Abolish the Draft

Discussion in 'MLS: Commissioner - You be The Don' started by adam tash, May 8, 2014.

  1. El Naranja

    El Naranja Member+

    Sep 5, 2006
    Alief
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Let's ask Jordan Morris.
     
  2. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Let’s not since he was in the Sounders youth academy and is irrelevant to this conversation.
     
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  3. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Simple, as a free agent the player is able to sign for whomever they want. Players don't have to enter the MLS draft to sign with an MLS team.
     
  4. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I don’t think you’re too up on MLS rules. That’s not how it works.
     
  5. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That’s one of the downsides of this idea. Rookies coming out of college would have more freedom than vets on their second or third contract. I can’t see the league or the players union agreeing to a change like that. Of course real world concerns like this never stops certain posters from repeating the same demands over and over.

    And of the response is “give all players the same freedom” you’re no longer proposing abolishing the draft, you’re proposing abolishing single entity. I’m not saying you can’t call for that but be honest up front with what you really want then, don’t hide behind “the good of young players” like it’s some noble cause or something.
     
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  6. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Abolish the draft. Abolish single entity. Implement free agency. I’m for all of that. I think most people are.

    But this discussion is about the draft. It’s obviously not needed for parity. It enough quality comes through it. It exists because it’s a way to control wages and nullify competition for players. MLS does not want its owner operators to compete for players. That’s why they have so many drafts. Is this stupid? Of course it is.

    Is the draft harmful to players? Yes. Is it harmful to our national team? Ironically no and probably the opposite considering it is one reason Americans choose Europe.
     
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  7. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh I am very well versed on MLS rules. Players that are not drafted are free to sign with whichever team will sign them.

    Players can also bypass college and play in USL as well. Once there they can sign with any MLS team when their contract expires (many USL players are on one year deals). It’s actually quite simple, really.
     
  8. squirrel12

    squirrel12 New Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 26, 2018
    Where exactly are the homegrown territories? Is there a current map or list? Wondering how new franchises are assigned territories and how it would effect existing franchises (LAFC vs Galaxy or Nashville vs ATL)
     
  9. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    That’s not exactly what we are talking about but I don’t even think that’s true. Someone who’s an expert on mls rules can maybe chime in. But if a player is in USL he can have a discovery claim put on him by an MLS team and then they own his MLS rights once he’s out of his USL contract. Then he gets a take it or leave it offer from that MLS team. He can’t sign with another MLS team.

    But what we are actually talking about are top prospects. They have a choice between joining MLS where MLS chooses their team through the draft or going to Europe where they have a say in where they go.
     
  10. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well here's the MLS roster rules: https://www.mlssoccer.com/league/official-rules/mls-roster-rules-and-regulations

    You can read up on them yourself.

    Oh, and that's not how discovery claims, rights work btw.

    Top prospects are now increasingly home grown players anyways. They're typically developed in MLS Academies. Some players of considerable talent choose to go elsewhere: Garza, Arriola, McKennie, Steffen, Wright, etc. Some top prospects choose to stay and play in MLS in the beginning: Adams, Acosta, Miazga, Zardes, Carleton, Trusty, etc. The potential for rewards by going abroad are great, but so are the risks. As recent history has shown, top young prospects are actually coming back to play in MLS due to lack of playing opportunities abroad (Steffen, Canouse, Arriola, Garza).
     
  11. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    We aren’t talking about academy players. We are talking about college players who are forced to go through the draft if they want to play in the league.
     
  12. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Which is it then? TOP PROSPECTS? Or the run of the mill college player? Those are two entirely different classes of players. It's 2018, not 2010. In today's world, the majority of TOP PROSPECTS aren't going to college. The majority are also developing in MLS Academies.
     
  13. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Discovery claims are for non-US players, so what you said might be accurate for a non-US player entering USL. However, MLS teams are only limited to a few discovery claims (I think 4?) and they aren't likely to burn them on a USL player.

    For Americans in the USL, it depends? If they were drafted, the MLS team that drafted them retains their MLS rights for 3 years, so they couldn't sign a 1 year USL contract and then be a free agent. I believe the same is true for veterans that had a bona fide offer from a MLS team, but rejected it.
     
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  14. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Any college player that’s not also an academy player . They must all go through the mls draft. This in my opinion is not necessary and it’s harmful to the player. They should control where they start their pro career.
     
  15. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Thanks for the clarification. What about a USL player that is having a great season and is on a one year deal with his USL club. When he’s out of contract can he negotiate with any mls team or is their a pecking order?
     
  16. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Like many things in MLS, it depends. If he's entering MLS the same year as an expansion club(s), then the expansion club(s) gets first crack at him.
     
  17. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From the 2018 MLS Roster Rules:

    College Protected Player
    A "College Protected Player" is a player who was selected in the MLS SuperDraft, provided his drafting club offered him a contract and the contract offer was refused by the player. If his club does not offer him a contract after being on trial, the player will have the option to be placed on Waivers on the date following the drafting club's first MLS Regular Season game. If no club is prepared to sign him off Waivers, the player will be placed on the drafting club's "College Protected List" until December 31 in the year following the draft in question, after which date the club loses the rights to sign the player.

    Also, it's not uncommon for drafted players to be cut in preseason, and then resurface in USL that same season. Some MLS teams sign their MLS draft Picks to USL deals.

    2018 MLS Roster Rules: https://www.mlssoccer.com/league/official-rules/mls-roster-rules-and-regulations

    Haven't been able to locate the USL roster rules. Though according to this release USL rosters consist of 23 players now: https://www.uslsoccer.com/news_article/show/881727
     
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  18. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It doesn't affect existing franchises. Territories are non-exclusive.

    MLS academies have to get most of their players from within their assigned territory, but have a limited number of roster slots they can fill by recruiting from outside their territory. (That number varies by team, depending on the population of their territory and whether any portions of it are shared with other teams.) Players within a team's homegrown territory are not limited to that team. MLS teams can and do poach players from each other's territories.

    Presumably, where a new MLS franchise overlaps with another, both just get more extraterritorial recruit slots.
     
  19. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is an older graphic:

    [​IMG]

    Home Grown Player Territories are determined by the population of the City the team is located in. The highly populated cities, teams areas are 75 mile radius from their Stadium.

    Teams in lower population areas are given broader territories. I would imagine that Atlanta falls into the 75 Mile Radius territory. Obviously LAFC falls into the 75 Mile Radius area as well. Not sure where Minnesota would fall.

    I haven't been able to find any direct info yet, but teams that are in large population areas are only allowed to have 2 players outside of their territory each year. Teams in smaller areas can have up to 8 players from outside of their territory.

    Here's a good article about the new Academy Player race in MLS: https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018...s-competing-head-head-academy-talent-far-home
     
  20. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The MLS draft actually only controls where players get their first professional trial. MLS teams don't keep rights to drafted players if they end up not signing. Instead, the players are free to trial anywhere else in the league, and many do. There have been a few examples of rookies signing with other MLS teams after being cut by the team that drafted them; they're just rare since the advent of USL reserve teams, since MLS teams can now sign draftees to a USL contract instead of waiving all rights.
     
  21. tannadiceterrors

    Feb 2, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Same thing. The draft decides where they start their pro careers. Unless of course they don’t make the team.
     
  22. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    By the way, I looked into a few MLS teams' current academy rosters. Portland has no fewer than five players from other MLS teams' territories in its U-18/19 and U-16/17 teams alone. Dallas and Sporting KC also have multiple players from other MLS teams' homegrown territories. There may be more MLS teams that poach aggressively; half of them don't list their academy players' hometowns.
     
  23. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's not surprising that SKC and Portland go outside of their territories for players. Their catchment areas are less populated. SKC is the reason the Union had to draft Keegan Rosenberry, and not sign him as a home grown player. Hell, SKC has the home grown rights to Josh Sargent.
     
  24. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If you are counting the kids from Vancouver, WA, that’s in Portland’s territory. Also, let’s be honest here, the commute for the kids from the LA area is probably shorter this way..
     
    JasonMa repped this.
  25. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #500 Elninho, May 24, 2018
    Last edited: May 24, 2018
    I'm not. There are players from LA, Orlando, and Chicago. (And a bunch from Miami, but that's no one's territory.)
     

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