a small team

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by TyffaneeSue, Jan 9, 2014.

  1. Kaitlyn

    Kaitlyn Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 25, 2014
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wouldn't hold a breath to that. Lmao
     
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  2. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Anyone would do a better job than what current FO produced over the last decade.
     
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  3. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States



    GO SAN JOSE EARTHQUAKES!!! :(


    -G
     
  4. hc897

    hc897 Member+

    May 3, 2009
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    If there's anything I've learned during my time on this earth, it's that things can always get worse.
     
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  5. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    The relocation or folding of the team I guess is worse....
     
  6. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's a subreddit called "toprightmessi"... perhaps there should be one called "bottomleftquakes"...

    [​IMG]
     
  7. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5782 JazzyJ, Nov 12, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2022
    For that particular plot, you are much better off being bottom left than bottom right (hello, Toronto) unless you love to waste a ton of money.

    And so last year is more data to show lack of correlation between spending and results. If there was any correlation you'd see some kind of gathering around an upwardly slanting line. If anything looks like a negative correlation between spending and results. If you draw an imaginary vertical line between "bottom half spenders" and "top half spenders" the results look better for bottom half.
     
  8. bsman

    bsman Member+

    May 30, 2001
    MadCity
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Have to agree that it looks like a scatterplot with very low R-squared for any correlation between spending and success. I'd be interested in a plot that showed - for each team - the points for a season and the highest paid individual player. That might be interesting to see if there's anything there...
     
  9. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    :ROFLMAO:

    Bottom left literally means we don't spend much money and we suck. Wasting money is not the issue in SJ, our team is risk averse.

    Philly proves that with stability, great coaching and a smart GM capable of signing impact players for less ("According to information compiled by TransferMarkt, Philadelphia has shelled out a grand total of $6.41 million for the six players on their current roster whose acquisitions necessitated transfer fees. The most expensive fee they’ve ever paid is the $2.8 million they spent to sign striker Mikael Uhre this winter. The notoriously thrifty San Jose Earthquakes are the only team whose record signing came with a smaller fee." - The Athletic), you can succeed, but they're much further along on the player development side, and they've done well with their homegrowns and draft picks. So, if you're going to be a low-end spender, you better have a brilliant GM, an excellent academy, and stability in key positions, like coaching.

    How Philadelphia Union’s record-setting MLS rampage was built - The Athletic
     
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  10. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    People also bring up transfer fees, which is a valid point, and so if we add that (assuming it's not already accounted for), what does it look like then. However, I don't think you can just add transfer fees to the guaranteed salary for a given year because in theory those transfer fees are spread across the life of the player's tenure with the club.
     
  11. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I expected someone to respond with this...

    Bottom shows you suck currently. - BAD
    Left shows you don't spend money. - BAD

    Toronto spends a lot of money, and they suck currently. But because they spend a lot of money, they are less likely to suck than the Quakes. We know this because... they have actually spent money and been good a bunch of times in recent years. Just over the last six seasons, Toronto FC has won six trophies (2017 MLS Cup, 2017 Supporters Shield, 2016/17/18/20 Canadian Championship)* and been in three other finals (2016/19 MLS Cup, 2018 Champions League).
    What have the Quakes done over the last six years?

    But hey who needs Federico Bernardeschi or Lorenzo Insigne when you have Jan Gregus, right?


    *making them the first and only MLS club to win the domestic treble in 2017
     
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  12. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5787 JazzyJ, Nov 12, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2022
    Canadian championship! :ROFLMAO: Hey the Quakes won the Heritage Cup this year! TFC has had really one good run and many other years they have been a dumpster fire including their “Bloody Big Deal” years with Defoe and Bradley and DeRo and others and they failed to make the playoffs. Philly’s been I think the best MLS club over the past 3 years based on PPG so we can always find stuff to cherry pick. Bottom line - still no correlation between roster spending and results in MLS.

    We don’t need a Bernardeschi when we have a Jebo, and we don’t need a Defoe when we have a Wondolowski. We continually devalue our own players because they are not our euro fanboy pinup guys.
     
  13. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    is it better to spend some money and fail or to never even try at all?
     
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  14. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5789 JazzyJ, Nov 12, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2022
    Jebo puts in a heroic season, overcoming his second serious concussion in 2 years, knowing that a 3rd could end his career, and scores 17 goals, and Quakes euro fanboy fans can't bother to notice because they're too busy swooning over Bernardeschi. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
     
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  15. Scott Rohde

    Scott Rohde Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 28, 2018
    We finished last. How much does Fisher pay you?
     
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  16. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Toronto finished below the Quakes.
     
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  17. Scott Rohde

    Scott Rohde Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 28, 2018
    But they are doing everything they can to improve. We’re not.
     
    markmcf8 repped this.
  18. Scott Rohde

    Scott Rohde Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 28, 2018
    “We came in last place but at least we’re not spending any money “

    Who cares if Fisher is saving money when we’re in last place? That’s bizarre.

    We need better players and our strategy of not spending money hasn’t been working.
     
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  19. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think the point is ambition. The Quakes have none and haven't since the dynasty moved to Houston.
     
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  20. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5795 JazzyJ, Nov 13, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2022
    If salary expenditure is roughly a proxy for ambition I wish the Quakes were relatively unambitious like Philly or NYRB or even CO from the last few years before this year. Everyone wants to win. Competency is the key. The Quakes made a big bet on Almeyda, brought him in as possibly the highest paid coach and his whole entourage with him, and then let him pick his guys to add to the roster. That was an ambitious risk that failed. It always comes back to competency - the smarts.
     
  21. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ambition is more than money, as you noted with Almeyda. But Ambition is also finding smart people and removing barriers so they can succeed. We've sucked there too, based on results.
     
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  22. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5797 JazzyJ, Nov 13, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2022
    We have sucked mainly in our decisions about who is GM. All the technical decisions stem from that - the GM position. I’m hopeful about CL but neither Doyle or Jesse were good GMs. You can be reasonably ambitious and still make bad decisions. We did give Jesse and Doyle too much leash for failure but at the same time Doyle’s failures had mixes of success so that’s going to delay potential changes in direction. For example if 2012 hadn’t happened where we were one of the best teams in MLS history, Doyle might have been gone by say 2013-2014. And in Jesse’s case he had 5 years which is a little long but I think you need 3-5 years to implement a a durable plan for success.

    I think this whole "ambition" thing is mostly the invention of euro fanboys who are endlessly pining for their euro star pinups, and can't wait to turn MLS into EPL 2.0. You can have a moderately engaged at best owner who gives some reasonable budget to smart people to work with and gain some success in MLS, e.g. Philly.
     
  23. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Quakes 1.0 was Philly before Philly. We have the DNA but it's pretty sad where we've ended up.
     
  24. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    #5799 JazzyJ, Nov 13, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2022
    Different cast of characters: Wee Man etc.

    BTW The Wee Man is very positive about the new technical staff (Leechi, Luchi, etc.). Seems that he feels that we're finally headed in the right direction. Anyone who respects him should at least give it a chance for him to be right. I don't understand the folks (not you necessarily) who are Wee Man fans but are completely disparaging about the new technical staff. I mean I suppose you can respect Wee Man but you no longer respect his opinion at all, but it seems weird to me.

    WeeMan's post that many people seem to want to conveniently ignore:

    https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-official-luchi-gonzalez-thread.2122194/page-4#post-40712546
     
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  25. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Twenty people repped his post! He should chime in more often. Miss him posting here.
     
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