Highest rated goalkeeper: 2003-04: Ovchinnokov 2004-05: Dida 2005-06: Dida 2006-07: Dida 2007-08: Nikopolidis (VdS 3rd) 2008-09: Van der Sar 2009-10: Van der Sar 2010-11: Van der Sar Highest rated CB: 2003-04: Maldini 2004-05: Ricardo Carvalho 2005-06: Ricardo Carvalho 2006-07: Plestan (Lille), Pepe (Porto) 2007-08: Vidic 2008-09: Vidic 2009-10: Lucio 2010-11: Vidic LB: 2003-04: Evra 2004-05: Traore 2005-06: Van Bronckhorst 2006-07: Riise 2007-08: Abidal 2008-09: Clichy 2009-10: Tremoulinas (Alvaro Pereira, Pjanic) 2010-11: Marcelo (Evra) DM: 2003-04: Gattuso 2004-05: Makelele 2005-06: Frings 2006-07: Gattuso 2007-08: Mascherano 2008-09: Cambiasso 2009-10: Van Bommel 2010-11: Busquets AM: 2003-04: Deco 2004-05: Lampard 2005-06: Lampard 2006-07: Gerrard 2007-08: Gerrard 2008-09: Lampard 2009-10: Sneijder 2010-11: Sneijder 2011-12: Ozil (Sneijder is 2nd) Strikers: 2003-04: Morientes 2004-05: Van Nistelrooij 2005-06: Eto'o 2006-07: Van Nistelrooij 2007-08: Van Nistelrooij 2008-09: Benzema 2009-10: Ibrahimovic -------------------------------------- For 2005-06, I had a question mark after Kaladze his name but it appears he played as CB or RB then, not LB. Central midfield is not easy: M. Diara can be a defensive midfielder too. I tend to see Fabregas as an attacking midfielder. As I already mentioned in the Modric thread, Pirlo does have a margin to his peers for 2003-04, but really not the other seasons (or the order reversed). RB: 2003-04: Salgado 2004-05: no RB in top 50 (Traore, Gallas etc. are all left-backs) 2005-06: Kaladze 2006-07: Chalme, Sagnol 2007-08: Dani Alves (Sevilla) 2008-09: Sergio Ramos, O'Shea (just 0.04 behind), Maicon, Alves 2009-10: Dani Alves CM: 2003-04: Pirlo (Ze Roberto? Beckham?) 2004-05: Xavi 2005-06: M. Diarra (Seedorf, Barry Ferguson, Pirlo - a number are close) 2006-07: Essien (Pirlo, Seedorf - all very close) 2007-08: Xavi 2008-09: Xavi 2009-10: Xavi
Michel Platini 1982/87 5 years in a row : 224 matches 104 goals 100 assists ( direct assists and indirect assists too ) 0, 46, 40 % average of goals 0, 44 , 64 % average of assists Titles Platini's Juventus 1 x Coppa Italia 1983 1x Cup winners Cup 1984 2x Calcio Serie A Italian 1984 and 1986 1x Uefa Super-Cup Final 1984 against Liverpool ... 1985 was cancelled by tragedy Heisel 1x Fifa Club World Cup 1985 1x Uefa Champions League 1985 1x runners-up in 1983 against Hamburg Uefa Champions League 1X Super Mundialito des Clubs 1983 against : Flamengo... Ac Milan ... Penãrol ... vs Ronaldinho Assis de Moreira Gaucho 2003/08 5 years in a row : 207 matches 94 goals 71 assists ( direct assists and indirect assists too ) 0, 45, 40 % average of goals 0, 34, 29 % averaga of assists Titles Ronaldinho's Barça 2 x La Liga 2X Spanish -Supercup 1x Uefa Champions League 2006
Priority 5 # Have at least 8 players highly focused on making or completing the main coverages for the team .... tackles ... interceptions ... duels won .. equally extraordinary for tackles, interceptions, winning duels at the match covering for the team..with movement, explosion and very high mobility for the team stamina ....aswell examples this : Claude Makelele ... JOhan Neeskens ...Arie Haan ...Blakenburg ... Hulshoff .... Vasovic... ...Edgar Davids ( til 1998 ) ... Mauro Ramos ....Rijsbergen ...Ruud Krol Kyle Walker ( younger ) Costa Curta ( til 1994 ) Franco Baresi Paolo Maldini ( til 1994 ) Tassotti Bergomi Michel Platini Jean Tigana Ruud Gullit Patrick Vieira Fernando Redondo ( til 2000) Scirea Sir Bobby Moore Cabrini Gentile Marcel Desailly Alfredo Di Stefano JOhan Cruyff Edson Arantes Pelé Berti Vogts Franz Beckenbauer Breitner Hans-Georg Schwarzenbeck etc .... in this part there .. Ronald Koeman stays behind on my view : he was too slow to do the main covers to any team without mobility without explosion without reactions to act faster without agility without sprint speed
We're used to seeing Ancelotti's Milan as some super team because of the legendary names in the first Xl, but when I rewatched Milan vs Rijkaard's Barca in 04/05 and 05/06, it was painfully clear which team was playing better football. In 04/05, Milan scored first and became typical Italian pragmatists, tactically managing a lead rather than pressing a brand of football. In this situation, offensive players tend to play within themselves and dedicate energy to defense and running. Milan ended up going through the tie, but they were outplayed in a football sense.That didn't matter to them though. Ancelotti likes to play attackers in the lineup, and his teams, especially Milan, were capable of free-flowing brilliance at their best, but he is also a pragmatic manager who relies on player brilliance to decide games. In 05/06, when Milan's team was over the hill (I know they won again in 06/07, but really not at the same level of before), Rijkaard's Barca, even without Xavi, were comfortably better. They dominated the midfield similarly to Pep's teams.
Clarence has a (way) better SC rating than Pirlo in three of the four of those matches against Barcelona (and also in some media) in part because he was very press-resistant. Or how Ferdinand felt it: 'you could not take the ball from him'. The other match is where he came in as substitute, returning from injury. Whether it is in passing volume, ESM, sofascore or DBScalcio: the dominance for Pirlo is just not there while for Xavi or Modric you can point to certain things where they are 'dominant'. Ancelotti is just not a great domestic league manager in my book. He left and Milan won promptly another league title in 2011. Ancelotti has managed some of the most stacked teams in recent history, including Bayern around 2017, and what he has done with them in the league is relatively dissapointing. Even PSG was not safe and a guaranteed title when he was manager. I'd agree Barcelona was generally fine without Xavi and actually also without Messi (until around 2017, after that it changes). For a long time Barcelona had a better record without Messi as with him. Busquets or Yaya Touré was harder to replace than Xavi was and in effect more crucial. Dani Alves harder to replace too. I suppose it doesn't fit certain stories, narratives and material interests to keep the memory of Rijkaard's Barcelona alive. But the cycle really started there and then petered out after Luis Enrique left (and imho, they had to get rid of Messi to win another league title again). Guardiola did some things different and was an improvement yes (this chequebook manager added Dani Alves, Villa, Ibrahimovic and was in that sense more privileged than Rijkaard, because the 2003 Ronaldinho actually didn't have the status Neymar had in 2013... Barcelona needed to cut the budget in 2003...) but already before Barcelona was more proactive and more glamarous than the disjointed Real Madrid teams (Van Nistelrooij only getting two chances or less per game! Literally!) or what Ferguson, Benitez and Mourinho stood for. Or what Magath did with Bayern Munich. You can even argue the Rijkaard/Ronaldinho era depended less on luck and fortune as what Pep's Barca needed (with Angel Maria Villar and pals providing the cover and backing from 2008 onward, if I am cynical).
Passes per game in UCL (sofascore) Barcelona Before Guardiola, Barcelona had 60% possession and 450 passes per game. With Guardiola, from the second season onwards, 70% possession and 600-700 passes per game. Although Barcelona were already a possession team, possession and passing volume increased considerably. Just as we all suspected
Honestly .. Barcelona (Messi ) can't be compared with Barcelona(Ronaldinho) is crazything ! Barcelona ( Messi ) was much better than Barcelona ( Ronaldinho) in any aspect of the game . even JUventus (Michel Platini) and Ac Milan ( Van Basten and Ruud Gullit ) was better too than Barcelona (Ronaldinho )
Priority 6 # At least two players highly specialized in assists...Top assisters Of Elite in the World ! EXamples : Ruud Gullit ( 3 x best assisters at Eredivisie ... 1983/84 22 assists , 1985/86 17 assists, 1986/87 21 assists, 3x best assisters at Italian League ... 1987/88 ... 10 assists , 1991/92 10 assists shared with Van Basten also with 10 assists , 1993/94 14 assists for Sampdoria year ) Kevin de Bruyne ( 22 assists at Bundesliga ), Marcelinho Carioca ( 289 assists ), Zico ( 270 assists ), JOhan Cruyff ( 360 assists ) ... Puskas ( 404 assists in 792 matches ), Stanley Matthews ( 301 assists ), Messi , Maradona , Michel Platini ( 232 assists ), Pelé , Didi, Alex Overath, Netzer, Beckenbauer ... etc...
quite forgotten unfortunately: Why unfortunately ????? so many many teams forward than this Rijkaard's Barcelona for example Real Madrid ( 1954 til 1966) Santos Fc (1959 til 1965) Ac Milan ( 1987 til 1996 ) JUventus Turin ( 1982 til 1987 ) Barcelona ( 2008 til 2015 ) Bayern Munich ( 1966 til 1977 ) Ajax ( 1969 til 1973 ) Real Madrid ( 2013 til 2018 ) Liverpool ( 1973 til 1985 ) Barcelona ( 1952 til 1961 ) etc .. etc. etc ..
History has been re-written as if Pep completely reconfigured Barcelona and invented "modern football" with "high pressing", "build from the back", etc. when these were key features developed by Rijkaard in the team he inherited.
yes .... i agree with you ...dear mate ! on this topic .... i saw videos already of River Plate La Maquina 40's ...they yes invented "modern football" with "high pressing", "build from the back" ... Hungary National Team Side 50's too !
Debatable imo. Ronaldinho's first three season at Barca was extremely good with high positive impact. Two La Liga's and a UCL as a main character. He was more than often called the best player in the world at that time. Platini his first three season at Juve were very good too. don't mind.
for me for me hasn't debate this .... is not my opinion .... are real facts showed there : Michel Platini 1982/87 5 years in a row : 224 matches 104 goals 100 assists ( direct assists and indirect assists too ) 0, 46, 40 % average of goals 0, 44 , 64 % average of assists Titles Platini's Juventus 1 x Coppa Italia 1983 1x Cup winners Cup 1984 2x Calcio Serie A Italian 1984 and 1986 1x Uefa Super-Cup Final 1984 against Liverpool ... 1985 was cancelled by tragedy Heisel 1x Fifa Club World Cup 1985 1x Uefa Champions League 1985 1x runners-up in 1983 against Hamburg Uefa Champions League 1X Super Mundialito des Clubs 1983 against : Flamengo... Ac Milan ... Penãrol ... vs Ronaldinho Assis de Moreira Gaucho 2003/08 5 years in a row : 207 matches 94 goals 71 assists ( direct assists and indirect assists too ) 0, 45, 40 % average of goals 0, 34, 29 % averaga of assists Titles Ronaldinho's Barça 2 x La Liga 2X Spanish -Supercup 1x Uefa Champions League 2006 Michel Platini is at least 0, 11 % go ahead of Ronaldinho Gaucho Italian Championship 80's was harder than La Liga !
Okay... Pirlo has generally better SofaScore ratings than Seedorf but whatever. Maybe we should agree to disagree over the Pirlo Seedorf thing . They are both world class players (Seedorf is a favourite of mine, believe it or not) which means there isn't much to split their levels, but i don't think the fact that Pirlo was considered Milan's most important midfielder for nearly a decade is really up for debate. I don't want to devolve into cherry picking little statistical tidbits to suit a narrative.
We need to analyse it deeper. Match ratings, general impact on and off the team, performances in big matches, titles and so on.... and deeper if 1982-1986 Platini's Serie A was actually stronger than Ronaldinho's La Liga, going by Elo's ratings it was not. La Liga was the top rated league around 2003-2006, Ronaldinho his prime. I think you are downplaying Ronaldinho here. Ronaldinho imo can't be compared to Platini his consistency carrer and his NT carrer of course, but his first three seasons at Barcelona were very good and very comparable to Platini's first three seasons at Juve imo (his best seasons at Juve ofc). We can't deny for example Ronaldinho was the player with the most inclusions for the XI main team in three consecutive years (2004, 2005 and 2006) by the european media for example.
well ... ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JV5TC-tY04o&t=655s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dt7BJ0tixDs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PB5ysJ4bSs in big matches .... in Finals Michel Platini shine much more than Ronaldinho !
Those are abnormally high ratings for a centre back. Also worth noting that Ricardo Carvalho 04/05 made it to the CL SF stages(not a R16 exit) He astonishingly made 24 tackles against Liverpool in the SF across both legs(12 in each leg)
..... I saw this whole match against Celtic in 2003/04 UEFA Cup away game first leg Ronaldinho Highly positive points in this match : 10 Dribbles Attempts 7 Dribbles completed sucessfully What a Skill The game commentator said : Ronaldinho is coming off pretty impressed demonstration ... and very pretty skills ...but no endproduct for tonight ... he had chances tonight but he don't take it done correctly ! 3 Headers Won in the start of the game there ! 3 big chances created ( 2 to Javier Saviola and 1 to Luis Garcia ) 1 an amazing Long Pass to Saviola again.... 1 low cross .... 1 pre-assist ... to Saviola again good job mainly at shorts passes in speed ... Ronaldinho Highly negative points in this match : only Shot Attempts : 1 Shots on Target : 0 he kicked with left foot very bad .. in the first half .... he against the goalkeeper 1 vs 1 so he lost this chance to score there .... He should score for sure ... easier goal to make it happen . Tackles : 0 Interceptions : 0 Duels Won : 0 Covers to the team : 0 low effectiveness no Goals .... no Assists no Pre-Assists on this match low defensive work