PRO's website is down again. Thursday, June 12 ------------------------- New York City FC vs Atlanta United FC Yankee Stadium (7:30p ET) REF: Sergii Boiko AR1: Jeffrey Swartzel AR2: Stephen McGonagle 4TH: Ricardo Montero Araya VAR: José Carlos Rivero AVAR: Jonathan Johnson Friday, June 13 --------------------- Portland Timbers vs San Jose Earthquakes Providence Park (7:30p PT) REF: Victor Rivas AR1: Felisha Mariscal AR2: Tyler Wyrostek 4TH: Joshua Encarnacion VAR: David Barrie AVAR: Fabio Tovar I'll post the crews for Saturday when PRO confirms them...
Anyone know what is going with the PRO website? Why is it down so often and why have the stripped it down so much? There used to be a roster, stats, etc.
POR-SJ Rivas’ disciplinary line hasn’t been great. He opted for yellow on a high kick that could’ve been given as red, gave an SPA yellow where the attacker arguably did the holding, then early in the 2nd half gives a SYC for a step on the end of the foot that’s not usually a yellow. I’m disappointed TBH, because he’d been basically flawless last time I watched him.
PRO's website is even more down than it was before Saturday, June 14 ------------------------ St. Louis CITY SC vs Los Angeles Galaxy Energizer Park (3:30p CT) REF: Marcos DeOliveira AR1: Jason White AR2: Kevin Lock 4TH: Trevor Wiseman VAR: Kevin Stott AVAR: TJ Zablocki Columbus Crew vs Vancouver Whitecaps FC Lower.com Field (7:30p ET) REF: Guido Gonzales Jr AR1: Jose Da Silva AR2: Mike Nickerson 4TH: Greg Dopka VAR: Kevin Stott AVAR: Jozef Batko New England Revolution vs FC Cincinnati Gillette Stadium (7:30p ET) REF: Filip Dujic AR1: Oscar Mitchell-Carvalho AR2: Meghan Mullen 4TH: Calin Radosav VAR: Younes Marrakchi AVAR: Robert Schaap Philadelphia Union vs Charlotte FC Subaru Park (7:30p ET) REF: Ricardo Montero Araya AR1: Ian McKay AR2: Eric Weisbrod 4TH: Benjamin Meyer VAR: Michael Radchuk AVAR: Fabio Tovar Austin FC vs New York Red Bulls Q2 Stadium (7:30p CT) REF: Rosendo Mendoza - 100th whistle AR1: Adam Wienckowski AR2: Matthew Rodman 4TH: Ricardo Fierro VAR: David Barrie AVAR: Claudiu Badea Chicago Fire FC vs Nashville SC Soldier Field (7:30p CT) REF: Alexis Da Silva AR1: Corey Rockwell AR2: Bruno Rizo 4TH: Atahan Yaya VAR: Kevin Terry Jr AVAR: TJ Zablocki Houston Dynamo FC vs CF Montréal Shell Energy Stadium (7:30p CT) REF: Lorenzo Hernandez AR1: Kali Smith AR2: Gianni Facchini 4TH: Sergii Boiko VAR: Carol Anne Chénard AVAR: Joshua Patlak Sporting Kansas City vs FC Dallas Children's Mercy Park (7:30p CT) REF: Sergii Demianchuk AR1: Kyle Atkins AR2: Corey Parker 4TH: Thomas Snyder VAR: Daniel Radford AVAR: Brian Dunn Minnesota United FC vs San Diego FC Allianz Field (7:30p CT) REF: Rubiel Vazquez AR1: Jeremy Kieso AR2: Nick Balcer 4TH: Ismir Pekmic VAR: Jorge Gonzalez AVAR: Tom Supple Colorado Rapids vs Orlando City SC DICK'S Sporting Goods Park (7:30p MT) REF: Ramy Touchan - 1st of season AR1: Andrew Bigelow AR2: Eduardo Jeff 4TH: Elton Garcia VAR: Sorin Stoica AVAR: Jonathan Johnson Real Salt Lake vs D.C. United [Fascist Slogan] Field (7:30p MT) REF: Jon Freemon AR1: Adam Garner AR2: Ben Pilgrim 4TH: Gerald Flores VAR: Fotis Bazakos AVAR: Craig Lowry
Thought Dujic was pretty decent tonight in New England v. Cincinnati, although Yedlin got away with a lot even though the first yellows were coming pretty fast. Dujic covers the field well and never seems too far out of place.
I came here to comment on a play in this game. There was an offside call where the attacker was a yard offside, and both the 2LD and the attacker were right there in front of the AR. She didn’t pop the flag until the action played out, and the analyst called her out, and MLS in general, for being too cautious to call offside in real time. I’ve noticed that too, that OBVIOUS offsides aren’t flagged immediately a lot, and the potential for unnecessary injuries are heightened as a result. I wonder what you guys think about this.
I remember this play, and more particularly the analysts commentary. My initial thought was that yes, it was a pretty obvious offsides call. However, the risk/reward ratio is still heavily in favor of keeping the flag down so major action will be needed to change that (or maybe near-instantaneous offsides from computers will come in under 5 years?)
Was the AR new to MLS? There is a clear pattern, everywhere this has been put in place, that ARs new to the VAR world are overly conservative in keeping their flags down, so they keep them down on plays that are not particularly close. They are much more worried about being wrong on flagging than looking silly for not flagging something obvious. In fairness, it’s a hard transition. We are asking people who have been focussed on making a binary decision instantaneously(though perhaps waiting to flag for actual involvement) to suddenly make a second decision when they find OS to ask “how close was it and could I be wrong”—that’s a tough judgment to make immediately on top of the binary judgment.
RE: Friday, June 13 --------------------- Portland Timbers vs San Jose Earthquakes Providence Park (7:30p PT) REF: Victor Rivas https://www.sjearthquakes.com/news/...lds-earthquakes-appeal-of-ian-harkes-red-card
So, I think Rivas would want this back and that he mostly got fooled by Chara on this. But... 1) I didn't know we were reviewing 2CTs. Are first yellows up for review, too? I presume not. But, for obvious reasons, I don't like this. 2) If the card is getting wiped out, is it because Chara simulated? Because, if so, he needs a fine now, too, right? The problem is the appeal panel and the DisCo are two different bodies, so you end up with situation where one body can imply Chara simulated to overturn the card, but another body doesn't have to punish him for it. And the referee is the only one left looking bad. 3) If this is not simulation and it's deemed a good foul call, are we really at the point where an appeals board is deciding careless v reckless and just totally second-guessing the referee on that subjective determination? Because, if so, yikes. I suppose the body already relitigates reckless v excessive force, but moving down a level feels like a big step.
I can answer this! When a player receives two yellows cards and is sent off in a match, a team may always appeal the second yellow, regardless of the particular offense. They may also appeal the first yellow if and only if it was given for Unsporting Behavior, and then the IRP has to find that the opponent attempted to deceive the referee. Furthermore, a team may appeal any yellow card that triggers a suspension due to accumulation when the caution is a consequence of clear simulation or embellishment by an opponent. The key take away is that yellow cards can be appealed once there is a suspension involved, within certain parameters.
As for point #2, if I hadn't gone to look at the latest report on the MLS site, I would have assumed a fine for simulation from the DisCo was the evidence presented for the appeal. Now I see there wasn't one levied. Seems strange. Harkes did get dinged for failure to leave the find in a timely manner, though, because of course.
DISCO and Appeals body are separate groups. Simulation for Chara was not on the agenda. Regardless of the accuracy of the decision, Harkes did take too long to leave the field, hence the fine.
this continues to seem to me to be a totally idiotic way to tin the railroad. Why would any league want two separate bodies making judgments post game rather than a single body that could provide consistency in the two directions?
The DISCO is something that is negotiated with the player's union and one of the reps is appointed by the MLSPA. The appeals body is separate and in theory not a part of the league. It has one rep from PRO, one from US Soccer, and one from the Canadian Soccer Association.
Right, but also PRO's collective bargarning agreement as well. They don't want league randos overturnign red cards, so they have to be invovled. In therory no card can be overturned w/o the approval of PRO, or at least PRO's rep (who is assumed to be representing PRO's interests, but there have been ocassions where they maybe caved to the pressure and reversed something PRO was on the record as saying was correctly called. As i understand it, the main piont of the commitee is to make sure players aren't wrongly suspended from games. In fact, wrongly might be too strong even. "Softly" suspended might be bette. If you approach this from a referee perspective, you rightly see it as "relitigages reckless v. excessive force" or "careless v. reckless." But if you approach it from the owner's perspective it is more simple: "does this player really need to miss the next game for that?"
All IRP decisions to uphold an appeal must be unanimous. Additionally, all decisions to classify an appeal as frivolous must be unanimous.