Berhalter out as coach, per Doug McIntyre

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by soonertony, Jul 10, 2024.

  1. nycfc919

    nycfc919 Member+

    Aug 17, 2015
    Lot of hate toward Cherundolo. I actually think he’s got a lot of upside. The hate seems to be because he’s an American and has a current association with MLS.

    Renard has had some high points but he’s had many low points too. I’m not confident he’s actually a better option than the Mayor of Hannover.
     
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  2. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    I just hope it's a MLS coach. We need a CB pair urgent and we're not getting it from Europe. Someone who knows what he is doing will fix that first, and will call two MLS guys who can do it. Ream is only going to continue his decline and Richards won't be ready in time. We have far too little time to expect someone not familiar with the system to find the best possible pair.
     
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  3. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC

    He also used the tournament to build fitness for Adams which is a big error if you ask me - played CCV against all evidence that he was up to it - continued to play Richards when MLS cb might have been better (with perhaps a view to the long term) - he played Ream who hadn’t been playing or showing well (which goes against my argument perhaps but MLS cb might have been better) - he played WM in spite of his struggles. This could be evidence of him taking the Copa as life or death like the WC, but Adams really undermines that if you ask me.
     
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  4. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    Part of me feels that's a bit silly from the perspective that it's always quite different, each one.

    Arena II:
    The team was wracked by an endless litany of injuries: Mathis, Wolff, Eddie Johnson, Kyle Martino, John O'Brien, Convey, nearly every single up and comer we had from the '02 cycle was lost to injuries. The only guys that survived it were Donovan and McBride. He had to figure out how make it work in '06 after nearly everything he thought he'd have circa '02-'03 was lost or lesser versions due to injury. It was a total disaster, yes, but even w/everything going wrong, they tied Italy and were a bull---- Penalty for Ghana away from having everything to play for in the second half of matchday 3.

    Bradley:
    This was 100% about Klinsy being available. The question is whether Bradley earned the canning or not. I'd say the evidence is uneven at best. There was a dip, but the dip seemed at least in part about the heights they reached w/that attacking group of Donovan-Dempsey-Altidore-Davies being lost to Davies international career ending car wreck. The player podcasts have hinted that Bradley was erratic in terms of man management, and we all know he could be a mess w/lineups, everyone and their mother felt he botched the Ghana R16 lineup and they were right after all. I'm unsure, we know the problems related to the team botching development with the 1989-2005 cohort started showing at the senior level by his cycle....so, how much of this, if anything, was on Bradley?

    Klinsy:
    We know he got some big picture things right. Go to europe for the players, and schedule friendlies against the best, but beyond the big picture he was a mess in terms of the details and a disaster, and it just got worse the longer he was around and the worse the pool got. Nothing was fixing the '18 cycle, good coach or bad one.

    Berhalter II:
    Well a ton of us didn't want him in the first place, so there's that, for cycle II, it just looked like cycle I, but worse: the team was inconsistent and erratic just like it was previously, just moreso.


    To me, Klinsy, and Berhalter were stupid cycle II decisions for sure, Klinsy's problems were only going to be magnified by a weakening aging player pool, while Berhalter hadnt shown much ability to fix or improve in area's of weakness since covid hit and he got a chance to reboot from the stupid player decisions he was making in '19....

    But Arena and Bradley. They are much, much more open to debate. I don't think either of them had disappointing second cycles because of the second cycle curse, I think it was far more about the player pool problems they were afflicted with. Was Arena too conservative? Yes, but I dont think that's why things went wrong. Was Bradley meh at man management, yes, but was that problem bigger than the players aging, and Davies destroying his international career with a terrible clubbing decision that nearly killed him? Nope. And lets remember, he had a bad half. A bad half against a good El Tri. Every coach has had that. Every single one of them.

    So I don't know, a great coach? 2 cycles? I wouldn't write it off entirely. I'd just pay attention to the particulars. I felt Berhalter wasn't good to begin with, just middling, and the team was actively bad and stupid the past year when they weren't ridiculously inconsistent which was the killer. But I never would have hired him for a cycle II, as for Klinsy, I would have fired him in '13 or '15 once it became obvious the players weren't buying in anymore.

    But Arena and Bradley II's? I think they were fine and it was largely totally beyond their control.
     
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  5. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    Hate where?
     
  6. PhilipVU94

    PhilipVU94 Member

    Liverpool FC
    United States
    Jul 6, 2024
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And when you do, people say "OK OK OK, dominating qualifying with Saudi Arabia, whatever. Beating Argentina, nice appetizer. But a good coach would have gotten them playing consistent ball and making the knockouts, not just one flash of brilliance."

    Don't get me wrong, if you can get Regragui or Moriyasu instead, fine. I'm not sure they're looking for a new job though.
     
  7. kickin365

    kickin365 Member+

    Mar 4, 2002
    Not familiar with what system?
     
  8. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    if Low he probably should hire Ben Olsen as his assistant.
     
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  9. MuchoTakeItEasy

    MuchoTakeItEasy Member+

    LAFC
    United States
    May 16, 2015
    Land of the Free
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    why not Tab Ramos?
     
  10. dark knight

    dark knight Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 15, 1999
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    Well - he doesn’t work as well with my JLow and Ben joke.
     
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  11. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    I was ok with Gregg using Copa as prep for the World Cup.

    Very unpopular opinion at the time, but it made sense to me. We're not going to have anything else to fix the glaring issues we had. And we fixed some things, like finding the right striker (I think Balogun is it, unless something very bad happens, knock on wood), and establishing Turner as our best-possible in goal.

    We also found out Ream-Richards is not it, CCV is not it (something Gregg should have known), and MMA should be out.

    The negatives were not playing Johnny more. We needed to see what he can do. I'm afraid he will be the one crucial guy for us in '26, and he may not be good enough. IMO he has some abilities Adams never had, like better 1v1 dribbling ability (at least with Betis) and better vision for chance-creating. Adams, in offense, was null.

    But his defects are exactly where we lack the most: challenging and intercepting. Adams was superior in protecting our weak back line. Johnny doesn't do that for club, and I don't expect him to do that for country.

    Berhalter needed to test a two-man cover for the back line, because that's what we're going to need. You cannot have Musah there, he's a black hole for defensive duties in central midfield, it's why Milan moved him wide. Playing Adams and Musah as the CM double pivot means playing two guys who don't move laterally in a team where the fullbacks leave holes. At least Scally stood put, but that took away half of our bite.

    Then his total lack of flexibility. Even when he tried variations, his players reverted to the 4-3-3. A NT coach needs to offer more than a single Plan A. Berhalter never did more than that. Another bad point: sticking a CB pair where it was obvious Richards was not green-lighted to pass forward. He had to lay the ball to Tim, it was for Tim to make the decisions. If you don't trust your defender to make such a decision, then don't play him. And a last one: set pieces. Berhalter's set pieces have been garbage. A team like ours needs top notch set pieces. We don't generate enough chances to waste them! Our corners are also weak.

    I can see a case can be made for Berhalter using Copa as prep, after all a World Cup at home is our sweetest chance to make a QF run again. But I cannot see any way to excuse not making the right experiments, not at this point in the cycle. It was bad already that he got re-hired so late. If they were going to stick with him, it should have been right away then. Wasting one year was negligent, stupid.

    Now if we go for a coach from abroad, it'll be like going back to Square Zero. Can't afford that, the WC is almost here and we must aim to that QF spot. At this point, I don't see it happening. At best going out in the R16.
     
  12. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    With the players in MLS.
     
  13. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Gregg had already been in charge for 5 years. How much more 'prep' did he need?
     
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  14. laxcoach

    laxcoach Member+

    United States
    Jul 29, 2017
    intermountain west
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Give me a no nonsense technically astute head man. He can hire MLS guys as assistants to help with any current talent pool misses.
     
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  15. onefineesq

    onefineesq Member+

    Sep 16, 2003
    Laurel, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why do people keep saying this? Berhalter was not the manager. USSF could hire whomever they wanted. Yes, any idiot CAN sue for anything, but it does not mean you have a case that will withstqnd the first legal hurdle. What is the winnable theory of the case? Hey, they didnt hire me because I beat up my girlfriend 30 years ago? And? They can refuse to hire him because he picks his nose, for goodness' sake (which is why I would not hire Löw -- that is disgusting).
     
  16. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A foreign hire would add an assistant to his staff well versed in MLS.

    That isn't an issue.

    What is the issue with our CB's is it is just shuffling the deck as it is a pool of mediocrity on both sides of the pond. Same with GK. Some suggest Brooks. Others suggest Long. I don't know what else to say other than none are real upgrades.

    Just as big of an issue is the midfield in front of the CB's. We just saw a plan to have an out of form and erratic Adams who made a number of crazy undisciplined runs, with no real holding mid next to him, anchor the midfield which won't work. That puts a lot of pressure on the backline.
     
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  17. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    Twitter.
     
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  18. Ball Chucking Hack

    Jan 21, 2005
    Raleigh, NC
    Major? It is a concern. I don't have a specific tactical style. I just don't want to be bored. It should look something like soccer. I don't want to watch guys standing in neat rows. So something more aesthetically pleasing than that.
     
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  19. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    Hiring Renard would be kind of hilarious. Twitter Rando out there believes in the Almighty Rizz. “this coachz RIZZ iz going to make us cook!!!11!!1!!!1!1”

    This is an American World Cup. The incoming coach will have to relate to Americans.

    Cherundolo is an infinitely better choice than Rizznard.
     
  20. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    I would LOVE to see us bring in an innovator…what is more American than that?

    Bring in Fernando Diniz from Fluminense. It would be a great learning experience for the US players, hold true to our identity as innovators, and make us unpredictable.
     
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  21. dspence2311

    dspence2311 Member+

    Oct 14, 2007
    I know! Americans, amiright?
     
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  22. HScoach13

    HScoach13 Member+

    Nov 30, 2016
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Was it Gregg or USSF. Michael Kamerman was quick to jump in and lower expectations during a pre Copa players interview. Was Kamerman doing so on behalf of the Fed or Gregg?
     
  23. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    Its immaturity.

    We can deduce that these ridiculous impulsive video game based narratives are being pushed by school-aged kids, from ages 13-22. Its pretty easy to deduce that they have no prior knowledge or experience other than what is immediately in front of them and that they have not yet discovered that a world exists outside of themselves that may help them to form better ideas. They’re just kids. Sometimes kids can contribute new and beneficial ideas, but this group seems to be really detached from reality and immature as a whole.
     
  24. soccermilitant

    soccermilitant Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    St.paul
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Twitter will have a meltdown
     
  25. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    The accountability crew should absolutely love him. I do have a morbid curiosity about the meltdown that would occur when he benches half the favorites for players who work hard and listen to him all the while saying he can't work with shit talent and that the fans are morons.

    Ok, I talked myself into it.
     

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