News: Arena Suspended by MLS

I do think the structural and cultural reforms that he's brought to the club will last post-Bruce. One of the biggest issues we had was the failure to build a real foundation outside the senior team proper. Now, with Revs II and the academy teams, we've got a farm system that would be unrecognizable in the Burns/Heaps era. And given our on-field successes with the three-DP model, I can't imagine we'd go back to a Burns-esque nickel-and-dime approach ever again - surely the Krafts' appetites are now whetted for more than that.

Naturally, we could still go back to Burns-level incompetence. That's a real risk. But I think we're now beyond Burns-level ambition, which was always just as galling -- arguably even moreso -- than failure to function.

 

We're getting ahead of ourselves but my default move would be to elevate Richie Williams to head coach, Onalfo to Dir of Soccer and move on. When an organization does well and you have a major departure, try to keep it intact and promote from within if you can. If you bring in completely new leadership to a team that's won, then they're going to want 'their' guys and it almost always results in the team declining.

 

I understand the need to keep some things confidential, but I think the organization should provide some additional clarification (at the least, to head off speculation that it is something worse than what is being investigated).

Yeah, I share that concern. The Krafts approach has always seemed like "this soccer stuff is way toocomplicated, we need someone who can run it for us". That has led them to O'Donovan, Sunil Gulati, Burns and Arena. Nicol did very well on the coaching side, but he seemed to be held back by limits on his control. Things finally got bad enough that they gave major control to Arena and his people.

But, I think they've always wanted/needed a 'savior' and that's because their own organization is totally incapable of heading up a serious football club operation.

Yeah, I agree with that. I think the players have worked with this staff long enough and seen enough success that they'd probably want that continuity.

And, Arena's people have been with him long enough that they should have been able to pick up on his 'secret sauce'. I understand that when it comes to head coaching, some people have it and some don't. But if they don't, why have they been with him so long? Are they just competent assistants? I don't think so.

 

Headline in The Athletic: "Revs captain Gil says he's never heard Arena make inappropriate remark." Does Gil actually even speak much English? And the other guy they talked to was... longtime Revs stalwart Mark-Anthony Kaye!

 

he speaks English week enough to give interviews in English. that hasn't always been the case, but he started the practice last year, so that's at least 18 months of being pretty good at English

 

re coaching, onalfo has a career losing record after taking over some decent teams eg LAG, SKC. that to me screams it would go downhill. sometimes your value is as an assistant who does specific things for a legit head coach that make him or her better. [side point: do you think soccer ever adopts NFL style position coaches/division of labor outside GK?]. it's not enough to get basically what the head is currently trying to do and thinks of the current roster. you need to have your own eye for talent, fresh ideas on the roster and what it needs, understand tactics including adjusting to other teams, have a sense of how the sport is growing around you, pick the right lineups, sort out a bench and know when to use it, etc. arena has built up a list of teams from nothing, over and over, he clearly has "it." also, in addition to your own abilities, there's also a magnetism thing. IMO a big name separate from how well they coach, attracts additional players who want to learn from or associate with the big names. you can hire a nobody and maybe it works out jim curtin but for a while the players shopping o move will be skeptical. you hire a big deal and that skepticism is stowed, fair or not.

re culture, meh. my experience the vast majority of soccer is gathering the best players in a place and finding tactics that make them even better, then man managing through the tough games better than the other guy. most of the time when i hear "culture" shortly afterward counter-productive personnel decisions happen which smooth personality issues but make the team worse. you do need people who fit scheme but that's more talent run through a filter than culture.

re youth academies/reserve teams, that to me is a different "silo," linking ownership resources to the GM to youth coaches and scouts who find players and train them up. the head might have some input but is usually too busy with his own first team. the place where the HC/GM come in is do they sign, roster, and play the academics as first team. you could have a good system and if the HC sees the 18 year old kid and regardless how he looks wants to instead sign/play 30 year olds, so what. and i think that feeds back down because select kids or even academicians deciding whether to sign or where to play can see if HGP get signed and used or are like a vertigial appendage, stuck on the reserve team on loan. that might encourage players to go with other select teams, go to college, go into the draft, or go abroad.

that being said, arena either did something or not, keeps his job or not. you may not have a choice on that. you would have a choice who next, if it happens. personally based on how friedel went with your team i would not just run out an interim and hope. i could see a cynical approach where NER looks at the margin to the red line and says onalfo would limp it into the playoffs, and nothing drastic needs to happen, but that would be a downward trajectory the rest of the season, maybe a short playoff stay, just to put off the inevitable for the offseason. to me a playoff team needs to act like it for it to mean anything. if you back in you're not going to last long, and the next coach will be cleaning up the stink along with rebooting.

 

Arena is on "Double Secret Probation"

 

Seriously. I'd have thought we'd have a report by now on what the matter behind it all is. I do cautiously think that the lack of information suggests it's not a major issue, and the MLS FO is just being very conservative -- otherwise there'd have been a leak about it. But maybe no one in the media is actually digging?

 

This is probably why they didn't tell the players. Otherwise it gets out.

 

Some really good points.

But, it looks like Richie Williams is doing the coaching, with Onalfo probably staying in his current role (although, maybe more involved in high-level decision making)?

 

It seems like the Revs are trying to follow the Celtics playbook - though at least the C's explained something to the players.

 

richie has a career losing record as well including two interim stints at RBNY.

if it's the worst case. this wouldn't be a 5 game mop up role where who cares what happens, it's a third of a season where you have a cushion but a bad enough choice could imperil advancement or undermine things so bad so what if you do make it, it won't last long. it's also european offseason still, kind of, to coach shop, and some americans are available. also not a fan of corporate-style cattle-call searches for major league sports teams. which is sometimes implied in long interim periods. when friedel flopped you hired arena, you didn't blow up the season. you should really have an idea who you want, go get him. to me the best coaches aren't sending in resumes and undergoing rounds of interviews and screening. they are known quantities. you call up their agent and offer numbers. assuming.

 

Even Bruce Arena had a losing record with the Red Bulls.

Richie's last head coaching stint in MLS was 2009. I think he's learned a thing or two in the last 14 years...

 

Not advocating staying with the same group or going outside, but a lot of coaches need to fail the first time before figuring things out. Bill Belichick might be the best example.

 

Regarding some comment from the Revs on Arena's situation, I can get not saying something ahead of tonight's game as it could be a distraction, but all interested parties - especially fans - I think deserve an update on this soon - as in this week.

 

Hey Pat's Fan, were you playing football back in the 1970's? Some of us were. There were certainly coaches that would chew out a team or individual players. We could handle it back then. The basic idea was to play better. Nobody cried about it then.

 

So I guess you don't believe in human evolution.

 

ya and we walked 10 miles to school in the snow and rain uphill both ways and drank from garden hoses and rode in the back of pickup trucks and ate batter from the bowl, but it didn't make it right. Do we know a player reported it or was it overheard by staff outside the immediate team like an admin, volunteer, reporter etc... Most players have thicker skin and will keep stuff like this in house. I can imagine Bruce and his staff have typical colorful language that most coaches when it comes to the practice fields and locker rooms and the players are use to it.

 

but what worked for you, giving friedel an optimistic chance, or hiring bruce arena with a track record. i believe in objective hiring on track records. i agree some percent of nobodies or brief losers have some success in them. i don't think that percent is high if they have little experience running anything else. i think it's a losing bet on the whole. he's even been an interim twice and his WDL is what it is.

i mean, to me, tab ramos was a former player, took U20s to quarters -- but i always thought that was underperforming rather than success -- i mean in 2019 he had half the current NT lineup -- and handed a more random assortment of adult pros he was near dead last with houston then bottom of the barrel at hartford. suggests the U20 talent flattered him.

bill belichick is also an awkward example as he had been a 2-title winning defensive coordinator under parcells, and his reward was a sketchy browns team that was going to be moved to baltimore. and that's avoiding the "brady question," ie, the sense he's a program builder and slightly above average with cleveland and NER minus the brady years.

 

yelling at players is pointless. you sound like my useless HS coach (and we finished top 8 in state, but should have won the whole thing, as my select did). most players do not show up to loaf around where they need basic motivation and prodding. occasional butt kick perhaps. if you have to yell all day you need a different squad and not to try and make something of the team it isn't. well, your HS coach might have done it but IMO many of them are flattered by their good class years and can't actually coach. cannot handle bad cycle years because they can't really coach. you are dealt the cards you are dealt. particularly in school sports you would do well to emphasize skill building and understanding the game. conditioning in and of itself is overrated and is often gotten in the training itself.

if you look at the history of nowak-type coaches they tend to achieve what they are going to, immediately, then break down and burn out the team and be gone within 3 years. the players are initially super fit and the coach for a period orders them around. then burn out, injury rashes, mutiny. people who have been hired for performing at a high level do not want to be yelled at all day. they want adjustments. they want useful nuggets. they want reminders if they are neglecting their programming. if you're gonna yell, yell help. yelling for the sake of yelling is the coach venting and doesn't help you win one bit. it's a cop out.

for example, US-panama. imagine if the coaching response had been yelling as opposed to shifting to 4 mid type looks. because the irony is a lot of that was the coach's fault. he can yell at the flagging team for starting to jog or he can fix what's going wrong on the field. you choose. yelling is blaming the players. but maybe you messed up your game plan or scouting hmmm or maybe you didn't teach me up to stop what's going on hmmmmm

to be clear, i have had some yellers in my day. i never quit the team. i just know what works and what doesn't. the best coaches focus on teaching the game, and preparing you for next week. you get fixed and improved as opposed to just yelled at. some fraction of the time a yelling coach is yelling at his own failure to evaluate or array talent, or get you better ready, either strategically or technically. to put this to something concrete i feel like most HS and college programs over-emphasize running and practicing dead balls and spend little or no time working on foot skills. it's odd because this is your team for 4 years and they delegate it all to select and just cherry pick what arrives. a school sports coach owns you for a year of HS or most of college. if you aren't significantly better in 4 years they were lazy or had the wrong foci.

my college coach emphasized team defense and yelled a ton. one year we had 3 scoreless double OT ties. you can consider that yeller job done or you can do what i did and wonder where the offense is. you know, coach, any goal would have won these, how about some emphasis on finishing and creativity and ball skill? we can obviously handle defense, what we need is less discipline and yelling and some offense.

 

That kind of thinking just perpetuates stupidity. We endured it, so you should be able to also?

I came up through that kind of system in a whole bunch of sports. In little-league baseball, every coach I ever had just picked the best players and put them in the key positions and that was it ... except one, who actually taught me how to be a better player - I've never forgotten that guy, though I've totally dismissed all those others.

The ones who yell and yell clearly don't know anything else. To them, the sport is %100 about effort and perseverance, which, to be sure, are great and necessary qualities, but far, far from %100. The best coaches are teachers - if they want you to play better, they teach you how, not just berate you into trying harder or enduring more.

Williams is clearly well in the middle, between Friedel and Arena. Much more experience than Friedel.

I've seen enough of Revs history to be leery of just bringing in a talented coach to take over. This club needs a whole system, because the Krafts seem incapable/uninterested in setting that up to support some coach from outside. That's why I think ... for this club ... that maintaining the well-constructed support system is critical to maintaining the standards the Arena has brought.

And how many titles has Williams won as an assistant? I think it's a pretty good comparison with BB.

As for the whole Brady vs. Belichick argument and Belichick w/o Brady? If Belichick had been gifted this hall-of-fame QB and then did all his winning with that guy, then maybe you could question whether he was really a HOF coach.

But, he didn't get a hall-of-fame QB - he spotted and drafted a skinny, out-of-shape kid who only started for 2 years in college. Most coaches probably would have cut him before he even started his first game. But, it was Belichick who developed the kid and made him the best QB ever. He wasn't a great QB when the Pats started winning super bowls - he became that in time for the 2nd run of SB wins.