I don't think there is any question that Lampard has been our best player this season, from Pompey at home way back when to the miracles over Stoke and Wigan. However, Ashley Cole puts in fine performance after fine perfomance. He has eclipsed the fading Mikel in the last couple months (not that I blame Obi, Scolari has run him into the ground). There has always been some ill feelings towards Ash from our support. My questions are: -How do you rate Ash's season to date? -Have you accepted him as a member of Chelsea FC, who gives his all for the club every time he is on the pitch? Or is he still a money-grabbing kunt? -Is there a LB you would take ahead of him right now? (beyond marginal improvement)
1. I think that he's had a pretty good season. There have been some games in which he's been very obviously tired, and with no real backup LB left that will continue. He's also accumulated a few too many bookings, and his crossing and overall play in the final third has been quite bad this season. He's nowhere near the menace down the flank that he was at Arsenal. When he goes forward and doesn't do anything good with the ball, he exposes our entire left side and without Mikel to cover we would be up shit creek two or three times per match because of it. With that said, he's been good defensively, has made a couple of really important tackles and clearances, and overall has had a good season to date. 2. I accept that he plays for us and I will hope he does well while on the pitch. But I will never think of him as anything but an Arsenal player who left a club for more money and did so in an arrogant, selfish, immature way. He wrote an autobiography at age 24 for God's sake, what could be more of a money-grab than that? He is a tool of the highest order, and I would jump for joy if he were sold tomorrow. 3. Bridge, Evra, Heinze, Taiwo, Lahm, Zhirkov, Abidal.
First off thanks for this thread as I have officially become part mentally retarded due to another thread on this board and I cant help but think about those wonderful words from Billy Madison which would be appropriate for that thread imo. Moving onto this topic which I think is a very interesting topic to address, I would have to say that certianly Frank, Mikel and Ashley would be in contention for POTY at the moment as all three have played very well this season, with Lampard leading the race atm. I do agree with you that Mikel has pretty much been run into the ground (another side product of the idiot Scolari) and hasnt got much help from his other midfield counterparts either and that is why perhaps his form has just taken a minor dip of late. As for your questions - Ashley really has been very good all season, although he has mixed in an occasional gaffe, for the most part his excellent form has continued from the end of last season. As I prepare to run from lobo and blackjack- we really have not come close to missing Bridgey (potential injury aside) as Ash has really been excellent. He now seems to be reverting his Arsenal days where he is happily linking up with the attack and is now providing a steady threat in the final third as his crossing and final ball has really improved this season. As much ire as this may draw from others I believe Ashley has been our best and most consistent defender this season. - I dont think Ash will be ever fully accepted due to the mercenary claims and his past allegiances with Arsenal. But for me the lad seems to play hard everygame and has really ran his socks off the past year. He has thrown his body in the way to make many a goal line clearance and just keeps plodding along despite the abuse from opposing, and sometimes his own fans. Drawing ire again- but he is a Chelsea player for me and gets my support- I just wish he wouldnt whinge and moan at the refs so much. - as for any other LB. I dont follow World Football that much so I wont throw some silly comparisoin out there just to do so. The only player who I think it slightly better than Ashley at the moment is Evra, who imo is the best defender Manure have. He is physically stronger than Ash, which helps at times and for me is just a touch better on both ends of the pitch. I would not feel slighted if Evra pipped Ashley for the best LB in the League atm but I would have to think it would be a close race.
finally get to disagree with you and its about bloody time 1. I dont really agree with your season analysis of Ash- but to each his own and so be it. 2. He is a prick yes- but slating him for an autobiography at 24? How many other players have penned their memoirs already- Rooney, Terry, etc. 3. Sorry mate Bridge isnt better, neither is Heinze. Not sold on Zhirkov. I dont think Lahm or Abidal would be that much of an upgrade and I cant really comment on Taiwo as I havent seen enough of him.
Fair enough of course, I will plainly admit that my blue-tinted glasses will always color my perception of Ashley Cole. I still think that with the aerial threats we have (Drogba, Ballack, Kalou at times), and with Lampard running through the area to pick up any of their nod-ons as he does so well, we would be better off playing a fullback who could put in a few high balls from time to time. Bosingwa did it to great effect against Juventus and if we had some of those coming in from the other side as well, we'd have a more balanced and less predictable attack in my opinion, and we'd give the ball away with our central defense exposed less often. That is why I have always preferred Bridge.
Fair points so far. I just want to point out that Eric Abidal is quite overrated and not fit to carry Evra's undergarments. Heinze better than AC? In a dreamland maybe. That wasn't even the case when Heinze was playing so well for ManUre. I'd agree with fern that Evra is simply a shade above the rest, fabulous player that I really enjoy watching. Also, Ash has struggled going forward because we don't have a capable left-winger. His attacking game looks better ten-fold with the useless Malouda ahead of him, imagine if we had a real winger on the left!
as always mate its great to have a debate with someone who has a differing point of view which has a logical, rational and sane basis I can completely agree with your about Bridge and need I dig up my anger in regards to his sale, which I still dont agree with on a personal level, even though that contradicts my earlier statements. I feel Ash has gotten better this season in the final third and although his final ball is nowhere near as good as Boswingas it has gotten better and I think Ashley is a legitimate threat in the final third as a defender. Its also nice to see some variety in our attack under Hiddink as you are 100% correct that our attack became too predictable and with the inclusion of Drogba and a few minor tactical shifts we are now using a variety of options to attack the opposition.
Abidal? Seriously? He can't crack the France lineup as that belongs to Evra. Lahm, don't rate him as highly as he tends to be, and his Euros (Turkey especially) made him drop a bit in my eyes. Taiwo is good. Heinze? No. Davide Santon has potential though.
Evra is Ashley with Bridge's crossing abilities. Excellent fullback. He has incredibly high energy levels and is very productive in attack. He rarely has the same winger play in front him but the way he attacks and gets to the byline (something A.Cole rarely does--usually stops at the edge of the box and passes inside) and whips in excellent low crosses or high crosses is excellent. Taiwo is more of a Roberto Carlos Abidal hybrid but I think Emmanuelson is the closet thing to Evra as fullback. If Chelsea are too scared to use Van Aanholt (who has just scored from Chelsea Reserves) or Bertrand (both excellent prospects) then either Taiwo or Emmanuelson would be a great choice to backup and potentially replace A.Cole.
Quite good so far. Bar a bad spot that is. Yes. He gives his all for every game and he tries. I've gotten over it. Keep in mind that Busby played with Liverpool and Man City Chivu and Evra.
With the exception of Evra, I dont think there is a better LB playing today. The one thing I wish I could change about him/his play is that he NEVER plays to the whistle. He goes down, feels aggrieved, etc he will stop playing waiting for the ref to blow his whistle and invariably he doesnt and he has to catch back up to the play. He has the speed to catch back up and 99% it doenst hurt us but its just a pet peeve of mine about him that could possibly haunt us. I am betting that he and Boz will sleep for a month after the season is over with as Phil had them doing double duty. They each did as well as they could given the situation but "wing backs" simply dont work in the Prem. The counterattack is too quick and if he or Boz got too far forward providing the only width on the team for long streches of the season they got caught out leaving us exposed at the back and them running the length of the field at full sprint. Both he and Boz were "let of the leash" so to speak and we saw the best of him but I can only imagine how much better if he had an honest to god partner on the left. Zhirkov? Maybe. I just hope the club addresses our "width" come the summer. PS Agreed 1000000000000% Lamps gets my vote for POTY. I would vote now if I could.
- Superb. Defensively as good as ever and his attacking play has moved up a level. Has always worked well with whomever played in front of him but has added a further threat. Could genuinely have had 4/5/6 goals this season with a bit of luck and a little bit of composure in his finishing. Has struck the woodwork on a number of occasions. Comfortably our best defender this year and behind only Lampard for my POTY (Mikel up there too but as mentioned has looked tired recently). - Absolutely. Never had a problem when he signed and I always felt the money-grabbing taunts were over the top. Thought they were mainly fuelled by bitter Arsenal fans. Will admit he does winge and moan too much but this is never brought up about JT who is equally bad in this regard, if not worse. Is one of my favourite players in all honesty. Can't ever fault his commitment and is always one of the first to acknowledge/applaud the fans. - No. Only Evra is up there with him in world football and there isn't all that much between them.
Well first we all know Bridge is, was and will always be better than Ashley Cole TM so no need to go over that I think Ashley is having a fine year and is back in fine form after a little dip after his injury awhile back, no doubt one of the best leftbacks around and recaptured his old form this year. My main issue with him , which is highlighted by our lineup and thus not all his fault, is that he still can't cross for shit (sorry Fern don't see any improvement., especially from wide and wide and deep, and he does not work the wide area as well generally either but he is extremely good linking and hitting the inside channel, so if we actually still had played a player who could work the wide area and deliver quality crosses fom near the end line hias shortcoming would be widly made irelevent. Also will give kudos this year and years past for Ashley being real quality at watching the post and the goal line, has many a great save there... Accepted, no not entirely, but I respect that he usually puts in an honest effort and then some and is limiting a bit his petulant outbursts with refs... Who would I rather have, well the obvious, but other than that, no one really. I do love Taiwos game and rocket foot but not ready to say I'd give up Ashley's experianced defence for him yet, both Evra and Clichy are quality but they are also tainted, I really like the look of Inter's Santon but he is only 18 so not yet if it meant losing Ashley. Lahm gets skinned far too much, Zhirkov I like and he has defended well when I have seen him at lb but not seen enough to be confident about that as some who have seen more question his defence. So in the end I still rather we had not made the deal but he is ours now and no I would not trade him for anyone but if our youth not ready to step up, I would love to see us add Taiwo, Zhirkov or Santon, not likely on the latter I imagine, and he is actually right footed so probably not his best position in the end, to add back up and compete with him for a spot.
Agreed. His crossing is still poor and he has never managed to link up as well with midfield as he did at Arsenal, but that has more to do with the system we play and the players next to him. Him behind Robben, who liked to cut inside, would have been a dream.
1. Very solid 2. Acepted him, yet he is till a money grubbing kunt. 3. I like Evra a lot and I see Zhirkov a bit more than most people on here, and I really like him as well.
Or Makelele, for that matter. Its because we don't have access to French tabloids or Spanish ones, but read the English ones.
but wouldnt that be a good thing that he wanted away from Arsenal being one of our direct rivals? for me personally its another reason I dislike Gallas so much when he made his move. if we were to sign Messi would you hate him because he played for Barca?