Adams/Davies path to Major Leagues

FIFA article 19 has ZERO baring on obtaining a European or UK Work Visa/Permit, let alone a passport. It also has no effect on foreign player limits in a respective federation's professional league.

Also FIFA article 19 was put in place to fight human trafficking, and the exploitation of minors. I would doubt, though with FIFA nothing would come as a surprise, that FIFA would relax this article to benefit the United States. They'd have to relax it to benefit ALL member nations, which would reverse/eliminate the article all together again.

 

I wish I could find it, but there was just a good article or Twitter thread on it. Basically, the time on the ball before pressure was a big difference between MLS and many Euro leagues. The ECL was closer to the EPL than MLS as were the next tier of UEFA leagues like Holland, Belgium, Russia.

So, I think Trapp, for example, would be a better player if he had gone to Belgium. I don't think he had the physical skills to reach a much higher ceiling, but he would be better.

I think if a guy like Delgado had not signed a new deal and had gone over, he would be a substantially better player. His game is more geared to the fast pass and move prevalent in Europe. One reason why he was better next to Bradley or Adams than at previous stops.

 

In your opinion, how does Trapp compare with Kljestan? I was always a bit undecided on Kljestan but he was pretty successful in Belgium. Not sure how much I feel he changed in Belgium but he wasn't hurt by his time there.

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Um, have you actually read the entire article?

The very FIRST line of the article states:
1. International transfers of players are only permitted if the player is over the age of 18.

Here's the rest:

2. The following three exceptions to this rule apply:

a) The player's parents move to the country in which the new club is located for reasons not linked to football;

b) The transfer takes place within the territory of the European Union (EU) or European Economic Area (EEA) and the player is aged between 16 and 18. In this case, the new club must fulfil the following minimum obligations:

i) It shall provide the player with an adequate football education and/or training in line with the highest national standards.

ii) It shall guarantee the player an academic and/or school and/or vocational education and/or training, in addition to his football education and/or training, which will allow the player to pursue a career other than football should he cease playing professional football.

iii) It shall make all necessary arrangements to ensure that the player is looked after in the best possible way (optimum living standards with a host family or in club accommodation, appointment of a mentor at the club, etc.).

iv) It shall, on registration of such a player, provide the relevant association with proof that it is complying with the aforementioned obligations;

c) The player lives no further than 50km from a national border and the club with which the player wishes to be registered in the neighbouring association is also within 50km of that border. The maximum distance between the player's domicile and the club's headquarters shall be 100km. In such cases, the player must continue to live at home and the two associations concerned must give their explicit consent.

3. The conditions of this article shall also apply to any player who has never previously been registered with a club and is not a national of the country in which he wishes to be registered for the first time.

4. Each association shall ensure the respect of this provision by its clubs.

5. The Players' Status Committee shall be competent to decide on any dispute arising in relation to these matters and shall impose appropriate sanctions in the event of violations of this provision.

The facts are that it is not as easy to "go to Europe and play in a Major League" as is believed by some. If a player wants to play in England, there are more obstacles to obtaining a UK permit. Lots of people were upset that RBNY rebuffed West Ham's overtures to sign Aaron Long. At that point in time Long wouldn't have qualified for UK Work permit, as he didn't have enough USMNT appearances.

Also, the USSF isn't going to lobby Fifa to relax this either. The USSF's job is to promote the game in the United States, not Europe....

Elite talent tends to find its' way to the top leagues. That is currently happening.The fact is that the US does not have an overabundance of Elite level talent in soccer on the Men's side. Pulisic, McKennie, Weah and possibly now Reyna are the exceptions.

 

Where are you getting international law from and why does it matter?

Why would Fifa amend the article just because the UK decided to leave the EU?

Also, why and how would G7 or G20 countries even matter in this? Child exploitation and human trafficking isn't just limited to under developed and developed nations. It happens everywhere. Statements like this really show your ignorance and bias.

 

Point taken.

And its really important to remember that Adams was essentially given away to Leipzig, the mother ship. So there was never this process of getting transfer bids, negotiating with clubs, etc. etc.

By the way, Man City is now seemingly NOT PLEASED that NYCFC let Gio Reyna walk away to Dortmund. Instead of handing him over the mother ship...…….
[They also, by the way, let Jaden Sancho walk away to Dortmund.] Since that happened, Claudio Reyna (talk about a conflict of interest) is OUT at NYCFC. Now at Austin. Coincidence? You be the judge.

Chris Richards of FCD. He was sold to their developmental partner, Bayern Munich. He was loaned to their U19s, and there was a transfer clause written into the contract. A reasonable one that Bayern triggered. So again, not one of these transfer sagas.

Something will get worked out with Reggie Cannon at FCD. I know that on these boards people like haranguing endlessly about these issues. But they get worked out in the end. People don't go back in their minds and think "damn, that was a colossal waste of emotional energy." They just move on to the next case they can express outrage over.

 

There is zero chance they will open up the transfer ages to young groups. The whole debate/discussion is a waste of everybody's time.

In fact, what we see in many nations is the protectionism of their own leagues and clubs being increased. In most countries, like say Croatia, they don't want every one of their young players with a pulse leaving on free transfers. Its horribly bad for business. And the profits of these sales are an important part of the business plan in most 2nd tier leagues.

There's a lot of unease in the world about how a couple of leagues and rich super clubs are hording as much talent as they can. This is why the rules regarding "loan armies" are starting to appear. There's no crying about Man City's FFP penalties. This is a club like Chelsea that just buys players for the sake of buying players. They didn't want or need Erik Palmer-Brown or Zach Steffen. They just have money. Neither will ever play for Man City. What was the point of signing them? Nobody seems to know. Same as Chelsea signing Matt Mizaga.

What I'm implying is that its more likely to go the other way in the near future...…………………………..

 

MLS and the USSF are intertwined in development as we know. MLS academies are in the USSF development academy. So when Klinsmann, the USSF youth technical director overseeing MLS academies, started telling MLS academy players to go to Europe.....................that was a colossal conflict of interest. The relationship between Klinsmann and some MLS clubs was severed.

The MLS academy and development system is light years ahead of where it was 10 years ago. It'll be light years ahead ten years from now as well.

There have been rumors that MLS is going to break away from the development academy and start their own U20 league. Kind of like what Liga MX has. That league will have specific types of contracts for youth players.

Make no mistake, this whole thing of MLS academy players leaving on free transfers won't be long for the world. What FCD just did, and rightfully so, is start purging the leeches. It's excellent. Every kid there who doesn't actually want to be an FCD player is being shown the door. Adios and good luck. If you don't have any intention of being an FCD player, then what the hell are you doing at the FCD academy? Its mindless.

 

This particular rule is going nowhere. It really is a waste of time talking about it.

MLS may be fiscally sound, but they're not going to flush money down the drain. European clubs pay enormous amounts of money for the Argentine or Brazilian equivalent of Gio Reyna. And here in the US, he's just given away. Do you think sound businessmen in MLS are going to let that continue? Of course not. They became wealthy businessmen for a reason. And its not by letting their best products float away for free.

If you invest millions in an MLS academy, then you expect to get a return on that investment. If not................what exactly is the point? There are reportedly MLS clubs that don't want to have academies any more. And I don't blame them. What is the point if the difference making players that you develop walk away for free (or just the absolute minimum training compensation payment). You're just throwing money down the drain. For what? To sign third string midfielders? No.....................you must sign players that are difference makers in terms of your first team results or in your bank account. Or you're not going to make the investment. These people aren't idiots. They're businessmen.

 

There are no double blind placebo experiments here. Kljestan was a good player, played UCL ball with a top Belgium club. He then was one of the best MLS players when he came back. Would he have been a top DP talent on one of the best MLS teams if he hadn't gone? From what I've heard him say, he doesn't think so.

Very few midfielders have stayed in MLS and earned DP contracts. Can anyone think of one? Defenders have earned TAM contracts and forwards have worked their way up to DP contracts. But I can't think of an American that started as a draft pick or HG, stayed in the league and worked up to a DP contract. Nagbe is barely a TAM player, Roldan is barely a TAM player if one at all, Trapp is too. Maybe there is a non-American example?

 

I suppose so...if I have to choose.

I think there are far too many possible variables and combinations to categorize into two or three different broad categories.

Edit: to give just one example of how Richards and Davies/Miazga are different in my mind is that Richards went over to Bayern with zero professional minutes (as far as I know) and bypassed MLS completely. Both Davies and Miazga had professional seasoning and went over to play in the Bayern youth system (I assume that was the plan. Significant? Don't really know but it seems like it probably would be. Davies and Richards are somewhat similar in that both were young when they went over but Davies was playing with Bayern within 6 months. Why? don't know if it has to do with the path or the player or, more likely, a combination of the two.

 

Thanks. I fully realize that everything we do on this board is speculation. I was just curious on your take. I personally don't have a strong opinion on the cause(s) of his improvement (ie age, league etc).

 

To clarify, I wasn't saying that it was international law rather than a fifa article. I didn't flesh out that part of my post well enough. I was referring to child labor laws in other countries, which do come in to play in all of this.

You do remember the player agency Traffic Sports right? Third Party ownership, exploitation of youth players, etc???

You are talking about 16 year old KIDS. When you were 16 do you honestly think you'd have been able to move to a foreign country where you don't speak the language and live on your own?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/oct/06/football-biggest-issue-boys-rejected-academies

Anytime agents are involved......they tend to have their own self interests at the forefront. They make their money when a player is transferred after all.

 

The rule was put in place, supposedly, because of abuses of 3rd world players by clubs and agents.

But the EU exception kind of undercuts the argument you are making that letting 16 yo's sign would lead to trafficking. 16 yo's are allowed to move countries, thousands or millions are eligible. They just have to be 16 yo's in the EU.

Right now, Brazil is blaming their poor WC form over the past decade to being too professionalized and European in their approach. They might be right. But if you look at when this rule was enacted and the subsequent dominance of EU countries a the WC, it makes you wonder is their is some causation.

While a dozen American kids are prevented from going to EU clubs for development because of this rule, how many Brazilians have been prevented? Yes, it stopped the fraud in African transfers, but it has also prevented elite African talent from coming. Comparing 2018 to 2010, Africa has taken a step back competitively compared to UEFA also.

If everyone was opposed to the rule and wanted it amended, it would change. Most of the leagues in these countries probably enjoy the rule as it lets them cash in on talent that would leave. But that is not any kind of desire to protect 16 yo, or that a kid like McKennie or Sargent couldn't have moved at 16 and done well.

If you apply the criteria for the 50km exception to any U18 player, you could probably let worldwide movement at that age and maybe non-UEFA countries would be competitive again.

 

Ding ding ding. Here is where the anti-MLS/everyone should to go to Europe no matter the talent people are blind: It is in USMNT best interest for MLS Academies to work. Work at home first because guys like Reyna and Pulisic are the exception, not the rule (due mostly to connections, passports, talent level).

Long-term the game is developing top talent here. If you never are able to do that, you have ZERO chance to be a legit soccer country. USSF should focus on making the American academies the best they can, not some insane passport/international law scheme.

The idea of flooding Europe with teenage Americans just doesn't make any sense. First of all, those rules aren't going to change. I'd argue the hit rate would be lower due to NON-soccer issues: How many kids will get homesick? How many will hate adapting to a new environment? They are 14-17 year old kids. Not machines.

I believe MLS needs to relax some rules especially the territories. Allow players to leave sooner. There are lots of things they should do. If someone thinks they're too good for MLS, they can always just sign with a big club at 18. No one is stopping them from doing that.