2024-25 England Referee Thread [EPL/EFL/Cups+][Rs]

Discussion in 'Referee' started by MassachusettsRef, Jul 25, 2024.

  1. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    And the real problem is that referees rarely actually enforce this....
     
  2. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    I’m not calling you out like you feel that way too. I’m talking about the idiocy that people have about refereeing where if a referee calls or sanctions something differently that he did at any time in the past, even if this time it’s done correctly vs. incorrectly in the past, that now he’s “inconsistent” and gets criticized for that too
     
  3. Tigerpunk

    Tigerpunk Member+

    Jun 17, 2004
    Just saw Liverpool's second goal and I guess they really mean it when they say they are not going to use VAR to re-ref the game.

    (As an arsenal fan, I no longer have particularly red colored glasses here, I don't care who wins)
     
  4. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    FWIW....no PK's awarded this weekend.

    Not sure how uncommon that is.....
     
  5. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well it is the Premier League.
     
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  6. msilverstein47

    msilverstein47 Member+

    Jan 11, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Pundit blames Casemiro midfield blunders on Anthony Taylor in TV rant - Yahoo Sports

    “He [Casemiro] was at fault for the first goal, but I still think Anthony Taylor needs to be blamed there. Bruno probably should have just kicked the ball off the referee because then the game would have been stopped.

    “Second time around, for me, there's no excuse for Anthony Taylor to be in that position [when] Bruno wants to go forward.

    “Everyone's going to blame Casemiro at the end of the day. But I still think the referee's got to take some sort of the fault.”
     
  7. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    Gotta love the Isthmian League.
    Tom Derry not emotionally stable enough to keep it together as two players start a piggy game during an injury.


    Folkestone have 3 red cards in their last 3 matches
     
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  8. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ?So due to travel I totally missed the Arsenal-Brighton incident until I stumbled across this in my feed. Looking at this as a neutral (and honestly, I don't even like the EPL in general so I'm not even a "neutral but want Arsenal to suffer") my thought is that its an obvious delaying of the restart and the Brighton player is already in his kicking motion before the ball is touched by the Arsenal player so I don't even see this as a foul/card by the Brighton player.
     
  9. Tigerpunk

    Tigerpunk Member+

    Jun 17, 2004
    #184 Tigerpunk, Sep 10, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2024
    Look everyone is going to see what they want to see but Rice doesn't actually move into the kick so even if Brighton is kicking for (a moving) ball, and even if Rice deserves the yellow card for either nicking the ball or not moving out of the way, that kick is going to hit rice's legs all day and night. I just don't get how you're copacetic with that as a ref. Surely that will, that at minimum, encourage other bad acts.

    Edit: put it this way. Either you're claiming rice put himself in harm's way after Brighton started his kicking motion, or A player making a legitimate play on the ball does not have an obligation to consider the safety of those around him, or somebody committing a yellow card offense (even a cynical one) takes himself out of the normal protection of the law. Any of those three options, I guess I disagree.
     
  10. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    The Premier League's Key Match Incidents panel have issued their verdict on referee Chris Kavanagh's decision to send off Declan Rice in Arsenal's draw with Brighton.

     
  11. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    Or, Rice knew what he was doing and committed either delay or unsporting behavior and his yellow is more than warranted. Also that, Veltman also knew what he was doing but did not endanger the safety of Rice or use excessive force.
    Both were worthy of a caution in my book.
    Where the ball was going is totally irrelevant.
     
  12. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Big City Blinking
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The "he has no choice" part is gaslighting. Of course, he has a choice. He chose not to give Pedro a yellow card in the first half for delaying a restart.
     
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  13. msilverstein47

    msilverstein47 Member+

    Jan 11, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wonder if he will now make it into the Welcome to Wrexham series:
    Referee: Alex Chilowicz (USA)

    SToK Cae Ras
    September 7, 2024
    Wrexham, Wales
    Attendance: 13,341
     
  14. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Absolutely great red card SFP decision from Attwell and his AR in Southampton. Watching initially, I thought they got him simply for being late and the way he came in, which I would have totally been fine with (though I think, perhaps, could have got overturned in today's game if it was just the nature of the tackle that made them go red).

    It took me three views to see him catch the knee high, which 100% justifies the red card. I wonder if the AR actually saw that in real time, because I presumed he caught him low on the trail leg at first. Regardless, the outcome is what was needed here.
     
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  15. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    #190 soccerref69420, Sep 14, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2024
    https://caulse.com/v/88031

    They need to give credit to the referee crew for getting these KMIs correct in real time. Everyone seems to be shocked by it being a red in real time, then replay shows it's 100% correct.

    BTW I would not be surprised at all if the 4O told him it was a red. He was immediately on the mic after the challenge and he had the perfect view

    upload_2024-9-14_17-19-40.png
     
  16. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I presumed it was the AR because it’s England. But yeah it could have very well been the fourth. If so, even better. And also less of a guess, too.
     
  17. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just on the point in the MLS thread last week about lagging engagement... Anthony Taylor decided to card everyone this weekend, setting an EPL record for yellows and... crickets.
     
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  18. Barciur

    Barciur Member+

    Apr 25, 2010
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Poland
    Jarred Gillett gave out 7 yellow cards in the first half of the North London Derby yesterday as well.
     
  19. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    Was gonna comment, but didn't see the match, so it wouldn't be fair necessarily, but it looks like Taylor learned nothing from his Euro 2024 quarterfinal between Spain and Germany.

    If the yellow card isn't working, find a red card to get the teams playing soccer again.

    But, in all likelihood, Taylor's bosses were pleased with his performance in Spain versus Germany so there probably is nothing to be learned and what the hell do I know?
     
  20. davidjd

    davidjd Member+

    Jun 30, 2000
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There they all are. All on the pitch (no bench cards). It's hard to comment on all of them in that format, but on the surface it seems consistent and not any which scream red.

    You can see at about 1:40 how low on his card he was writing. At that point he may have had to start getting out the red.

     
  21. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not quite, though. There are a few, like the 14th, that you only see the card shown and not the action. I saw that one live and Taylor wasn't even going to give a foul until his AR intervened and they had a conversation. No replay, though, so no idea how bad (or not bad) that one was.

    Consistent, yes. None screamed red, correct.

    But I would definitely say that the yellow bar seemed to start at "careless+" rather than
    "clear reckless," which is abnormal for England. Watching each of these individually, I think there are a LOT of them that wouldn't individually get cards in some EPL matches. It seemed like Taylor had a low bar for SPA, reckless and dissent, was consistent, and then had a few "must give" cards tossed (like the goal celebration and the DOGSO-yellow) and it just all piled up.

    That being said, having watched maybe the final 25 minutes the actual complaint seemed to be that several players already on yellows got careless fouls called against them, and Taylor never went for the 2CT. That may have been right on the merits--genuinely hard to say. But I think it's correct to say what wasn't called was more important than what was called here.
     
  22. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    Right. It's not about the individual cards given per se. I'm sure nothing rose to where it screamed "yikes that must be red."

    It's about the ones not given.

    It's about potentially early yellows not given or borderline 2CT yellows not given in the second half that maybe could have settled things down and also opened up the game.

    Go look at the Germany vs. Spain game over the summer. Tons of yellows and there wasn't one incident that "screamed red card."

    However, there was an obvious caution not given 30 seconds into the game that ended up knocking one of Spain's best players out of the game and tournament.

    If Taylor gives that maybe the game goes a different maybe it doesn't, but it's about ultimately adjusting your approach and getting the teams to eventually start playing soccer and stop kicking the shit out of each other.

    Everytime we have some of these games that have double digit cautions it's usually always down to referees refusing to find a straight or second caution red card.
     
  23. davidjd

    davidjd Member+

    Jun 30, 2000
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the part I was wondering about. It's pretty difficult to have that many cautions on the pitch and not end up with at least one 2CT.
     
  24. Mikael_Referee

    Mikael_Referee Member+

    Jun 16, 2019
    England
    The problem for Taylor (in 2024) is rather than having a clear threshold for what is and isn't a booking, he tries to read the 'temperature' of the game when deciding whether to issue a YC or not. That works okay in most games these days, but leaves you in a pickle when you reach numbers like 14. What really irked me in the Bournemouth-Chelsea game is that it was like he visibly 'double-taked' in a potential SYC incidents, which gave the impression he was 'bottling' sending someone off, when actually the fouls were just careless. Spain-Germany by him was a better performance than Saturday's one.

    Tottenham-Arsenal proved slightly too big of a game for Gillett atow, he didn't really radiate assurance and allowed the players to undermine his authority too much. Potential penalty for handball and reckless vs. SFP tackle by Timber are the incidents worth reviewing. Second half was much calmer than the first. In the end, still an okay job all things considered by the Aussie ref (for PGMOL standards).
     
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  25. msilverstein47

    msilverstein47 Member+

    Jan 11, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

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