IRL Nottingham Forest
    Hay, James SCO Newcastle United
    Holley, George ENG Sunderland
    McCracken, William IRL Newcastle United
    McNair, Alexander SCO Celtic
    Meredith, William WAL Manchester United
    Middelboe, Nils DEN Kjøbenhavns Boldklub
    Pennington, Jesse ENG West Bromwich Albion
    Piendibene, Jose URU CURCC
    Pilat, Vaclac BOH Sparta Praha
    Quinn, James SCO Celtic
    Roberts, Charles ENG Manchester United
    Schlosser, Imre HUN Ferencváros
    Scott, William IRL Everton
    Simpson, John ENG Blackburn Rovers
    Vizard, Edward WAL Bolton Wanderers
    Walker, John SCO Swindon Town
    Walker, Robert SCO Heart of Midlothian
    Williamson, Reginald ENG Middlesbrough
    Wilson, Andrew SCO The Wednesday
     
  19. TerjeC

    TerjeC Member

    None
    Norway
    Nov 19, 2023
    Norway
    #19 TerjeC, Nov 23, 2023
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2023
    Same formula as posted in last season a few days ago:

    Dream 23 squad, 1911-12

    Goalkeepers
    Billy Scott (Everton)
    James Brownlie (Third Lanark)
    Tim Williamson (Middlesbrough)

    Full backs
    Jesse Pennington (West Bromwich)
    Robert Crompton (Blackburn)
    Alec McNair (Celtic)
    Bill McCracken (Newcastle)

    Half backs
    Charles Roberts (Manchester United)
    Charles Thomson (Sunderland)
    Billy Wedlock (Bristol City)
    James Hay (Newcastle)
    James Gordon (Rangers)

    Wingers
    John Simpson (Blackburn)
    Billy Meredith (Manchester United)
    Robert Evans (Sheffield United)

    Inside forwards
    George Holley (Sunderland)
    Harold Fleming (Swindon Town)
    Walter Aitkenhead (Blackburn)
    Danny Shea (West Ham)
    Andrew Wilson (Sheffield Wednesday)

    Strikers
    Bertram Freeman (Burnley)
    David McLean (Sheffield Wednesday)
    Harry Hampton (Aston Villa)

    Nationality
    England (10/23), Scotland (9/23),
    Ireland (2/23), Wales (2/23).

    Club
    Blackburn (3/23), Newcastle (2/23),
    Manchester United (2/23), Sunderland (2/23),
    Sheffield Wednesday (2/23), Everton (1/23),
    Third Lanark (1/23), Middlesbrough (1/23),
    WBA (1/23), Celtic (1/23), Bristol City (1/23),
    Rangers (1/23), Sheffield United (1/23),
    Swindon Town (1/23), West Ham (1/23),
    Burnley (1/23), Aston Villa (1/23).

    League
    English League (20/23) [Southern League (2/23)]
    Scottish League (3/23)

    Robert Evans played first years for Wales, and then England because of a technicality. I consider him Welsh.

    I should probably have found room for Danny Shea last season already in the Dream 23; most likely on expense of Harold Fleming.

    Dream Team 1911-12, 2-3-5:
    Billy Scott (Everton) - Bob Crompton (Blackburn), Jesse Pennington (WBA) - Charlie Thomson (Sunderland), Charlie Roberts (Manchester United), Billy Wedlock (Bristol City) - Jock Simpson (Blackburn), Harold Fleming (Swindon), Bert Freeman (Burnley), George Holley (Sunderland), Walter Aitkenhead (Blackburn).
     

Share This Page