Best technique

Discussion in 'Players & Legends' started by Alessandro10, Jan 30, 2019.

  1. Alessandro10

    Alessandro10 Member

    Dec 6, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    The more I watch Baggio the more I admire how awesome technique. Might even put him ahead of Bergkamp.
     
    Edhardy repped this.
  2. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Mmm Baggio , Del P , Pirlo or Totti ?
     
  3. Alessandro10

    Alessandro10 Member

    Dec 6, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    In terms of technique: Baggio, Cassano, Del Piero, Totti and Pirlo.
     
    TitoTata repped this.
  4. Alessandro10

    Alessandro10 Member

    Dec 6, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    A possible top 15 in terms of best technique:
    1. Maradona
    2. Zidane
    3. Ronaldinho
    4. Baggio
    5. Bergkamp
    6. Magico Gonzalez
    7. Cassano
    8. Stojkovic
    9. Messi
    10 Isco
    11. Francescoli
    12. Zico
    13.Ibrahimovic
    14. Romario
    15. Recoba
    You could swap some players between each other.
     
  5. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
  6. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Mmmm I’d put Hoddle , Le Tissier and Raquelme in there ...
     
  7. Alessandro10

    Alessandro10 Member

    Dec 6, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Paul Gascoigne could also be in this group. He wasn't inferior to Hoddle technically.
     
  8. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018


    IMO better technique than someone like Cristiano Ronaldo.
     
    Edhardy repped this.
  9. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nah.

    I'm sure someone can find a youtube clip with Ronaldo's ridiculous technique as well, although I personally can't recollect any.

    What makes me pretty sure Ronaldo is a better technician is that his technical application, at his peak, was actually more consistent than Henry's application at his peak.
     
  10. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
     
  11. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Here's a better one with slow skills and also showing his dexterity with the ball

    Tropiero contradicts himself all the time (whatever suits the argument)
    At one point 'elo rankings' show that at 24 years old CR is levels above Diego Maradona
    Now he is inferior to TH14 (technically or whatever)


    The irony here is actually quite humorous
    His idol Pele( the one whom he advocates on behalf of quite vehemently)said quite explicitly that Cristiano Ronaldo was one of the most technically gifted footballers he saw in his life.

    Here in 2009

    "Cristiano reminds me so much of a player who I thought was brilliant - George Best,” said the samba star.

    “He is the closest I have seen to Best since he was at his peak, due to the way he runs with the ball at speed, on the left and right, and with such skill.

    “I love watching Ronaldo - he's an incredibly talented individual.”
    https://www.goal.com/en/news/9/engl...stiano-ronaldo-reminds-me-of-george-best-pele


    In 2009 and before he joined real Madrid he already had:

    More ballon dor podium positions than Thierry Henry

    More ESM monthly rankings than Thierry Henry

    More champions league knockout goals than Thierry Henry

    More goals in a single season than Thierry Henry

    More goals in major finals than Thierry Henry

    Ranked by DBS calico as the premier leagues top performer more times than Thierry Henry

    BTW I don't make this up
    Its a lopsided comparison

    Summarised briefly below by the independent

    "No player has ever dominated and decided the Premier League like Cristiano Ronaldo did for Manchester United between 2006 and 2009. Those three straight title-winning seasons – he won the 2008 Champions League too - remain the high-point for consistent performance in the history of this competition. And he was only 24 when he left for Real Madrid"
    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/premier-league-at-25-greatest-players-ranked-jack-pitt-brooke-a7886646.html?amp?espv=1

    This was (already) a historic player despite the revisionism and nostalgia permeating Big soccer
    No doubt about this

    TBH I think tropiero just discovered how great TH14 was
    A generational talent whos technical abilities manifested more towards the end of his peak
    This is why I primarily disagree with sexy beasts assertion that mbappe has little room left for technical improvements(still 20 years old)

    The Thierry Henry of 2002-2004 (his physical peak)

    and the one of 2005/06 are very different players
    Puck can maybe elaborate on this but I think TH14 lost something of his explosiveness in 2005 so he had to make some adjustments to his game

    Make no mistake though despite what has been said Thierry Henry is underrated.
    I never understood why( on BS in particular) van Basten/Romario/R9 are commonly cited as the de facto top 3 best strikers of the last 30 or so years

    What is the reason for TH14s omission?
    He was absent in finals?
    Romario was great in finals?

    In terms of the all round I think he was as capable as any of them
    Luis Suarez too (his October to December 2013 form)
    I think it's just a generational thing although I feel Henry may not benefit from the same type of post retirement revisionism as Romario/R9.

    Because he played for a unfashionable club
    Was not particularly good in finals (Romario was?)
    Most importantly though for those who consider themselves football purists he wasn't a genius with the ball at his feet.
    Again this comes down to preference (Henry controlling the ball at full pelt is arguably more difficult than Zidane trapping the ball with acres of space and no pressure)
     
  12. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Cronaldo the closest to George Best ?? Complete and utter bollox
     
  13. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #363 carlito86, Nov 16, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
    Bobby Charlton(teammate of George Best)
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/f...reatest-says-Sir-Bobby-Charlton-Football.html

    Denis law(teammate of George Best)
    https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...tball-news/law-ronaldo-can-be-the-best-989337

    Paddy Crerand(teammate of George best)
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...-Why-I-believe-Ronaldo-great-George-Best.html

    Johan Cruyff(played against George Best)
    https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/johan-cruyff-pays-cristiano-ronaldo-725552

    Pele (contemporary of George best)
    Link posted already


    Tito tata don't take this offensively but on the scale how much is your opinion worth in comparison?

    When the legends speak just be quiet and listen
    Not just any legends but first hand witnesses who saw George Best,played with and trained with him at his absolute peak(not on a tv screen or YouTube but just yards away)
     
  14. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Fair point ... although I did see him play in the flesh a few times ..

    There’s no comparison in their running and dribbling technique and George was a ferocious tackler and he played FOR the team .. Cronaldo has played for HIMSELF from day one
     
  15. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #365 carlito86, Nov 16, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
    If you was 10 in 1967 (Eusebios charity match)
    You was an 11 year old when George Best was at his absolute peak

    So on the scale there is an 11 year old kid who caught glimpses of George Best
    Then there is Bobby Charlton, Pele, Johan Cruyff etc
    (Contemporaries, teammates, friends, adversaries vs 11 year old)
    A 'ferocious' double tackle in the snow

    4:22
     
  16. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Nobody in the world would ever say Cronaldo was a good tackler :)

    If he got stuck in that one time then the other guy probably ruffled his hair up a bit :)

    Apart from a few times live , I’ve also seen an awful lot of footage of Best over the years sooooool...
     
  17. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    :ROFLMAO:

    You are confusing things, technique with consistency or having impact. Some players have more technique than others and still produce less impact. Or will you tell me that Cristiano Ronaldo has more technique than Maradona, Bergkamp, Baggio, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho or even Isco just because he was more consistent in in his 'technial application'? Whatever you mean by technical application.

    PD: I checked now and PES Stats favours TH peak over CR peak in technique, so don't talk me what I saw was completely absurd.
     
  18. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    :ROFLMAO:

    That is Cristiano's peak season according the most of his fans:

     
  19. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #369 carlito86, Nov 16, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
    According to pes Thierry Henry is as 'technical' as Ronaldo de lima 1997/98
    Both rated 96 in their prime

    There is no way in hell you would agree with this

    Henry at 96 is also more technical than gheorghe hagi and Micheal Laudrup on 95 according to pes stats an assertion that literally no one with an ounce of common sense would agree with

    Ive never heard you mention TH14 before like ever
    I think maybe you're just getting a bit carried away with this new discovery
    (A comp I posted over a year ago now)
     
  20. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    Elo rankings show CR is level above Maradona??? o_Oo_Oo_O


    IMO there is no problem CR being inferior technically to TH, Football Manager for his 2010-2011 and 2012-2013 seasons had him with 17 technique (out of 20 for example) it is still good.

    In FM 2012 (basedon on 2010-2011 and part of 11-12 season), 50 players had more technique than him (18 or over): Messi, Gotze, Fabregas, Iniesta, David Silva, Ozil, Rossi, Modric, Juan Mata, Hazard, Neymar, Robben, Pastore, Douglas Costa, Robinho, Ganso, Kaka, Ramsey, Ibrahimovic, Xavi, Xabi Prieto, Cazorla, Riquelme, Diego, Ronaldinho Gaucho, Wijnaldum among others.

    In the FM2014 (based on 2012-2013 and part of 2013-14 season)

    20 Technique:
    [​IMG]

    18 or more:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  21. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    Just because I didn't mention Henry it means I didn't follow Henry? Henry has been one of my favorite players since the time of the Joga Bonito or the Invencibles, a very technical player and beautiful to see.

    And another for you, technique is something that we see with our own eyes while watching (not based on stats imo), is how I said times ago that the João Felix boy has the technique, for me he just has, he is easy to see. Cristiano Ronaldo was or is also much more consistent than João Felix or other name you can put here, but his technique is harder to get in first sight, he is not exactly beautiful to watch.

    I posted that video, because a 30-minute video covering a single season gives you a good sense of each player's best moves and plays. If you watch these videos I posted and find that Cristiano Ronaldo was more technically impressive OK, nothing wrong with that, I was more impressed with Henry.
     
  22. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Is tropiero is the most dishonest,hypocritical and disingenuous fan to ever emerge on big soccer?

    And now for the final nail in the coffin....

    103087229-the-rat-is-banned-crossed-out-with-the-no-sign.jpg
     
  23. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    #373 Tropeiro, Nov 16, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
    What does all this have to do with technique and being a better player?
    You are confusing things and extrapolating my comments dude like is your typical. Btw, some user here already said that your textual comprehension is below average.

    I will explain it to you:

    According Elo and Goalimpact (even tho it is not perfect for South American players) It can be said that Cristiano Ronaldo arguably had more impact with Real Madrid and Manchester than Maradona with Napoli or Barcelona (need more analysis tho) and of course he won Champions League's that combines to a best club carrer overall and maybe a greater or more accomplished player.

    Again it need much better and deep analysis. Something you can do for exemple.

    But, Zico for example with Udinese had more positive impact than the best rated season of Maradona in Italy.

    ==> Zico 1983/1984 (his best rated league season in Italy)

    with Zico
    + 40 Points in 24 Matches (1.67 Points per Game)
    Before his injury
    +54.5, 20 Matches = (2.72 Points per Game)

    without Zico
    - 23.4 Points in 6 Matches (- 3.9 Points per Game)


    ==> Maradona 1984/1985 (his best rated season in Italy)


    Maradona +33.5 in 30 matches (1.12 Points per Game)


    ==> Platini 1983/1984 (his best rated season in Italy)

    with Platini
    + 1 Point in 28 Matches (0.04 Points per Game)

    without Platini
    +4 Points in 2 Matches (2 Points per Game)

    This is about club impact.

    Now, Is Zico better than Maradona since the technique perspective? I don't know, Guerin Sportivo rated both as 10 in techinque.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Could Cristiano Ronaldo won a 10 in technique nowadays?
    Football Manager, for example, don't think so. If he is 17, then he is 8.5 in technique. That is good, just below the great technicians of his generation.


    PD Elo don't judge players or technique period
    ...btw it applies to you too:

    Pd: I was talked about João Felix, he actually has 18 on pure technique in FM2020 for example, over 17 of Cristiano Ronaldo.

    https://fmdataba.com/20/p/147213/jo-o-felix/
    https://fmdataba.com/20/p/147187/cristiano-ronaldo/

    For FM:
    Technique is the aesthetic quality of a player’s technical game – how refined they appear to be with the ball. A player with high Technique will be more likely to pull off a tricky pass or a cross-field ball with greater ease than someone less technically able. This in turn affects a number of technical attributes – poorer Technique will let a player down.

    [​IMG]

    The other technical attributes is a mix of pure technique, mental and physcal abilities. https://www.footballmanagerblog.org/2018/04/technical-attributes-football-manager-guide.html
     
  24. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member

    Jun 1, 2018
    Now if you think Cristiano is a virtuoso, an extremely refined player who amazes you with his skills in most of his games OK. I give him consistency in his form, in the most basic fundamentals, mentality and physical power, to perform certain difficult actions on the field I think other players could do better, in many areas, than him.
     
  25. Alessandro10

    Alessandro10 Member

    Dec 6, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Technique in PES language just means the first touch, not the overall technique.
     

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