4 kinds of red states

Discussion in 'Elections' started by superdave, Nov 10, 2004.

  1. Revolt

    Revolt Member+

    Jun 16, 1999
    Davis, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Particularly when the NRA spends $25 mill saying Kerry was going to take away their hunting rifles.
     
  2. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    John Kerry's voting record in the Senate made that a pretty easy case to make. When John Kerry is featured in a photo-op brandishing a rifle that would've been banned in legislation that he voted for -- and that's not an NRA talking point, I read the damn bill online -- then you know that they're not having to work very hard to fabricate things about what John Kerry stands for.

    This may come as something as surprise to all of you, but many Democratic politicians have had a track record in favor of banning and restricting guns in this country. Not just the big, scary-looking ones, but also the not-so-scary-looking ones as well. That's a fact.

    And as long as that's the case, they'll continue to help write NRA talking points and advertising.
     
  3. uclacarlos

    uclacarlos Member+

    Aug 10, 2003
    east coast
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    I don't agree that these are the "true base" of the party. Essentially these are "Reep-Lites" that can, will and have been swung towards the right. What kind of a "true base" is that?
     
  4. Ian McCracken

    Ian McCracken Member

    May 28, 1999
    USA
    Club:
    SS Lazio Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Easy answer: Rudy trumps Hillary.
     
  5. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What does Hillary have to do with the 2008 presidential election?

    Hillary will never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never get the Democratic nomination.

    Never.
     
  6. Ian McCracken

    Ian McCracken Member

    May 28, 1999
    USA
    Club:
    SS Lazio Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Clicking your heels together and saying it a million times will not make it so. Hillary is the odds-on favorite, hands down. She is the darling of the party faithful, the ones who actually vote in Democratic primaries. The same party faithful who continually nominate sure-losers (Clinton excepted). McGovern, Carter, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry...need I say more?
     
  7. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So was Howard Dean.
     
  8. Smiley321

    Smiley321 Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Concord, Ca
    It will be fun to watch superdave go slowly insane as Hillary marches inexorably to the '08 nomination

    It looks as if Hillary has none of Bill's charm or charisma, and I have a hard time seeing her win the general election. But it does look like she's got the machine behind her and alot of clout to squash putative contenders for the Democratic nomination.
     
  9. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    This is the kind of thing that comes up over and over again on Bigsoccer. The idea that people do not know who is really on their side. They do, they really do. The NRA wildly exaggerates, but there can be NO DOUBT that if guns rights are your thing, Bush is your guy. Kerry is definitely not, even if he puts on his Elmer Fudd suit.
     
  10. eneste

    eneste Member

    Mar 24, 2000
    Pittsburgh, PA
    True but I'd say a majority of those people voting on the gun issue would be much better off under Kerry's economic policies while the difference between the two on guns was marginal at best. I just think that many people weight the candidate's position on gun policies far too heavily in their vote due to scare tactics.
     
  11. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    John Kerry's voting record in the Senate shows that the difference was much, much larger than "marginal." Over the past 20 years, he consistently voted against gun owners' rights. I voted for him because I agreed with him in other areas, but I don't believe for a second that he was committed to gun owners' rights as Bush.
     
  12. Revolt

    Revolt Member+

    Jun 16, 1999
    Davis, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't want to bring in the idea of hand guns or semi-automatics, but have the dems ever really tried to ban any legitimate hunting rifles? (I really don't know the answer to this, and have always assumed the dems wouldn't be THAT stupid...)
     
  13. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  14. Revolt

    Revolt Member+

    Jun 16, 1999
    Davis, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  15. Smiley321

    Smiley321 Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Concord, Ca
    Not to mention the product liability lawsuits which will drive more gunmakers out of business

    Newt Gingrich took over the house by accusing the Democrats of being "the enemy of normal people" and stuff like this plays into that stereotype
     
  16. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    :D :p :eek:
     
  17. Smiley321

    Smiley321 Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Concord, Ca
    We'll know it's a done deal when your "New socialist surfer dude" avatar morphs into "The Scream"
     
  18. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But see, that's the problem on this issue. This is pretty much par for the course for Democrats on the issue of guns. The reason why the NRA has been campaigning so hard against Democrats is because the Democrats make it so darned easy for them.

    If anyone was trying to mislead Americans on John Kerry's stance on guns, it wasn't the NRA, it was John Kerry.
     
  19. peledre

    peledre Member

    Mar 25, 2001
    Sioux Falls, SD
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, he wasn't.

    The "Deaniacs" couldn't participate in the Iowa Caucus, and couldn't vote in NH (most of em). Howard Deans' typical supporter was not your typical democratic primary voter.
     
  20. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Besides, most of them were too young or too stoned to vote.

    :D
     
  21. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ???

    My avatar is Brian McBride (and wife), and the caption is how Mike Segroves described BMB in a recent article. It's totally a tweak on Segroves.
     
  22. Smiley321

    Smiley321 Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Concord, Ca
    My eyes must be going bad. I guess I can make out that it's McBride, but only now that you've told me. The caption, I need a microscope.

    I used to disparage McBride, but after the last world cup, no more. His ******** doesn't stink any more.
     
  23. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Something interesting about the Hispanic vote.

    http://www.prospect.org/weblog/archives/2004/11/index.html#004760

    I think the NDN is a group specifically set up to work with Hispanic voters, but I could be wrong about that.

    Anyway, the evidence is that where the Dems do alot of work on this specific group, they do very well. But where they just let it be, the GOPs did very well.
     
  24. riverplate

    riverplate Member+

    Jan 1, 2003
    Corona, Queens
    Club:
    CA River Plate
    I'm still wondering when African-Americans are going to join the swing-vote club.
     
  25. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Big City Blinking
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting that you call Carter a sure loser....seeing as how he was the President....was he appointed to that position and I just forgot about it?

    Gore a sure loser? Even giving you the benefit of the doubt on the whole recount issue, if 500 votes swing the other way in Florida, we're having a different conversation. How does that translate to sure loser?

    Oh...but that's right....you're the one who said Keyes was going to wipe the floor with Obama.....so I should've recalled your penchant for hyperbole.

    As for your prediction about Hillary? Eh, until I hear differently, I'll give it as much credence as I did your past comments about Saddam and Obama.
     

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