Ajax: We Want More; Let's Go for Four

Discussion in 'The Netherlands' started by Orange14, Jul 2, 2013.

  1. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Ajax is a football club, not a law enforcement agency. They can do little more than ban hooligans.

    Most of the problems happen either away from the stadium, like with Celtic fans in the city centre last time, or during (European) away games when it's easier for known hooligans with stadium bans to acquire tickets.

    There is little trouble during league games as traveling support is forced to use special trains or buses.
     
  2. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I'm sorry but that was a shameful, horrible, terrible, execrable, cowardly, and anti-football display in the final 20 minutes. Both teams should be ashamed of themselves for just sitting on a 1-1 draw. I take ZERO pleasure in winning a fourth championship in this manner. This was a below average match on the part of many of the Ajax starters and they really should look in the mirror and think 'is this the way we wanted to win the league?'

    Player ratings:

    FdB (0) - Anti-football should never be rewarded!

    Cillessen (7) - maybe at fault on the Heracles goal but had two wonderful stops to save the tie
    Boilesen (7) - one of the better players on the pitch and he can be proud of his performance
    Denswil (4.5) - average and no better, he really needs to get mentally prepared if he is to start next season
    Veltman (7) - good match though there wasn't much to do when they went to a three man back line
    van Rhijn (5.5) - OK match
    Blind (5.5) - had a couple of slip ups when he lost his man but fortunately no goals came of it
    Serero (4.5) - drew some fouls including the one that led to Schöne's goal but otherwise no better than average
    de Sa (5.5) - OK at points in the match before coming off
    Sigthorrson (3.5) - slow, can't control the ball, can't press, can't pass and generally a huge disappointment yet again
    Schöne (7) - nice free kick and shows why he is the player of the year for the club
    Poulsen (6) - had a lot of touches when nobody wanted to play football
    Bojan (6) - had one chance to score but shot wide
    Duarte (NR) - don't think he even had a touch

    One worthless game coming up next weekend and then we can all discuss what's needed in the Drive For Five.
     
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  3. Mr.S

    Mr.S Member

    Oct 22, 2011
    I can't see any Ajax player bar say a Veltman or a Cillesen actually making it big. Schone is too old to develop into a World Class Player

    It's depressing watching these guys play
     
  4. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Congrats to Ajax for winning the title.

    These last weeks have been bad footballing wise. I can understand the anger, but after the winter break Ajax went on to win from PSV, Feyenoord and FC Twente. The winning of the title coincided with a worse period in the season. The difference with the rest is that Ajax prevents a bad game becoming a loss.

    [​IMG]

    Not lost in the league since 02-11-2013. Feyenoord did not play in Europe. Ajax did. That is quite a thing. It's just that Ajax lacks true quality like Eriksen and Vertonghen and so it can look really poor, but the system of Frank secures consistency.

    This title secures CL money. That is important for a club. It also provides an umbrella for the youth development to do their business in relative tranquility. On top of that, new youth prospects with some magic are experienced as true fresh air, making the movement to give youth a chance stronger. Until then, the fans are not treated with good football and will have to take all pleasure out of the fact that they won the title. I know other clubs like Feyenoord would commit murder to win it once again. I saw U17 and Nouri, Cerny, van de Beek look like interesting prospects. Will maybe take 1 extra season though.

    Here is hoping Ajax will get past the group stage of the CL next season. It is time.
     
  5. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I forgot to rate Klaassen and it's too late to edit the post. I gave him a 3.5 since he did get a shot on goal but amazingly had maybe only one or two more touches the whole match. He's a puzzling player and I'm still not convinced whether he is good or just average. A lot has to do with the system Ajax plays but I would like to see his ball handling skills (if he does have any) more next season.
     
  6. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  7. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I think too much criticism of the way Ajax plays is directed at de Boer. It looks like his first concern is often what players bring off ball in terms of high effort sprints, chasing, winning the ball back, being fit, having a good mentality and after that he starts to look at what players are able to do with a ball.

    However maybe he is right with the players he has. The alternative players who are better on ball might not compensate enough for the value that the off ball outliers bring to the table. With the given squad and players he is doing the best that is possible in terms of results. There might be better footballers, but they are not thát good on ball and jeopardize a title and the money that it comes with.

    It's the job of youth development to produce ball artists who see themselves first and foremost as hard workers. Players that put in a lot of work, but also excel in the football department. I read that an Eriksen was a player that put in the most sprints above 17.5 km an hour in a game. High effort sprints, an important stat for Frank. On top of that he was a good footballer. If Frank has to choose between slightly better footballers or harder workers he goes for the basic quality of hard work first. That might be more important for an Ajax team than ever before, since they are soo damn young. Young kids go from an 9 in one game to a 4 in the next. He must rely on some key stats concerning effort to make sure he is able to counter and be alarmed in time for this reality he has to deal with. That is, until youth development develops players that can work hard and play football.

    Second of all, Overmars is allowed to make a stunning transfer by now. Hoorn, duarte, Sana. His Barca flops. Are Moisander and Schöne his transfers as well? Those are not bad. Hoessen than again is not working out so far also. If Red Bull Salzburg is able to scout hard working but good footballers one after the other, than Overmars can have a stunner also. That would help de Boer big time.

    For me there is too much critique on de Boer. Everything bad football related is put on his plate. People in charge of youth development and transfers should get their portion of blame as well.

    De Boer did an amazing job looking at the quality at his disposal and is stacking money for the club where other coaches demand big transfers to help their own CV as much as possible. Being busy with their next job, while de Boer is really looking out for Ajax and their long term health.
     
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  8. Mr.S

    Mr.S Member

    Oct 22, 2011
    What do you expect with Siggy, Sana, Duarte, Serero, Paulsen. The days of Eriksen, Vertonghen level talents are gone.

    Give De Boer the quality players to do damage and then judge him
     
  9. BTV802

    BTV802 BigSoccer Supporter

    AFC Ajax
    Jul 11, 2006
    Vermont
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    While I generally like the article anyone who has Klaassen at that high a rating has some brain cells missing. He scored a number of goals but in the last 5-6 matches his play was often very static and he had few touches per match relative to what a midfielder should have.
     
  11. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I pretty much agree with this. Once Eriksen left for Spur he had to deal with a giant hole in the midfield that was never filled. We don't know what Duarte would have done as he got injured early on and missed 6 weeks. By that time FdB settled on Serero to play along side de Jong/Klaassen. I would fault him however for throwing Andersen in as a winger when he is really a midfielder (and played most of the Jong Ajax matches at that position).

    In most matches Ajax outperformed the opponent in the 2nd half which confirms this.

    yes, I think all the transfers are Overmars. Don't forget Sana scored some very nice goals at the beginning of last season and was a starter on the wing. Trouble is he underperformed in the second half and FdB lost faith. Too early to say whether Duarte will work out. IMO he is better than Serero but was hurt early on.

    Yes he has done a very good job. First time Ajax ever won four straight league titles. If some of the young players still in the youth system continue to improve he could have a very good team in three years.
     
  12. BTV802

    BTV802 BigSoccer Supporter

    AFC Ajax
    Jul 11, 2006
    Vermont
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    I think it's pretty consensus that Schone was the best player for us this season, no?
     
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  13. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    He is a de Boer player. Siem de Jong 2.0. He is everything that is wrong with Ajax and everything that is right concerning winning the league. Many sprints above 17.5 km/h. Hard dependable worker that also scores a goal every now and then. Good to win the league, bad to develop interesting play, entertain the fans and probably to go deep into Europe, whether that is EL or CL. Can't get past his direct opponent, no good assist or key pass rate for a midfielder standing so deep, only medium handling speed.

    I heard that Ajax is after Mastour from AC Milan. If they can pull off a stunt, promise him weekly private training from Bergkamp than they might have a team coming up of:

    Cerny-----Zivko----Nunnely

    Nouri------------Mastour

    ------van de Beek-------


    Overmars needs such a coup. It's time from him to show quality that Frank shows result wise year in year out now. This is something that the Ajax fans could warm up to. Cerny is a great winger. 1 or 2 more big transfer at 17/18 years old and the next team that is coming in might look nothing like we see today.

    I am not sure if this is the season that Ajax is out of the woods or next season (football quality wise). Bazoer. Lobotka, Tete, Andersen, Kishna. Should all make push next season. Could lift the quality of play already. Amazing really that in a transition season Frank has been able to win the league.
     
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  14. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Cillissen?
     
  15. BTV802

    BTV802 BigSoccer Supporter

    AFC Ajax
    Jul 11, 2006
    Vermont
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    I should have said best outfield player. No doubt Cillessen has been very good. This Ajax system puts a ton of pressure on the goalie to play the ball out from the back and he didn't make as many of those typical Vermeer blunders as we have been accustomed to the past few seasons.
     
  16. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    One thing I noticed about Cillessesn is he's very consistent and steady as well
     
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  17. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  18. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Frank de Boer is going to talk with Spurs.
     
  19. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Let's just hope it won't go any further than talks.
     
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  20. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Who would you like him to replace if it goes further than just talking? Any favorite's?
     
  21. DRB300

    DRB300 Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    IMO Ajax should try to get Peter Bosz.

    Vitesse players resits him with the way he wants to play football and maybe he not happy with the leadership of the club. Ajax fans would welcome his type of play. Could even be an upgrade in quality. The results might be worse though. He lost it second half of the season, while Frank is a string closer. Builds up his season much better. Maybe Frank leaves a more fit team behind that would prevent such a thing. Vitesse has played games of higher quality than Ajax. Bosz play a way that the fans would welcome.

    What do people think about it?
     
  22. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Bielsa preferably, but he is likely to sign with Marseille. I could live with Bosz, but his Feyenoord past will not sit well with many fans.

    Seedorf would be an option if Milan releases him at the end of the season.
     
  23. MesutOzil

    MesutOzil New Member

    Apr 29, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Assuming De Boer joins Spurs.... good appointment or not?

    Style of play etc?

    TIA
     
  24. Antario2

    Antario2 Member

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Not a good appointment imo. De Boer knows Ajax inside out and has strong ties with the management who are his old teammates. He wont have that level of backing at Spurs. I doubt he will last the season given Levy's impatience.

    He is a solid coach at Ajax as he is a stable personality, promotes young players and get's consistent results in the league. However he is also slow to adapt his team and tactics, and not a great judge of player abilities. Ajax tends to play better in the second half of the season when he has his team sorted out. He is also not much of a cup fighter. His playing style is a conservative form of tiki-taka that cycles the ball around in defense, while waiting for an opening.

    He is basically a younger version of Wenger ;)
     

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