Bad stories

Exactly. Not sure why an AR would stop running, especially if there’s a chance a second or third attacker may be on or offf and about to be involved or not involved with play. Too many factors. If all are onside, no one is hurt with a discreet signal showing the ref that.

The guidance even allows for that:
Gestures
As a general rule, the AR should not use obvious hand signals. However, in some instances, a discreet hand signal may assist the referee. The hand signal should have a clear meaning which should have been agreed in the pre-match discussion.

 

I had two ARs on my set of two mens league games today who consistently did this - not with a subtle gesture but a full arm extended while running.

This mechanic was not in the top five (or ten) discussion topics I would have raised with them in a debrief, given that the earlier of the two to arrive showed up to the field six minutes before scheduled kickoff (and he had the middle for that game!)

 

This, and it's also frustrating when a pass is made, the CR sees no flag, play continues, the CR focuses on the ball, the player in an offside position finally touches the ball, the flag goes up, and the CR doesn't see it. Then some players keep playing and some don't, someone drills the ball into the net, the goal celebration starts, and finally, the CR notices.

Stopping my run doesn't make any sense. I'm supposed to be even with the point of contact where the offside offense officially occurred. That's where we take the restart. And then there's always the prospect of someone who was NOT in an offside position playing the ball, and now I'm 20 yards behind the play.

 

This is why the CR should be doing regular shoulder checks, or at the very least, positioning themselves to have the AR in the peripheral, so that when the flag goes up, it is spotted.

"Walking the dog" (as it is often called here in Canada) is not really a liked AR "signal", nor is the arm sticking straight out.

 

Because no one has brought it to their attention. I think we're in a society where we don't want to "offend" anyone.

I had someone in a game on the wrong side of 50 a while back who was doing this and noticed it was slowing him down, while teens are blowing by him. I had to ask him at halftime to stop. It was like telling junior that Santa doesn't exist. At the end of the game, he changed his tune and said "you're right...I didn't realize my arm was out and that it was affecting me".

I admit that usually telling someone they've been doing something wrong for many years will not have a happy end, but you're doing the game a disservice if it actually affecting his/her speed or you're concentration (I could care less if they do it or not).

As an aside, this was taught by at least one instructor in the early of my in-person recerts. The logic being that you're telling the CR "Yep, it was close, but he's on." Some CR's still like it to this day. Yes, it's silly.

 

We used to have 2 young referees with ZERO man management ability who the state was flying all over the country and saw as pro material. Folks like me never did. After numerous games where ref coaches at major tournaments were giving advice on how to handle tough matches was ignored, they were finally dropped. It's a shame since there were other capable young referees.

I would never do what you did. If it's a younger person who deserves the chance to prove themselves and is doing a higher-level game for the first time, I'll go out of my way as a team to make sure they succeed. If I see appointments being made for reasons that have nothing to do with skill (but other reasons) the assignors need to know early on that these folks are currently not capable and they'll hear it from the clubs involved (and possibly others). If AR's are bailing them out, someone else inherits the problem.

 

While I don’t see a need for the no one OS arm signal, there are so many people that seem to like it, I end up doing it. Shrug. I tell my ARs in pregame that the signal for not OS is the flag isn’t up and I don’t need anything else, but most still do it. (I suppose I am arguably contradictory because I do like the hand to show the ball still not over the touchline on poorly marked fields.)

 

So like 40? Don't worry, they'll get to the right side of 50 soon enough.

I feel like this was taught to me in the late 80s, but it may have just been me picking up on other local refs doing it. I always found it awkward when trying to keep up in those first few steps. I also think it helped the fans/players more than the CR. It was like if I didn't acknowledge it was close and than I had made decision on hit then I must have been sleeping (but still awake enough to know to start running?)

 

This is exactly my POV about the signal. I know it’s not a proper signal and you don’t want to do it at high levels. But with the procedure of waiting until the player gets involved with play to flag it, it actually is helpful to know that when it’s a close offside position, I take a quick glance at the AR on the pass, if they have the arm out, I know that I don’t need to look back again and can focus on potential fouls/DOGSO instead, and that I’m not going to be surprised by a late flag going up

But then again I also don’t care about missing an offside flag because of being focused on the play, especially when the pass is to a forward in the CR quadrant/far AR quadrant, where looking back could mean missing a foul. Nothing wrong with going back to the flag; everything wrong with taking your eyes off play for a moment to look for a flag, you miss a foul/DOGSO/PK, and the flag isn’t up anyway.

 

The problem is... if you have a chance to do a higher level and have this as a muscle memory habit... you can't break it easily.

Do things correctly to start, and you won't have to unlearn it.

 

LOL believe me, I have no problem bringing attention to deficits and if anything I often err too far on the side of "give the feedback" after games.

We had a lengthy and detailed debrief in between the two games and then after the second game (where I had the whistle). Making this signal was simply not high enough on my priority list to make the debrief when neither of them knew what a "drop zone" was or whether a whistle was needed prior to a kickoff.

 

The only reason I did what I did was to (unsuccessfully) prevent a mass confrontation by getting in between players to keep them apart. It was such a disappointing experience. The guy is nice and very soft spoken and non-confrontational, which is why I knew it wouldn’t go well in a U19B NPL-level game. The foul recognition and misconducts were mostly fine, the first 70 minutes or so were fine until the game became 2-0. Then the losing team started with the shenanigans and he clearly was either unable to see what was going on or just unwilling to deal with it. A kid dissenting all game long, never spoke a word to him, then he started getting into it with a player, nothing. Same kid started yelling across the field at me about why am I going in the field, I’m not the center ref, still nothing. Last 10 minutes I knew a mass confrontation was coming before the game ended, I tried to speak to him and tell him he has to lock things down, but a quick conversation or even a post-game debrief would be useless, because it would have to change his entire personality and demeanor as a person in a few minutes.

It didn’t end up in a huge fistfight or anything, but just a big pushing pile. Frankly it was very fortunate to only have that.

 

Agreed. It's an active, definitive signal as opposed to being unclear. When we all get to the Premier League we can stop the point / walk the dog. At the youth level where most of us reside I think it's fine.

 

Agreed. In the middle I love when I take my first glance over and the AR is telling me the play is onside. Makes things easier in my opinion.

 

Thanks for this. I think the various referees come here with vastly different experiences. Some are doing only very high-level games, while others are doing grassroots

Worse is when you do games where high-level assessors are there giving feedback based off of pro games rather than the youth games we are actually doing. Without comms. Without VAR.

 

One time a couple years ago one of the state higher-ups was observing/assessing one of the local regional candidates on a men's league game, and then he stuck around to informally observe a men's game where I was AR. (I've worked with him a handful of times in HS matches; he's a good guy and a good ref.) He recommended against the arm-out no-OS signal because it slows you down. Now, does that really matter on a U13 game? Probably not. And unfortunately, ever since I broke my toe playing soccer five years ago, I can't sprint like I used to anyway, so the men's league guys are going to outrun me no matter what (except for the really old dudes).

 

I centered 4 consecutive youth games today after some other plans fell through

The good: only one yellow card in 4 games

The bad: it was a clear DOGSO but I didn’t give it due to the game situation, just a yellow instead (5 minutes left, team down by 3 goals, do we really need a red card suspension for this?)

The ugly: 5 penalty kicks given across 4 games

 

I’m going to be officiating this team again tomorrow for the first time since this game back on 9/7. Should I just pretend like this game never happened or should I mention it to any of that teams players or at the coin toss to both captains about the previous game, all the yellows and how they know I’m not gonna take any crap so don’t try any. Or is that being a complete idiot

 

I would mention it to my crew during the pregame, but I would not talk about to the captains or the other players. It is a completely different game over a month later. Who knows what has been gonna be my on with the team/players since then.

 

I've posted this before. Certainly not the same level of game. But I had a difficult U12 game where I probably should have dismissed the coach. A couple weeks later I had the same coach with his U14 team. Before the game he came up to me and said, "I thought you weren't supposed to ref any more of my games." I just put on the most incredulous expression I could manage and said, "Whyever not?" Like I didn't remember the previous game at all. There weren't any problems.

 

Yeah that’s what I figured, wouldn’t have even asked such a dumb question but I remember both captains were involved in the shenanigans last game (one got a YC, one got a 2CT, both had a technical BS YC) and wonder if maybe acknowledging the last crazy game would possibly make them have better behavior as a team. Probably not though

 

That’s bad assigning. I don’t assign a CR to both ends of a fixture a month apart. The players will wonder if you will carry over anything. The coaches will wonder. And it sets you up to get dissent at the first sign or hint of that. The assignor should have found someone else.

 

It’s not both ends of a fixture. It’s just the home team again for the first time in almost 2 months. Anyway we’ll see if there’s anything worth posting about tonight after the game

 

Michigan HS playoff game. AR bumps into a sub on the sideline and then turns and pushes the player down over the bench. Benches look very close to the touchline making it a frustrating line to run. I guess he'd had enough.

https://www.9and10news.com/2025/10/...e-video-captures-referee-player-altercation/?