http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/13/sports/othersports/14LACR.html At the end of the article. Yes, a lacrosse league.
We had a big argument about this when it first started. I liked their business plan. I haven't seen their complete attendance numbers or heard about their P&L, but they're still around and if they're talking expansion, perhaps they're doing all right. But "receiving interest" isn't exactly something you can spend. If I'm going to build a stadium, I'm not so concerned about what the MLL team that may have 7 events in the stadium a year is going to add to my overall presentation. Taking that 3pm-5pm Tuesday afternoon timeslot, though, what were they thinking? They're going to go head-to-head with women's billiards and drive them both out of business.
Dang it, the "old" BS access to NY Times has either failed, or slipped my memory circuits... not that it was worth etching into memory or anything. Help, please? If we're talking about Major League Lacrosse, having attempted to run last year's attendance figures, they'd be lucky to get 4,000 per match (can't get all the Rochester numbers, nor a couple of low-lying teams). Most of the facilities seem to be in the 6-10K range (Baltimore did use Ravens Stadium last year, but won't this year). If anything, MLS stadia would be too big for this league... for now. We can get into relatively familiar arguments about gauging outdoor vs indoor, BTW. The indoor numbers make Columbus look like a bad idea for MLL, but YMMV.
1) Seems like a good fit. b) I don't think expanding MLL to the cities listed is a very good idea. Perhaps in Ohio, Indiana... North Carolina. My point is that they're expanding to cities with no real support of the sport. At the same time, they're going to rack up MASSIVE travel budgets expanding so far West. I dunno. No big deal to me, just seems like an odd array of cities.
Columbus' NLL team does not appear to be particularly well-managed, nor the product particularly well-received. Is there anywhere with an NLL team and an MLL team? Long Island? Don't the New York Saints play at Nassau, and is that far from Hofstra?
NLL bailed out of Boston, and MLL apparently gets their second-best draw in "Boston" (facility is in Lowell). Buffalo is below average, but is sort of at the median (7th of 12) in NLL, Rochester appears to be the best draw in MLL... still seems like kiwis to rutabagas. The New Jersey NLL team draws 5.5K (8th of 12), the MLL team (seems to be located a few miles further out from Newark) is the worst draw in that league (under 3K per game). Still need NY Times help, please.
travel costs wont relly be a problem note that they mentioned 6 expansion cities, all very far west. 2 divisions, completely seperate untill playoff time would keep the costs down. makes sense to me. Austin and Denver are the only two that would drive up travel costs. all the others being Pacific teams would work well with airfare. Lots of cheap commuter flights out there If all goes well I would suspect a Chesapeak area division a good idea with Laccrosse being huge down there. a few clusters of teams would work well, and i bet the west coast teams are necessary for the TV deal
Denver probably got on the radar when their first-year NLL team drew 16K per game. I was shocked on Monday when I saw that number. What Pacific cities are they considering? Not sure it's the best idea, but it's probably a better idea than Midwest destinations.
Lacrosse in Austin, Texas? Seems far-fetched to me. If the Lone Stars couldn't draw more than a couple of thousand in the center of town where thousands play recreational soccer, I'd be surprised if Lacrosse would be much of a draw.
I was watching the NCAA Lacrosse Final the other day. The area in front of the net was dead, worn out grass. I think MLS teams will be reluctant to share a SSS with a MLL team.
Actually, it was ankle-deep mud. Mind you, the announcers said that was because they had had eight consecutive days of heavy rain in Baltimore. In fact, the grass in the goalie crease was laid that day, which is why it was intact.
I watched the semi-final between MD and VA. It looked like a huge crowd packing that B'more stadium. Is that typical for college lacrosse? The few MLL matches I've seen appeared to have modest attendances by comparison.
Though I am not a lacrosse fan, I know the NCAA final four always draws a big crowd. I think it is usually played at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore or at Univ of Maryland. And UVA, Mayrland, and Hopkins are always in the thick of things and thus draw big crowds. I think the final drew 36K this year.
Why not invent a new rugby league and have them play in these SSS's. I would love to see the birth of the ARA, the American Rugby Association formed Just like the Super 12. Imagine teams like: Columbus Magpies NY/NJ Brumbies New England Blues Huh?
There already is the American National Rugby League. The only club I can name off the top of my head is the Dallas Harlequins (sp?). I would suggest the New England Flintlocks.
Yes, Long Island has both indoor (the Saints) and outdoor ( the Lizards, I think) lacrosse teams. The Saints play at Nassau Coliseum, the Lizards this year will be playing at Mitchel Field. I guess the Lizards will be playing in the main stadium, where the Power plays and where the Metros occassionally play a Cup game. The Coliseum, Mitchel Field and Hofstra Stadium are all within the same area, within a mile of one another.
About a year ago there were reports that a group of investors were in the planning stages for a pro rugby league based on the MLS business plan, with the commissioner to be none other than Doug Logan. Haven't heard anything about it recently tho. The addition of a pro rugby team or a pro lacrosse team, or even both in some markets (Philly, NYC, Boston, Denver, Bay Area) would make a stadium far more likely to get past city councils, as you could get a lot more use out of it. My blueprint for MLS SSS stadiums is: -MLS team -National team games -Rugby/MLL/WUSA team (at least 2 of the 3) -College soccer (in cities like Philadelphia and Boston with a lot of local teams, they could play each other there sort of like Big 5 basketball at the Palestra in Philly) -High school soccer/lacrosse/rugby/football, youth club soccer championship games (football only during the MLS off-season) -Concerts If you figure roughly 20 MLS games a season (including playoffs and friendlies), 2 national team games (1 men's plus 1 women's or youth; more in some places), 20-25 rugby/MLL/WUSA games (30-40 if you get all 3 leagues), 15 college and high school games, and 2 concerts, you're looking at potentially as many as 80 stadium dates per year, which makes it a lot more attractive to city councils than simply MLS plus a few national team games. Plus if the MLS team owned the stadium, it could charge rent to the WUSA, MLL, and rugby teams.