2024 USL/NWSL/USOC/MLS Next Pro Referee Discussion [Rs]

Discussion in 'Referee' started by weka, Mar 5, 2024.

  1. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    Yikes! Wasn’t there something similar in aWWC game a few years back where the ref didn’t notice it?
     
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  2. weka

    weka Member+

    Dec 9, 2011
    Yes. A Hungarian referee who had a QF of the 2007 WWC.

    During a match between Equatorial Guinea and Australia at the 2011 FIFA Women's World Cup she allowed play to continue after an Equatorial Guinean defender caught the ball in the Australian penalty area. She later apologised for the error.[6]
     
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  3. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    Maybe I’m remembering that one, but I thought there was one that involved the US team. Maybe a GK handed the live ball to a defender who handed it back?
     
  4. weka

    weka Member+

    Dec 9, 2011
    Champions League knockout match recently between Arsenal and Bayern Munich comes to mind.
     
  5. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    Well then! Quite the opposite of what I was expecting; they ruled this a frivolous appeal.

     
  6. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    It appears the NWSLPA appealed the punishment levied against Smith for the frivolous appeal (doubling her suspension) and was successful. So Smith will only serve one game. But the other punishments remain.

     
  7. mathguy ref

    mathguy ref Member+

    Nov 15, 2016
    TX
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Wow. Thats the appeal committee version of “play stupid games, win stupid prizes”.

    I’m shocked they threw the book at the club. Thats a massive penalty. I’m also not shocked they let the player off the hook, or at least off the double barbed hook. I wonder how much the PA contract came into play.
     
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  8. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    Right. I’d be interested to learn why exactly the second appeal was successful. I won’t pretend to know anything about the NWSL appeal rules or the NWSLPA’s CBA (assuming that even exists. I genuinely don’t know.).
     
  9. Twotone Jones

    Twotone Jones Member

    United States
    Apr 12, 2023
    Well, in the appeals process they would have to show evidence that the player did something additional to warrant an additional game suspension. Assuming the team filed the frivolous appeal (not the player), there was no additional action from the player except for the initial action that got her the red card. So you can't punish the player twice for doing something once, right?

    Now, if she had lied during the first appeals process or if there was additional info provided that she confronted the referees in the tunnel or parking lot that was outside of camera view, then you can tack on the 2nd game. But without anything else from Smith, the only punishment you can give her is for the original action.

    I'm glad the NWSL stood up to the team though. Thanks for this.
     
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  10. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    #235 MetroFever, Jun 21, 2024
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2024


    This NWSL match was on Wednesday night with the San Diego Wave playing at Gotham FC. It is becoming more common for players to post on Twitter calls they feel went the wrong way against them.

    The play was reviewed for nearly 2 minutes on the field. I agree with the on-field decision of a yellow card.
     
  11. mathguy ref

    mathguy ref Member+

    Nov 15, 2016
    TX
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I suspect if that play were reversed and Dahlkemper had gotten the RC she’s is asking for here that she would be complaining asking why it’s not yellow.
     
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  12. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    #237 MetroFever, Jun 23, 2024
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2024


    At 3:05 of the video clip, Gotham FC's Yazmeen Ryan is issued her second caution of the game for re-entering the field of play without the referees permission, after coming off for a head injury.

    It's not seen on this clip, but there are posts on Twitter saying the 4th official did try to get her to come back but was ignored.

    The referee calmly puts the card back in his pocket, only to realize it was her second caution and pulls out the red card. Not to nitpick, but he first goes to the back pocket, then the left front one and then to the back pocket again to fish it out.
     
  13. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    Don't even get me started on professional referees fumbling around their pockets or wallets for cards.
     
  14. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would wager he didn't "realize" anything and I actually imagine that several people were in his ear saying "you already booked her!" Or "that's a second yellow!" So at that point, he's flustered and the idea that he might reach again for yellow when he heard "second" and/or "yellow" ringing in his ears is sort of understandable.

    The fumbling isn't the problem. Not knowing she was already on one is the problem.
     
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  15. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    PK? Yes or no.


    5:15 mark

    The only real question is whether the ball is in play at the time of contact.
     
  16. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's not the only question, though it is of course the primary one from a techncial standpoint.

    The bigger question relates to expectations and instructions. Penalties for this, once the shot is off cleanly (and a very poor shot at that) are normally not expected. Recent instruction has more or less codified the idea that you don't give penalties for this if the alleged foul is only "careless." This is an actual PRO instruction (and UEFA, too?) to my understanding--unless the foul in this situation also warrants misconduct via its very nature, you don't call the alleged foul. So you have to get to reckless for the penalty call to be warranted. Did he card her? If not, he's got questions to answer with PRO.

    I think depending upon the level of the match, reasonable people could disagree over whether or not the goalkeeper's save attempt was reckless. At the highest men's levels, though, there's no way this call should be made. Imagine the reaction if this was given at the World Cup, or in Barca-Real, or... a Copa 2024 match! It seems a bit incongruous that we would treat NWSL that much differently. It's a normal attempt to save the ball. Unless one thinks it's so late that the contact was mostly avoidable, I think you should be letting this go. And I think PRO probably thinks you should be letting this go.
     
  17. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Looks like he did card the keeper, so he's in the clear on that aspect of things.

    All comes down to whether or not you really believe that's a reckless foul at this level.
     
  18. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    I wouldn't have called it as I see it as careless (even extremely careless and not bright) but I can see why a ref at his angle calls it considered it reckless.

    But it does appear technically to still be in bounds at the time.
    Screenshot 2024-07-07 at 11.26.16 AM.png
     
  19. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think the contact to the head is probably what sold it for him. Also, the fact that Orlando was down a player might have been in the back of his mind when faced with a borderline decision like this.

    That said, in a vacuum with no other match context, I'm not giving this.
     
  20. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Look at the reaction of the coaches and subs after the missed shot. They're dissapointed they just missed a chance for a goal and are not yelling for a PK.

    Normally, these types of plays are deemed as a collision and no one would have blinked if a goal kick was given.
     
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  21. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    I’m all for calling fouls on defenders or goalkeepers who think they can wipe out a crosser or shooter inside the box, “oh they got the ball off so I can pulverize them”.

    But this is a terrible shot blasted 10+ feet over the goal before contact is even made, and she gets run into with some open palm contact to the face. If a goalkeeper is making a play on the ball and doesn’t as much as punch the attacker in the face while punching for the ball, I'm not calling this. Too bad VAR couldn't call him to the monitor to convince him out of this.
     
  22. weka

    weka Member+

    Dec 9, 2011
    Watching LAFC v New Mexico United in the USOC.. and ... looks like Chapman left his National badge at home :D
     
  23. the_phoenix612

    Manchester United
    United States
    Sep 13, 2022
    Houston, TX
    Did I spot a 2022? :ROFLMAO:
     

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