Adios Faux Conservative

Discussion in 'Bill Archer's Guestbook' started by IntheNet, Oct 15, 2008.

  1. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Elite "intellectuals" always think people who aren't them aren't smart and people like them are.

    What else is new?
     
  2. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    Attacks on Palin herself are kosher, sure. She's the candidate. Its when people called her stupid, etc., that got really annoying. For instance - you can attack her silly view that her daughter's "choice" is meaningful as she wants to take it away, but making fun of Trig, as you said, was way, WAY below the belt. While I personally find her decision to keep Trig is not something I would do, its her choice and her conviction. Keep it at that.

    Also, I don't remotely trust what McCain's team has said. There was clearly a lot of ill feeling there and, I'm sorry, as intellectually incurious as Palin may be, I don't believe she doesn't understand Africa's a continent not a country. All that needs to be said is "she's unqualified". Stupid or not, it doesn't mater.
     
  3. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Really, you know what this is?

    Let us know. Charlie Gibson though he did, but he didn't.
     
  4. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    Wait, let me get this straight. Your opinion is that he's not smart because he, a fan of the White Sox, said negative things about Cub fans?

    I know you have hops Karl, but how you managed to make it over that shark is really impressive.
     
  5. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Yep, that's right.

    Any person who is a believer in an obviously incorrect invalid meme -- any meme -- is simply not very smart.

    It's the sports version of "spread the wealth." It reveals the sensibility. It reveals the intellectually incurious inclinations.
     
  6. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    Well, first of all, no they don't. People may criticize Nixon for his corruption, but nobody calls him an idiot, and he was hardly an "elite."

    Second of all, look, you can't fool people in a U of C Law classroom. Can't happen. You get found out. The U of C offered Obama a tenure-track position, which he declined. Scalia taught there. The Posners teach there. Cass Sunstein. John Stevens. Lawrence Lessig. Richard Epstein (who also respected Obama). Etc. etc.

    It's also somewhat silly to judge someone's intelligence on the basis of political speeches. They are, by their nature, broad but not terribly deep. The same goes for the speeches made by Reagan (and Obama at least gets credit for writing his own speeches, which Reagan, to my knowledge, never did). And while Obama is delivering these speeches, Palin is pattering on about Joe the ********ing Plumber.
     
  7. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    So where is this Cubs quote? I'd like to see it.
     
  8. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    Yes, that's right, holding any generalizing opinion means you're intellectually incurious. Glad you don't do that about any group, like leftist liberals. :rolleyes:
    You've become a parody Karl.
     
  9. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    You're like my liberal wife ... she can say what she want, but from me, footnotes are required.
     
  10. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Fixed.
     
  11. bojendyk

    bojendyk New Member

    Jan 4, 2002
    South Loop, Chicago
    In all honesty, I haven't heard any quotes about the Cubs. My guess is that they were likely just typical rival-team razzing and nothing actually insulting.
     
  12. Chris M.

    Chris M. Member+

    Jan 18, 2002
    Chicago
    I'm not sure if I heard the quote Karl is discussing or not, but I have heard Obama discussing the Sox and the Cubs. It is always good natured even if there is any ribbing involved. I did hear him say, when asked, that he was happy for Cubs fans (last year when the Cubs were in and the Sox were not) but confirmed that his allegiance was and would remain with the Sox.

    Regardless, this is really crazy to be discussing this in terms of Obama's overall intelligence.
     
  13. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Footnote:

    http://www.suntimes.com/news/commentary/letters/1129172,CST-NWS-fanims27.article

    Look, it seems trivial and all, but when you think about it, it's a DUMB comment.

    It's a comment that plays into a MYTH.

    And it's the sort of comment that is CONSISTENT with Obama's sensibility.

    It's of the piece with cling to guns and religion and spread the wealth or a guy in my neighborhood or the rueful notion that courts couldn't make economic transformation happen.

    It's an inch deep.

    Of course, when he gets called on it, the apologists come out of the woodwork and say it's just razzing, or something he really didn't mean, or something that really means something else (as if Obama in the NPR interview was really making a law school observation). Of course a guy as cool and thin as Mr. Ralph Lauren ad, Harvard educated and all, couldn't possibly be that shallow.

    Get ready for 4 years of this.
     
  14. Chris M.

    Chris M. Member+

    Jan 18, 2002
    Chicago

    Trivial doesn't begin to tell the story. Come on now. The guy is an actual sports fan and not simply a politician pandering to crowds in the vicinty of "Lambert" Field. A Sox fan taking a good natured jab at a Cubs fan? Oh the horror. Like any fan of a team in a rivalry, he was trying to get under the skin a bit. Mission Accomplished. This is far less troubling to me than seeing Hillary in her Cubs hat talking about her deep and lengthy love to the Cubs one year and then seeing her shamelessly in a Yankee hat trying to convince the masses that they are truly her team.

    Even that, however, is trivial in the big picture.

    As to the other three statements, I am shocked that with two years of intense campainging, that is it. That is the worst of it. Taking them one by one. The "cling" comment was stupid because it set him up for the worst beating in the campaign. The substance was correct but inartful. It is not unlike statements made all the time by Bill Clinton. Voters had been voting against their economic interests because they stopped believing the campaign promises. Once they gave up on those issues, they turned to the cultural things that are important in their lives. There is nothing incorrect in that statement -- or offensive.

    Second, the spread the wealth comment was also flippant at the end of a six minute answer to Joe the Plumber's question. He was honest and spot on with the entire six minutes and then he made the one flip little comment that got all of the focus. Far from socialism, he was only suggesting a tweak in the progressive tax system that all parties in the election support, to bring us back in line with rates pre-bush. Not radical at all.

    Third, your last example is crazy and was so thoroughly debunked by people smarter than I that it barely needs comment. The overall statement was a smart, reasoned response that should make conservatives happy. He wasn't "rueing" the lack of action in the courts, he was saying that that was not the proper forum to effect change. Again, the horror!

    You keep saying that he is shallow and that you don't know who he is. I know you Karl. You are intelligent and internet savvy. Get on youtube and search Obama Town Hall and you will find lengthy, thoughtful, substantive responses to questions on almost all issues.
     
  15. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Yes, it is official. You are an apologist. Make sure you don't get any splinters when you come out of the woodwork next time.

    I watched all the debates and listened to many of the speeches, and read all the position papers on his web site.

    10 miles wide, and just an inch deep.

    Oh, I forgot one...meet with world leaders without conditions. . .but yet there wouldn't be conditions. And then there is that bus -- you know, the place where all his old pals get thrown under.

    But he looks cool! Especially when he's reading so sincerely from the teleprompter.

    Yep, it's all hopey and changey and transformy. Yep, you bet!
     
  16. Chris M.

    Chris M. Member+

    Jan 18, 2002
    Chicago

    Hopeless.

    Karl, here is a tip. Just forget about all of this political stuff and go do some stuff you like to do. The next few years may be painful for you, particularly in early February when you flip on the tv and see President Obama speaking in a packed House of Representatives with VP Biden and Speaker Pelosi right behind him standing to cheer every line.
     
  17. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Hopeless? Isn't BO the President of Hope, if not the World?

    Actually, in a perverse way, I am going to enjoy it because Mr. Teleprompter is going to gaffe his way through 4 years. It's gonna be a laughfest.
     
  18. bobbybhoy1

    bobbybhoy1 Member

    Jul 27, 2007
    in a State of Grace
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    Hey could someone tell me what countrys make up NAFTA
     
  19. uclacarlos

    uclacarlos Member+

    Aug 10, 2003
    east coast
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    I can't see any from my house, so I'll have to get back to ya.

    That's such a cop-out.

    And coming from somebody who offers good-natured fan rivalry teasing as "evidence" of lack of intelligence... that merely confirms how pathetic this statement is.
     
  20. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Is Cuba in ?

    If they're not, when BO talks to Fidel and Raoul without preconditions, maybe we can let them in the club.

    Or at least the afterparty.
     
  21. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    No the Cop Out is that a vast swath of BO supporters think he is a transformational post racial post partisan politician and they refuse to see reality and forget or ignore BO's

    • troubling ties to lunatics and mobsters
    • flip flopping hypocritical stances on a variety of issues
    • throwing under the bus anyone who gets in his way
    • the inability to get through an extemporaneous non-teleprompter conversation without a lot of "ums" (but he's smart! he's smart!)
     
  22. bobbybhoy1

    bobbybhoy1 Member

    Jul 27, 2007
    in a State of Grace
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    hey SFB not for nothing but thats a new one Obama is connected?...he has a seat at the table? you have to add to this one I want links and sources........"throwing under the bus anyone who gets in his way..... Powell ...Wolfy..Rummy...who we talkin about here?:D
     
  23. FCLouie

    FCLouie Member

    Jan 4, 2006
    Houston, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I vote #2. His foreign policy platform sounds like a disaster of Carter proportions. The biggest and most important problem being Caters mess still hasn't been cleaned up, it's just been getting closer to being nuclear armed. So The Big O has to watch how much talking he does and not do too much appeasing. Because they will be expecting the full mile for every inch given.

    I don't see this ending well...
     
  24. FCLouie

    FCLouie Member

    Jan 4, 2006
    Houston, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, not right, but very close. The "intellectual elite" think people who disagree with then aren't smart, or in the current phrasing, intellectually incurious. ;) Now matter how well studied the foundation of you argument, if it runs counter to the prevailing wisdom on the enlightened ones, expect to be trashed.
     

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