Aaron Davidson in FIFA indictment

Discussion in 'NASL' started by FoxBoro 143, May 27, 2015.

  1. Eric Shinn

    Eric Shinn Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    Frankly, I abhor the idea of an MLS reserve teams (most who draw like 50 people a game) playing competitive matches against other stand alone franchises who are trying to build a successful business. (The reserve sides are not in this to grow or build their brand or their USL side, its simply an alternative to the former MLS reserve league to get more players developed and match fit for furtherance of their main franchise in MLS).

    I think their mere inclusion in a hypothetical league i put forth would seriously devalue the legitimacy of that D2 league. Let the franchises actually interested in building and growing the lower divisions and their individual clubs work together to form a sustainable and profitable D2. The reserve teams no one cares about can satisfy their prime objectives in D3 and reduce costs by playing regionally.

    That of course is my opinion, as a fan i could hardly get excited to watch the Rowdies play Red Bull II, why is my pro franchise playing in the same league as a reserve team that plays in front of 100 people.
     
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  2. Eric Shinn

    Eric Shinn Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    NYCFC is owed by a "group" of investors but for all intents and purposes it is owned by Sheik Mansour bin Zayed Al Nahyan who is the deputy prime minister of Qatar.

    Cosmos are owned in part by Seamus O'Brien, founder of World Sport Group and CEO of One World Sports (TV) who conducts most his business out of Singapore and who is heavily invested in Asian sports proprieties and marketing rights. The other part is owned by Sela Sports, a Saudi Arabian sports marketing company. As far as i know they are mostly silent partners and have little to no public say in the operations of the team, that role seems to be solely in the hands of O'Brien.

    So, neither have UAE connections as far as I can tell, at least not directly.
     
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  3. Prosoccercdn

    Prosoccercdn Member+

    Aug 6, 2011
    Club:
    FC Edmonton
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    What overwhelming majority, MLS and USL fans? Sure non NASL fans may want a merger but that's to be expected.

    Others fans and NASL fans will hope for NASL to come out of this stronger with other investors buying out Traffic's B stock in NASL and the league moving forward which I expect to happen.
     
  4. DanGerman

    DanGerman Member+

    Aug 28, 2014
    New York City
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #79 DanGerman, Jun 5, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
    Wouldn't the smartest play be to join an already existing D2 that would probably welcome them with open arms? I'm thinking the USL would bend over backwards to accommodate the teams like NYC, Indy, Minn U, SA and JAX the other teams would be welcomed just to have the strong teams join. I would think its going to be more expensive to create another league from scratch and then have to deal with the USSF regulations all over again then just joining the USL and spending your money on those important things like the squad and training facilities.
     
  5. DanGerman

    DanGerman Member+

    Aug 28, 2014
    New York City
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But what happens if the USSF decides that the NASL doesn't meet D2 regulations and is being demoted to D3? Don't you think most teams might be open to the idea of merging at that point?
     
  6. The One X

    The One X Member+

    Sep 9, 2014
    Indiana
    Club:
    Indy Eleven
    Depends on the goals of the teams. If they just want to be a farm team, or have MLS aspirations maybe USL would be fine. If they want to be independent, and part of an independent league (which I believe is the case with most of the NASL owners) their own league would look better.

    As for the bolded part, what do you define as strong? Attendance? If the NASL joined USL the top of the attendance chart would be full of NASL teams with just a couple USL teams mixed in. I think by most standards the NASL teams are stronger than USL.
     
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  7. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    a) USL is not D2, not yet
    b) I see you're not familiar with the work of the guy who runs USL

    Maybe. I'd take the under. The only guy left from the split, really, still runs USL. I don't know if that would manifest itself as "bending over backwards."

    Yes, but NEVER underestimate the power of ( a ) hubris and ( b ) ego.

    The history of the game in this country is that people only cooperate when one side is forced to. I think as long as the NASL teams have options (and, again, we're putting the cart before the horse here, because the current NASL hasn't failed), it's going to be a harder marriage than you make it out to be.
     
  8. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because they have bigger budgets. For the most part.
     
  9. DanGerman

    DanGerman Member+

    Aug 28, 2014
    New York City
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I really do think that D2 status for the USL is a pretty good bet at this point. I'm not really familiar with who runs the USL but I thought I heard that a lot of the players in the original split have left both leagues since then so I thought the merger would happen a little easier. Hubris and Ego is what got the NASL into its current mess and although I'd like to think people learn from mistakes society and the history of 2nd division soccer in this country has proven that to be incorrect. I also realize its going to be neigh impossible the merger happens unless the USSF forces the NASL's hand (possibly threatening to drop them to D3 status) but I wouldn't be surprised if the people in charge of the NASL just ramp up the rhetoric and say that the USSF is trying to snuff them out and they're only D3 in regulations only but really a top league instead of just making one really strong D2.
     
  10. Eric Shinn

    Eric Shinn Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    Well, i know that is the aspiration and stated goal, but lets be mindful that many USL clubs as it stands right now would not meet current D2 criteria. Its one thing to stand in front of a microphone and proclaim your intentions to be D2 sanctioned and another to actually get all the individual owners and franchises to a point where they are willing and able to meet those requirements. NASL teams right now mostly better capitalized and funded than theirUSL counterparts, don't let one year of poor USOC results fool you....the majority of USL franchises do not meet D2 requirements and are lower quality on the pitch.

    I would argue that it was greed, not hubris and ego that got NASL into this current "mess", and keep in mind we are not even sure what if any fallout will occur. It is possible NASL will just keep on doing business as usual. It could be without the Traffic v SUM back drama going on NASL comes out of this in a better position. Who knows? But Traffic and Davison's greed when Sanz was elected to CONCACAF is how this started, brides and illgal activities to secure Gold Cup and Copa Centential rights, etc fro Traffic over SUM is why they are in a lot of hot water.

    Lets also be realistic here, NASL and their franchises are all firmly in line with all the important D2 requirements. the ONLY requirement coming up they don't meet as a league is the time zone one, which is a requirement i think is unnecessary. I have a hard time seeing a scenario where USSF demotes a league that checks off all the other boxes, including the most important one (money and ownership) to D3 in favor of one that half the teams are on the fence. Most likely USSF would defer the time zone west coast thing so long as NASL is showing good faith efforts to comply.
     
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  11. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Fixed. :)

    Probability: <50%

    The NASL is the strongest and most stable D2 league we've had in a while, maybe ever. Is is in all of our best interests that things be stable. It is not in USSF's interests to introduce volatility into the mix where it is not warranted.

    Remember, USSF didn't spur the last schism. Ego and Hubris and Selby Wellmann's Rental Van Deal spurred it.

    Boy, you're getting way ahead of things, aren't you?

    The NASL has not been busted back to D3. It's unlikely (in my mind) they would be. They have strong teams and infrastructure and they can meet most of the D2 standards. USSF isn't going to let policy in that regard be dictated by a war of words, when they have shown they will do what it takes - including administering a temporary league, if need be, and taking NASL sanctioning into executive session to grease the skids - to ensure that what can continue continues.
     
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  12. Zoidberg

    Zoidberg Member+

    Jun 23, 2006
    Most of the NASL fans I know, who don't buy into the rhetoric, just want a fun, stable team to support.

    Even the Cosmos fans I know, outside of the zealots, admit they juts want a solid league to play in. Would it be better if it was NASL...yes. If not...eh.

    Then again, most I know are of similiar age and have seen all the s**tshow years.
     
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  13. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #88 jaykoz3, Jun 5, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
    NYCFC is owned by City Football Group and the New York Yankees. Sheik Mansour is from Abu Dhabi, not Qatar.

    In terms of the USL and NASL teams. Wouldn't it be safe to say that the USL teams that were around during the split had some inkling of how Traffic operated?

    So hypothetically speaking:

    Minn United is MLS bound once they sort out the Stadium funding. San Antonio and Indy 11 have MLS aspirations. The Cosmos have at least publically stated that they have ZERO interest in joining MLS. If the CSA starts their rumored Canadian League, then Ottawa and Edmonton could be interested in that (along with Hamilton). So after that, what is the NASL left with, what 6 teams at present? Out of those six, Carolina & Atlanta are searching for new ownership.

    If you're the owners of Indy 11, San Antonio, Jacksonville, a prospective owner for Carolina, Ft Lauderdale and Tampa Bay you'd have to seriously consider moving to USL, would you not? Playing in a regional league supported by MLS? To a business owner and operator that would sound very tempting.

    It's not likely to happen, but it would have to at least be a consideration.
     
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  14. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe. We don't know all their reasonings for the sides they chose at the time.

    But the USL teams that were around during the split and which are currently in USL (the actual third division league) are:

    Charleston Battery
    Harrisburg City Islanders (new owners since then)
    Pittsburgh Riverhounds (new owners since then)
    Richmond Kickers
    Rochester Rhinos
    Wilmington Hammerheads (new owners since then)

    Or 1/4 of the current membership of the league.

    The big factor, as I see it, is Papadakis. He's a businessman, so if it can work to his advantage or profit, surely he'd consider it, but he's likely to extract his pound of flesh because that's what he does.

    I can totally see Edmonton going to such a league. I do not see Ottawa or Hamilton going because I think it's going to be a ramshackle league, if it happens at all.

    Might be.

    But, again, the history of the sport in this country makes me take the under.

    Because people don't cooperate. They don't do what's best for the game. Sometimes they don't even act in what a reasonable person (like yourself) might perceive as their best interests because there's always somebody they want to get back at or that they feel they know better than. If that weren't the case, there wouldn't have been a TOA split to begin with.

    Never discount how vindictive people can be until they are forced to shack up together because neither side is coming from a position of strength. And never discount the effects of ego.

    The clock starts ticking the moment USL formally submits its D2 proposal. When that happens, the six months after that are going to be super interesting. But this Traffic thing? A sideshow for now. Lots and lots of light, but not a lot of heat, I don't think. Maybe I'm wrong.
     
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  15. Prosoccercdn

    Prosoccercdn Member+

    Aug 6, 2011
    Club:
    FC Edmonton
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    #90 Prosoccercdn, Jun 5, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
    Edmonton and Ottawa like the 3 Canadian MLS markets are apparently not included in this new Div 1A Canadian league which is going to be operated alongside the NASL & MLS teams. FC Edmonton's owners also have an added interest in the NASL with one third of the league's B shares.

    Its most likely NASL sticks together and continues on. Like Kenn says, they're the strongest and most stable D2 in quite a while. They've also been improving each year, don't see them throwing that away.
     
  16. Preston North End

    Feb 17, 2000
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What? Please explain.
     
  17. Preston North End

    Feb 17, 2000
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can see how the requirements (section I.d.iii) of USSF's Professional League Standards would allow them to not sanction the league.
     
  18. Preston North End

    Feb 17, 2000
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    First off, no one, other than the geeks here, know that Davidson is part of NASL. Forget about the fact that they don't know what the NASL is.

    The indictment/corruption is about FIFA. It's not about the NASL, as far as public perception goes.

    Isn't the premise of the league based on shady/greedy assholes?

    The NASL could survive without Traffic, assuming the current ownership groups can fund league operations in addition to their respective club expenses. The clubs don't need Traffic unless Traffic was/is funding a large chuck of the overall operational costs of the league.

    I would hope the league bylaws allow for a "corruption" caveat, so the current owners aren't on the hook for whatever Traffic invested into the league.

    Traffic sees that soccer is profitable in the U.S. (MLS/SUM) and wants some of that cash. Maybe that is why they've been going "head-to-head" against MLS. By the way, SUM is the same thing as Traffic. Without the corruption. Maybe.
     
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  19. ZooCougar

    ZooCougar Member

    Jul 31, 2014
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I've always thought that the real war was between SUM/TRAFFIC more accurately than MLS/NASL. Maybe war isn't the right word.

    I heard Peter Wilt (Indy 11 GM) on Soccer Boring a few weeks ago. He said that league attendance and revenue from sponsorship was up for basically everyone in the league, and that for the first time ever, the market for soccer clubs is a seller's market. So even if the league "folded" I am pretty sure most of the NASL Clubs would persist.


     
  20. msilverstein47

    msilverstein47 Member+

    Jan 11, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

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