I think you’d actually expect good teams to respond to that kind of organized low block by overloading the midfield and wide areas to get the ball into the attacking third and then patiently circulating the ball there probing for an opening. The teams facing Argentina instead circulated the ball and probed mostly in the middle of the pitch instead of pouring forward to get the ball into more dangerous positions. You don’t have to do that, and it’s not the way to score the most against that defense. But you do it if pouring forward is too risky. In general, I think you should ask yourself whether it really is typically the case that one team playing a defensive, compact, low block actually results in the other team playing cautiously. You’re making that claim but I really don’t think that’s right at all. Teams basically always respond to those kinds of tactics by pushing up and attacking, unless they’re really afraid of what the opposing team’s attacking players can do in space on the counterattack. We see these kinds of matches all the time in club football, and it doesn’t usually create the tactical result you’re suggesting it does. The fact that Argentina didn’t have much else going forward is exactly why Messi should get the lion’s share of the credit when it comes to opponents not wanting to commit fully to attacking. You’re right that Messi wouldn’t have much to create danger with him. But Messi himself carries the big risk of beating multiple players and making a solo play or near-solo play. Teams really don’t want to give him space to do that. Possession-based teams typically do what I described above: They get the ball into the attacking third and probe for openings, rather than staying in the middle third. They do this by pushing players forward and creating overloads that allow them to advance the ball into the attacking third and then they probe from there. The result is significantly more of the game played in the attacking third than teams had against Argentina and significantly less of the game played in the middle third than in those Argentina games. So no, I don’t think Argentina’s tactics are adequate to explain what happened. Possession-based teams face those sorts of tactics all the time—often against teams with defensive talent, not to mention opponents often having more defensive organization than any NT can have. The result usually really isn’t like 2014 Argentina’s matches. Fear of Argentina’s attack pretty clearly changed the tactical outlook, and as you point out, there wasn’t much in Argentina’s attack to force that besides Messi.
I think you're skipping an important part of the picture. Your argument depends on a false tactical dichotomy. You assume that if Germany or the Netherlands weren't constantly attacking the final third, it must have been because they were afraid of Messi. But football doesn't work like that. The defending team also determines where the match is played. You're treating Argentina's defense like it was just sitting on the edge of its own box waiting to react. In reality, Sabella's midfield constantly closed the central spaces. Germany and the Netherlands spent so much time in the middle third because breaking through Mascherano, Biglia and the rest of that defensive block was extremely difficult, not simply because Messi's presence scared them away. I don't think that conclusion really follows either. You argue that because Messi was Argentina's only real attacking threat, he deserves almost all the credit for the opponents' caution. The same fact actually cuts the other way. Once Di María was out, Agüero wasn't fully fit and Messi was isolated, an elite coach like Van Gaal or Löw could reasonably conclude that the odds of Argentina producing a devastating long distance counterattack were relatively low. What they still had to solve was one of the best defensive structures in the tournament. That alone explains why so much of the game became a slow battle in midfield without assuming fear of Messi was the main driving force. The comparison with club football has the same problem. You're assuming the tactical principles transfer directly when the conditions are completely different. Possession teams like Guardiola's Barcelona or Manchester City spend years developing the chemistry needed to overload low blocks in the final third. National teams simply don't have that level of coordination. Germany circulated the ball through midfield because international possession football is naturally slower, more cautious and less polished than elite club football. That explanation already accounts for what happened without needing Messi's presence to be the primary cause.
Continuing my research on players who scored 5 or more goals in a single world cup edition from 1930 till 2026 and here are the results: 1930 WC: 2 players Guillermo Stabile 8 goals Pedro Cea 5 goals 1934 WC: 1 player Oldrich Najedly 5 goals 1938 WC: 4 players Leónidas 7 goals György Sárosi 5 goals Gyula Zsengellèr 5 goals Silvio Piola 5 goals 1950 WC: 2 players Adèmir 9 goals Óscar Míguez 5 goals 1954 WC: 4 players Sándor Koscis 11 goals Erich Probst 6 goals Josef Hügi 6 goals Max Morlock 6 goals 1958 WC: 5 players Just Fontaine 11 goals Pelé 6 goals Helmut Rahn 6 goals Vavá 5 goals Peter McParland 5 goals 1962 WC: 0 players 1966 WC: 2 players Eusebio 9 goals Helmut Haller 6 goals 1970 WC: 3 players Gerd Müller 10 goals Jairzinho 7 goals Teófillo Cubillas 5 goals 1974 WC: 3 players Grzegorz Lato 7 goals Johan Neeskens 5 goals Andrzej Szarmach 5 goals 1978 WC: 3 players Mario Kempes 6 goals Rob Rensebrink 5 goals Tèofillo Cubillas 5 goals 1982 WC: 2 players Paolo Rossi 6 goals Karl Heinz Rummenigge 5 goals 1986 WC: 4 players Gary Lineker 6 goals Diego Maradona 5 goals Careca 5 goals Emilio Butragueno 5 goals 1990 WC: 2 players Salvatore Schilacci 6 goals Tomas Skuhravy 5 goals 1994 WC: 6 players Hristo Stoichkov 6 goals Oleg Salenko 6 goals Roberto Baggio 5 goals Romario 5 goals Jürgen Klinsmann 5 goals Kennet Anderson 5 goals 1998 WC: 3 players Davor Suker 6 goals Christian Vieri 5 goals Gabriel Batistuta 5 goals 2002 WC: 3 players Ronaldo Nazario 8 goals Rivaldo 5 goals Miroslav Klose 5 goals 2006 WC: 1 player Miroslav Klose 5 goals 2010 WC: 4 players David Villa 5 goals Wesley Schneider 5 goals Diego Forlan 5 goals Thomas Muller 5 goals 2014 WC: 2 players James Rodriguez 6 goals Thomas Muller 5 goals 2018 WC: 1 player Harry Kane 6 goals 2022 WC: 2 players Kylian Mbappe 8 goals Lionel Messi 7 goals 2026 WC: 7 players Kylian Mbappe 10 goals Lionel Messi 8 goals Erling Halaand 7 goals Jude Bellingham 7 goals Harry Kane 6 goals Ousmane Dembele 6 goals Mikel Oyarzabal 5 goals If the 2030 world cup will have 64 teams there would be no doubt that the number of players to score 5 or more goals will increase.
Incredible colourised footage of THAT dragback from Ferenc Puskas! 🇭🇺 pic.twitter.com/Ekn1SSJD9m— The Football History Boys (@TFHBs) July 25, 2026 How Puskas made a patsy out of Wright | The Independent | The Independent
Eusébio between 1964-66 (Prime) 122 games 152 goals (1.25) 354 team goals (2.90) 42.94% goal contribution Ronaldo between 1997-99 (Prime) 153 games 107 goals (0.70) 316 team goals (2.07) 33.86% goal contribution
Not Mbappe, not Messi, he is the player with the sharpest on point reactions of all time. It is like watching a Olympic, Tier A level athlete playing football.
One player on this list of top scorers surprised me very positively— the player named Waldo. He finishes with the same style as Pelé.
Gerd Muller vs Atletico Madrid 1974 European Cup Final(1-1) pic.twitter.com/77VtP2RHDO— NOT THERE BECAUSE NOT RATED (@da_ratingrating) July 31, 2026
Ronaldinho's numbers are rather poor considering his reputation, as a matter of fact. But Zidane is even worse (that is, overrated) in this respect.
yes , I consider Zinedine Zidane overrated too. Honestly speaking to you Frank 73, I consider all players from 1996 to 2026 to be super - overrated. Because of global marketing and professional football since 1996, becoming very very media-savvy and with global marketing around us. These media-savvy and famous players are signing bigger contracts with major global brands. like Nike , Adidas , Coca Cola, Pepsi , Rexona , Gatorade , Puma ..etc.. famous commercials airing around the world But Zidane— at least in decisive matches— delivered much more++++ than Ronaldinho Gaucho and what's more, Zidane put in a lot of defensive work-rate too during the seasons the 1995–1996 Bordeaux season mainly the 1996–1997 season for Juve and the 1997/98 season to some extent, too Zidane was more complete than Ronaldinho.
on Neymar Jr & on Ronaldinho Bruxo honestly speaking to you personally i prefer Didi Folha Seca , Zagallo Mario , Zico , Clodoaldo , Rivellino , Jairzinho & Tostão for sure .. Zico & Didi were more complete players .than both of them Ney & o Bruxo Ronaldinho .."!
There is more to the game than assists and goals zidane kept the ball well and was a great passer. He could drive the ball anywhere on the pitch and create secondary assists. Good ball winner and aerial threat etc xavi, Iniesta and busquets are the best midfield 3 I have ever seen, their basic stats are poor for goals and assists etc but look how dominant they were
Zidane would not play as deep as Xavi, not even as Iniesta. He was a "trequartista", like Platini, and in the NT often deployed as a forward. His G+A numbers are a bit underwhelming as a matter of fact. Much in the same way as Van Basten's, his reputation has been boosted by a handful of landmark performances that happened to be watched by billions of people in the world (and this could well be down to virtue, actually, not necessarily a twist of fate). But if we consider the whole career, he has fallen short of matching players who are nowhere near his usual positioning in the best ever rankings.
Hum... no. Zidane didn't play as deep as Platini but -at the same time- he didn't play as far forward. Their average position is the same, but Platini had a much more 'vertical' game, whereas Zidane played on the whole width of the field (much more on the left side than on the right side though). I once calculated that Zidane either scored or set up (through assists or secondary assists) 70 goals (in 108 caps) with France.
Ronaldinho left Brazilian national team perhaps too early. He could have played in the 2010 (he would be 30 years old) and 2014 (34 years old) World Cups. He played in only one edition of the Copa América (1999) in his entire career. We know the reason (lack of professionalism), but it's still a strange case for a Ballon d'Or winner to be sidelined by his national team. Neymar has incredible numbers for the national team, but he hasn't won any major titles. Even though he won the 2013 Confederations Cup, it's considered a minor tournament. To make matters worse, even the Copa América that Brazil won during this period (2019) was without him in the squad. Zidane was the greatest playmaker I have ever seen. Goals, assists, and even pre-assists fail to measure the work he did on the pitch. Yeah, he’s no Pelé, but if you compare him to other amazing World Cup-winning playmakers like Gerson/Rivellino in '70, Overath in '74, Ardiles in '78, Antognioni in '82, Xavi, Iniesta, Kroos, etc., I’m still taking Zizou.
Platini is embracing this more media-driven and more ++++ modern era of the world football. If Xavi is treated like a god nowadays , imagine Platini. He would be treated like a true alien. ! Platini, the best playmaker in history Platini and Didi