So what's your take on working out the dreaded bunchball tendency in youth soccer? Is there a certain age range you think teaching how to spread out finally begins to bear rewards on the field on game day, or is it all a matter of coaching skill? I've heard a few different takes on this. I've read "How to Play the Game" the official book of the USSF and they seem to have very little faith that the concepts of "spreading out" and "passing" can really be understood by any kids all the way up to age 8. The authors of that book say it's practically a waste of time to run passing drills in that age range and to try to keep them from bunching up in any way, as most don't seem to be able to grasp the concept of working as a team and can't really hold onto any "avoid bunchball" lessons you give them come game time. They recommend focusing on dribbling, kicking, etc. Then I read "Teaching Soccer Fundamentals" by Nelson McAvoy. Good book, but he doesn't seem to give age ranges a certain drill or something might be best for very often. He apparently has a solution: To avoid bunching up, start by playing a game of 6 v 4 keep away in a 50 by 40 yard grid. After a few minutes, stop play and say,"New rule. Everybody has to stay at least five paces from their teammates." Then blow the whistle. At the first infraction, blow the whistle and say "Bob was 2 paces from Jake," and 'punish' that player by making him do something slightly embarassing, like a somersault or cartwheel or something. A general rule of thumb is that if you have to stop play too often, go to another game; your players aren't learning. Sounds to me like a good idea fundamentally, but I think I'd be hard-pressed trying to get 6-year-olds to understand what five paces is; seems there'd be somersaults and cartwheels happening all over the place. Hell, I think I'd have a hard time understanding what five paces is when I'm running around out there. Then a friend of mine says he has a solution: he worked with eight-year-olds and ran some kind of passing drill with them where each player had to stay within his or her own marked-out space. His team dominated, so he seems rather confident his drill worked. I'm not sure about this, however, as they might have distributed player talent a little bit too much in his favor when they made teams. I feel a little skeptical about this drill from the beginning. It seems to be a surefire way to keep them from bunching up in a practice drill, but if a player has to stay confined within his own little box the whole time and thus not be able to offer offensive support and such that he probably should, it seems to me it sends a bad message about how to play the game. But then again, I don't have that much actual coaching experience yet; what I did was over a year ago, so I can't be sure. So how do you go about it? When do you start to press the point, and how?
I use to coach U-10 rec level, most kids were 8 or 9 years old and new to soccer, we did two things with them to help avoid mob-ball as we call it, note that this was in 6v6: 1) run a line of cones right down the center of the field, we played a sort of 2-1-2 pattern. The "wings" as we called them, were not allowed to cross the line of cones. This taught the wings, and the defense, to stay in their own half of the field. 2) run two lines of cones basically breaking the field into 3rds, you were not allowed to cross a line of cones. A second drill we did, which was more of a ball control/movement drill, was to have the coach kick a ball deep to a defender, the defender had to control the ball, take it wide, to a cone, around the cone and send it up the sideline, to a wing, who had a cone to stand at. Wing had to handle it, dribble down the line to another cone, then "cross" to the center and other wing who should be breaking for posts. we found that using the cones to have the kids visualize where they had to be helped alot.
I agree with the USSF direction about the futility of teaching spacing to u-8's. Not only does the average u-8 not have the awareness to play off keep proper spacing, but most of them don't have the passing skills to take advantage of a "spread out" formation. I watch allot of games at this age group and I don't know what is more frustrating, watching tactically inept 7 year olds or listening to coaches continuously shouting "spread out" for the whole game. Wait until you get to U-10 when these directions to the little mobsters are finally absorbed. Then you won’t be able to get defenders to leave their piece of real estate to defend the ball. Nothing is more depressing than watching a defender valiantly defending the wing while watching the attacker dribble up the middle of the field unguarded. My advice is don’t get ahead of yourself. This is the perfect age to teach the kids ball skills. So teach that. If it’s any consolation, all the proper spacing in the world won’t help a player if he/she can’t dribble, trap or pass the ball. If you're still not convinced, watch the Brazilian national team in action. They often have 3 or 4 players hovering around the ball. They seem to do ok.
I have found that the players start getting it around 3rd and 4th grade. Before that your dealing with cognitive issues (really, watching play AND holding a position is multi-tasking, and 6 year olds don't multi-task). Work on ball skills til then and you'll find that for some it is intuitive and for some it will take seasons (with and 's', plural) before they get it.
I also agree with the USSF direction about the futility of teaching spacing to U-8s. Occasionally you will find a 7-year-old how can handle the concept but for every one whom can, there are more 9 and 10 year olds who can't. My favorite game for teaching U-10s how to move to the open space and pass is as follow: Make small sided teams (3, 4 or 5 per side). Set up four goals, either team can score on any of the four goals. Make a rule that a team must make 3, 4 or 5 consecutive passes before they can shoot on any goal. Once their team looses possession, the count goes back to zero. This game forces the kids to pass and soon they will figure out that if they move into the open space they will be more successful. It also introduces the concept that you don't always have to go forward in soccer. If the coaches have a little soccer skill, this is a good game for them to play with the kids. They can help in building the number of passes and can encourage player movement to the open spaces. It's best if coaches are not allowed to score and to not play significant defense. Also, you will find that player who are ball hogs will not like this game but it is the best thing for them.
Aye, bunchball is one of the most frustrating problems any coach of kids has to face, and yet, out of the few good books I've read on coaching youth soccer thus far, practically nothing is mentioned as a method of DIRECTLY treating the problem. Teaching through small-sided games that emphasize certain skills is touted far and away as being the best method, so the impression I get is that the bunchball problem is best solved through letting the players play these games (like the one described above), and eventually, they will subliminally learn that success comes through spacing and passing. Of course, they have to become proficient at passing before they can utilize spacing in a game, so the drills for that have to start somewhere, but it's said that dribbling and kicking (not specifically passing) games are by far the most fruitful for kids up to 8 years of age, and not to even bother with passing before that. So what I'm thinking is that it must be best to start them off at the youngest age with practices that emphasize dribbling and kicking, but with drills in those practices that advocate to some extent the ability to pass and spread out. Gradually increase the necessity of spreading out and passing through the design of your drills, but not faster than their skills permit. Eventually (namely, when their bodies have changed just enough that they can pass with the side of their foot without falling over) have practices entirely dedicated to passing now and then. This is about the same time you start teaching the basics of formations and postions, so it should come naturally, in a manner of speaking. The age this happens at varies from player to player (generally from 8 to 10?).
If you are going to teach the kids right, as far as not playing bunch ball, be prepared to fail... I coach at the Rec level and so far all my U10 teams have been dismal because I really make it a point to try and get them out of that habit... I use a lot of games that force kids to pass... IE make the whole object of the game to make x amount of passes, or play with restrictions that x amount of passes must be made before a shot is taken. Usually by the time they are at u12 they snapped out of, although it might be that the field is just too big and they can't follow the ball around that well... The thing is at U10 it is a lot easier to win by playing bunch ball as it allows the more skilled kids to dominate the ball... whereas if you're actually trying to pass teh ball around you run into problems because not everyone in you're team is tactically, and Technichaly skilled.
It's been awhile since I had a chance to coach really young players, but when I did, I spent some time teaching the kids that they all had jobs and that seemed to work. 1. We had a game called " I got it! ". The team makes two parrallel lines that are about ten yards apart. The coach stands between the lines, about twenty yards away. The coach serves balls to various locations and the first two kids collect the ball and attack the goal behind the coach. When they have finished, they return the ball. The serves are rapid fire, with sometimes more than one team attacking at one time. Corrections are made on whose job it should have been to get the ball and on what the other player s/b doing while the other is collecting the ball. Make some serves " no brainers " by going to one side or the other and then sharpen judgement skills by serving more down the middle. You may then add a defender beginning with one that is passive and moving on to something close to a 50-50 service. That will give you a lot more to talk about. You may want to go to two groups if you have a lot of players, but if you go fast enough to keep their interest, the kids watching will learn from the other's mistakes. 2. I spent about 5-10 minutes each practice with shadow play. I would put the kids into a formation and have them follow me around the field while maintaining their spacing. I would stop often and throw a ball with the question " Who is going to play that ball? ". The entire team would answer " That's Lynnie's Ball! ". " Are you going to play that ball? " . " No, that's Lynnie's ball! ". Well then, what are you going to do? ". This method seems to be an anametha to everything we are supposed to do, but it was quite successful. Of course, I did all the usual skill building and small sided stuff too. My emphasis was on telling the kids that they were responsible for making the decisions. We had three playing rules: If you are inside, kick it outside; If you are outside, kick it inside; and, When you are close to goal, kick it to Laura ( not my daughter! ). Obviously, things became more complex over time, but it was a good beginning. These players were six and seven years old playing eleven a side - with thirteen on the roster! Even so, we managed to play three backs flat and all the way up to midfield and even beyond. We didn't bunch often and passed really well for the age group. It was one of the smartest teams that I ever coached. These were ordinary Rec players - I had only three players who continued on to varsity. 3. Make corrections immediately. Talk to your player as soon as the ball leaves the area. Keep it brief and positive. If the player is too far away to talk to or if the correction is complex, sub them out, tell them what you need to tell them, and sub them right back in to see if they got it. During your preseason meeting, tell your parents that you might do this and that their kid might sometimes enter and leave a match very quickly to help out, but that regular playing shifts would be maintained. I always asked the kid on the bench if they would do me a favor and play a short shift so I could talk to someone. I never had a problem with this. I think that much of the success with really young children depends on repitition, teaching generic game playing skills, and teaching at a higher level than their age group. After all, you might sell them short - give them the opportunity to surprize you. Good luck. Roy
Is bunchball a american soccer problem for kids? Or do all countries in the world have this problem with the kids playing this type of soccer? I think that players at ages 8-10 should have a basic idea of how to play the game.
Expecting a kid's game to look like an adult game is a mistake. I don't know what you call "bunch ball" and what you see wrong with it. Tackling a team mate's ball is bad. An attack with no width or support is bad. A defense with no balance or cover is bad. On attack or defense you want more players near the ball than far away. I had no trouble with 8 year-olds and up playing 11 a side on a large field. The key is teaching kids how to support off the ball. If you only teach them to do things with the ball, you should expect them all to try to get the ball. They don't know anything else. I haven't coached younger kids, but coaches are supposed to use small sided games and small field so by the structure of the game bunching is appropriate.
Bunch ball or bee hive soccer are when all the kids on the field run after the ball and no passing is involved. All players just kicking and chasing the ball. I didnt know there was an expiration date on these threads. Delete the thread if it is too old. When you google bunch ball this thread comes up first.
I started teaching tactics with small-sided keep-away games, then progressed by adding goals. Worked well with 8 and 9 year-olds.
The above list is stuff I worked on with my u6 team. It came about organically. I see they are taking from each other in a game, so next practice we do a drill where they have to support each other, not take. Late in the season I got around to running to goal if a teammate was dribbling wide, to receive a cross or deflection. On defense I borrowed from another coach who's strategy was to tell his defenders to "blast it"... sounds crude but it works for U6 and it's simple and a somewhat fun instruction. At U6 the kids need very simple instructions, and should only focus on one or two concepts at a time.
I don't believe it is possible to coach "teams" at U6. I never coached younger than age 8 (old category of U10), but if I did I would focus on developing a love of the game,i.e., having fun.
I do not agree with coaching young players to "blast it" as a form of defending. Some of these lessons can stay with a kid for a long time. Easy to teach now, hard to unteach later.
I think it's possible to coach them you just have to keep it very simple and yes fun. Kids like to naturally run and dribble and kick; just focus on that. Can teach simple concepts like supporting teammate and running to goal and basic defense. But big gap in development and comprehension between ages 4 and 5 so it gets tricky. The 5 year olds are mostly able to be coached somewhat.
@NewDadaCoach I guess you missed that I said "teams". I didn't say you couldn't coach individuals, but the state of physical development limits them to developing general athletic skills. Take a look at page 4 of this USYSA manual: http://www.nyswysa.org/_files/coach...evelopment-guidelines/SkillsSchoolBooklet.pdf Those kids that you teach to kick the ball up field when pressured are missing an opportunity to dribble. What is your priority? Teaching them to boom the ball up field or teaching them to dribble.
Yes I agree, U6 teams, not much to coach. But I think basic defense/offense is good to introduce. And support as opposed to taking from your teammate. I think it's more about introducing things, not expecting them to get it. We did throw-ins. By the end of season they mostly had it down. I didn't tell them to boot it until we faced a team late in the season; the hardest team we'd faced. Their coach kept telling their kids to "blast it" when it got near their goal. They had 2 kids stay back on defense which is rare for U6. For the 4 year olds I think they can blast it because they wouldn't dribble anyhow. For the 5 year olds yes I would want them to put more thought into it.
Younger players automatically run towards the ball as they want to be involved. With most of them taking this approach, there is no incentive to spread out, as they're less likely to receive the ball. Most lack the technical ability to control and pass quick enough that there's an advantage to passing. Forcing players into zones is limiting as they wait at the closest edge of the zone marked by their opponent, so have an immediate challenge when the ball enters their zone and so struggle to retain possession. Restrictive conditions like these limit players by forcing them into an action. Instead, empower the players to work it out for themselves, so learning is embedded and personalised. A way of empowering is to keep practicing with 2v2's and 3v3's until players are comfortable passing to each other. Then expand to 4v4's and 5v5's as they progress. It takes time to transfer into organised matches. However, be patient and they will catch up. When they do, they will be more technically able, rather than relying on kicking the ball away. To encourage players to cope with 3v3's, initially practice with 3v1's and 3v2 possession games to encourage players to get used to control and passing quickly under limited pressure and then build gradually to 3v3's. Here's a game with a number of conditions to help differentiate individual players or the team so they can gradually develop success with passing, spreading out and movement. Access more empowering games at engagingsoccer.co.uk. 3v1 continuous is a fun game for building success.
Not just practicing with 2v2s and 3v3s—their match formats should probably be 1v1+GK (Belgian model) or 2v2. In the US we go from 4v4 to 7v7 too early. We end up with sixteen year olds that can't play 4v4 properly. Over time, I've learned it's not the kids' fault they bunch up, nor the coaches. It's the format. You're fighting a losing battle against what a 5-8 year old can process. As recommended, most of practices that age revolve around building comfort on the ball. There is not a lot of emphasis on the role and utilizing teammates*. But with having said that, the recent developments in Play-Practice-Play do address utilizing teammates but in a 2-person or 3-person format. But then why have them play 4v4? Practice as we play, play as we practice. At least in my club, the field is still too big at 4v4. Take out the "middle third" of the pitch, so every one is always near the ball. Every one is always close to a goal. Reduce the impact of early developers who can just out run people. Reduce the space to encourage light, feathery touches on the ball. Build a game for the 99%, not one that show cases the the 1% (or Jan-March birthdays). If we shrink the field, play loose boundaries—even if it goes out who cares? Let them play. There's too many stoppages at the younger ages. We're too fixated on restarts. Do these and bunchball will be lessened.