"anonymous" resigns after 22 years at CIA

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Mel Brennan, Nov 13, 2004.

  1. Mel Brennan

    Mel Brennan PLANITARCHIS' BANE

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    WASHINGTON - A CIA analyst who wrote a book that criticized the U.S. war on terror has resigned from the spy agency after it effectively banned him from publicly discussing his views, his publicist said on Thursday.

    Michael Scheuer, whose book "Imperial Hubris: Why the West Is Losing the War on Terror" was signed as "anonymous" and published this summer, will resign effective Friday after 22 years at the Central Intelligence Agency.

    In a statement, Scheuer said the CIA had not forced him to resign, "but I have concluded that there has not been adequate national debate over the nature of the threat posed by Osama bin Laden and the forces he leads and inspires, and the nature and dimensions of intelligence reform needed to address that threat."

    He intends to speak to the media over the next several weeks, including an appearance on the CBS show "60 Minutes" on Sunday.

    Scheuer's statement said senior leadership had allowed the intelligence officers working against al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden to be made scapegoats for pre-Sept. 11 failures.

    Scheuer was chief of the CIA Counterterrorist Center's unit which focused on bin Laden from 1996 to 1999 and remained a CIA analyst after that.

    "The Atlantic Monthly" in its December issue published a letter sent by Scheuer to U.S. congressional intelligence committees that said the key pre-Sept. 11 intelligence failures were mainly the result of bad decisions by senior officials.

    "While the 11 September attacks probably were unstoppable, it was decisions by human beings -- featuring arrogance, bad judgment, disdain for expertise, and bureaucratic cowardice -- that made sure the Intelligence Community did not operate optimally to defend America," Scheuer said in the letter...
     
  2. Attacking Minded

    Attacking Minded New Member

    Jun 22, 2002
    I wonder if Mel and the rest of the irresponsible Left will quote "Anonymous"'s book where he says that Saddam sponsored the AQ program to develop WMD's while Bin Laden was in Suddan or comment on the fact that "Anonymous" states that Iraq was the one of two countries (Afghanistan being the other) where Bin Laden was offered sanctuary after Saudi pressure forced Bin Laden out of Sudan. I wonder if it's the truth they want to hear or only the truth they like that they want to hear. It's funny to see the irresponsible Left pick and choose the truths it wants to beleive while they condemn the majority of voters for doing the same. Maybe it comes down to what the irresponsible Left values.
     
  3. speedcake

    speedcake Member

    Dec 2, 1999
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    Good job summing up both sides. You get a fvcking cookie.
     
  4. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
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    The WaPo has an article about general turmoil at the CIA.

    The Dems did a very bad thing when they rolled over for Porter Goss.
     
  5. The Wanderer

    The Wanderer New Member

    Sep 3, 1999
    I've been waiting for awhile now to see if they indeed are going to pass the intelligence reforms. I think they're tied up in Congress. I know their needs to be greater cooperation between the FBI and the CIA, but who knows if they're going to create a separate counterterrorist agency and/or make the CIA head the 'National Director of Intelligence'.
     
  6. The Wanderer

    The Wanderer New Member

    Sep 3, 1999
    Porter has the resume and experience to do the job. The fact there's a new head during a tense time had to mean that there would be short term turmoil. There was going to be turmoil even if a Democrat was elected head. I'm surprised the Dems even care, some Dems were pushing for the elimination of the agency at the end of the 90s.
     
  7. Mel Brennan

    Mel Brennan PLANITARCHIS' BANE

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    Even if I did somehow accept those facts as you state this guy stated them, that's not why we attacked and invaded Iraq. Those facts would have been known to Bush when he entered office, and to employ them now is to engage in that most irresponsibly Right of activities: ends justifies the means thinking, and acting.

    Which is of course the mode and modus of those who wage terror, whether that terror is experienced on the morining of September 11th, 2001, or across the breadth of Iraq by women children and men alike.

    This thread is in fact about the fact that after 22 years this guy left the CIA, how he left, and why he left. To try and use it to call the "Left," whatever that is, irresponsible, and not to examine the fullness of the thesis of the book is selective hate, not of me, and not really of the work, but, reallly, of yourself.
     
  8. Attacking Minded

    Attacking Minded New Member

    Jun 22, 2002
    Hate? The left wraps itself up in it's hate. The boiling cauldron of anti-Bush fury ignores problems at the CIA unless they make Bush look bad. Instead of trying to "get Haliburton" or "make the rich pay their fair share" maybe you should think about how to improve the world.
     
  9. Ian McCracken

    Ian McCracken Member

    May 28, 1999
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    You say that as if it's a bad thing. The CIA was in need of a major restructuring and the rumors of "turmoil" mean that a lot of incompetent bureaucratic politicos at the CIA get thrown out on their SS.
     
  10. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    If we could make Haliburton, and other companies, accountable I think that would make the world better.
     
  11. Attacking Minded

    Attacking Minded New Member

    Jun 22, 2002
    I beleive Don Quixote felt the same way about the giants of his time.
     
  12. Peretz48

    Peretz48 Member+

    Nov 9, 2003
    Los Angeles
    I just watched the "60 Minutes" segment. I have no doubt that the administration in general, and his superiors at the CIA in particular, had a set agenda and analysis when it came to Bin Laden and Al Qaeda. But Mr. Scheuer must bear some responsibility for their failure to heed his (and others') analysis. I thought his comment about Bin Laden at the end of the segment showed a lack of judgement, and may be reflective of other lapses in judgement which may have detracted from his overall credibility.

    For those of you who missed the show, Mr. Scheuer termed Bin Laden a "great man." He went on to explain that what he meant was that Bin Laden is great insofar as he's had an influential effect on history. Sorry, Mike, that is not a word you should ever use in that context, especially after what happened on 9/11/01. And if I were his superior, and I heard the thought processes that informed his statement and subsequent defense of that statement, I would seriously call in to question his judgement on other matters as well.
     
  13. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    Thank God you're not. Your name will not appear for thousands of years in history books. He said great when "not considering bad or good", If he and Bin Laden were in the same room I'm sure that guy would kill Bin Laden with his bare hands. Osama has changed history and led a cause which he thinks will make the world better, he has changed the course of human history greatly even if it is for the worse. If you question his single minded comittment to kill Bin Laden even if he had to kill a good chunk of the UAE's royal family to do it, one of the reasons he was taken off the case, you lack judgement or focus on the ultimate goal of murdering Osama and winning the war on terror. If the word Great bothers you so much how about this definition "6. Of outstanding significance or importance" from here: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=Great
    Your pissy objection to the usage of the word is just like that of the people that got that guy fired in DC for using the word **********rdly. In retrospect you probably are like his cowardly superiors who dismissed Bin Laden's power because he was a crazy thug. I'm fairly certain all great military thinkers, i.e. not you, believed that you should respect your enemy because if you don't and underestimate your enemy you will lose, and more attacks like 9/11 will happen. Your analysis is indicative of rampant PCness which will value how a word makes you feel over it's meaning or intended meaning.
     
  14. topcatcole

    topcatcole BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 26, 2003
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    I agree with most of your post, but the guy you refer to was not fired. I find it interesting that bs starred it out. Did you use an "e" where it should have been an "a"?
     
  15. topcatcole

    topcatcole BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 26, 2003
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    Who would you have chosen? Goss has been in the business for a very long time and is well respected on both sides of the aisle. I have concerns because I don't think legislators necessarily make good administrators, but to say the Dems "rolled over" is a tad harsh.

    As far as the general turmoil at CIA, the entire intelligence community has a lot of uncertainty at this time due to US politics and the on-going fallout from the 9/11 Commission report.
     
  16. Mel Brennan

    Mel Brennan PLANITARCHIS' BANE

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    The DCI has left.
    The Deputy DCI has left.
    The Deputy Director for Operations has left.
    The Executive Director and his deputy...have left.
    THe Head of Congressional Affairs - the chief lawyer fo the CIA - has left.

    These folks were sycophants as far as BushCorp were concerned. These were the folks who helped to make it a "slam dunk" for Bush in terms of slapping together a justification for invasion and murder.

    The result is simple. These folks got the hell out of dodge after selling their souls; what's left at the CIA are the folks who were trying to challenge the analysis and operations that allowed/justified invasion and murder.

    Can't have them running the show; thus the purge.

    But it's in the WH' interest to spin it as if folks who failed in their analysis/the intel are being let go.

    No; THOSE folks already cut and ran. Those who are left could have and would have fixed the situation, reparied fromthe damage those who HAVE ALREADY LEFT did by simply giving in to the Office of Special (Master) Plans, and Cheney's fantasies of global penis projection.

    Now, with Goss, those folks are being purged to lay the ground for more sycophants...until these NEW adherents grow a semblance of a consicence, then they will be off too...
     
  17. Casper

    Casper Member+

    Mar 30, 2001
    New York
    I'm not sure that there are really valid reasons to object to him, other than that he's a partisan. To me, that's not enough. He's the devil they know, instead of the devil they don't, and at least Congressional Democrats knew they had some of their own relationship with them.

    I think where the spine is necessary now is in these Republican political appointees. Yes, the President appointed you, but once you're in the job you have responsibilities to the American people. The country could use a little more intra-administration dissent - it would at least create the impression that Bush isn't simply consolidating power, rewarding loyalists and crushing dissenters. That's how I feel at the moment, and it ain't so good.
     
  18. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
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    ?!?!?!

    I thought it was self-evident that the CIA director canNOT be a partisan.

    Guys, it is vital for a large organization to have some people not beholden to the leader, to provide some kind of check. Goss is just another step in the Putinization of America.
     
  19. Casper

    Casper Member+

    Mar 30, 2001
    New York
    Other than Tenet, name a single CIA director who was not a partisan.

    Tenet's whole career was in intelligence, so he could legitimately claim to be nonpartisan. But everyone else in the history of the CIA, as far as I know, was a political appointee of his party to other roles prior to the CIA.
     
  20. 352klr

    352klr Member

    Jan 29, 2001
    The Burgh of Edin
    No, Tenet could not be classified as non-partisan. He was a Democratic staffer on the SSCI. He had little experience when Boren made him head of staff of the SSCI. In fact, outside of Turner and Judge Webster, I'd say he had the least experience of any DCI.
     
  21. bmurphyfl

    bmurphyfl Member

    Jun 10, 2000
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    WOW! That's quite the case of hypocrisy you have going there.

    You say that the left is irresponsible because we pick and choose the info we want to use to build our case and then ignore the rest. Then, to support your point, you use Scheuer's book to mention that the left is ignoring his statements about connections between Hussein and bin Laden.

    Well, it's interesting how you "pick and choose" points from his book which support your point but ignore Scheuer's feelings about the Iraq War. Here is a quote from the same book you referenced:

    So, you accuse others of picking and choosing while doing it yourself to give the impression that Scheuer was on your side. You were being hypocritical and wrong.
     
  22. Peretz48

    Peretz48 Member+

    Nov 9, 2003
    Los Angeles
    Wow, how profound. Has it ever occurred to you that it's not always what you say but how you say it that counts. Of course we don't know all the exchanges between Mr. Scheuer and his former colleagues. And since nobody else will go on the record, we can only speculate. I've worked with people who piss and moan about everything. Sometimes they're right, but sometimes they're off the mark-by a wide margin. But you seem so enamored of Mr. Scheuer's "courage" that you'll uncritically accept everything he says. And by the way, I don't disagree with his description of Bin Laden as a rational and formidable foe. It does us no good to simply demonize Bin Laden and portray him simply as a slobbering lunatic. But I stand by my reaction to his use of the word great. I just think there's more to this guy, and at some point we will hear from others.
     
  23. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
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    Fair enough, but I'm speaking more of the fact that Goss ran for office as a Republican. That's very different from being part of the cadre of bureaucrats that bounce between thinktanks and op-ed writing, and government positions.
     
  24. Northcal19

    Northcal19 New Member

    Feb 18, 2000
    Celtic Tavern LODO (
    Scheuer was on 60 Minutes (as previously noted) last night. Amongst the things he said that I thought were important was that the Iraq war clearly was a bad move that made us less safe. Now this wasn't some bleeding heart, blue state, liberal swift boat Captain or something. This is a CIA analyst.

    Has anybody noticed what a complete mess Iraq has turned into? Holy crap, this mission may not be quite "accomplished".
     

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