2022 World Cup

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by comme, Nov 18, 2022.

  1. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    First African team in a WC SF! I think either France or England are good enough to beat them though.
     
  2. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    #127 carlito86, Dec 10, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2022
    I wouldn’t be so sure
    French have proven they are guaranteed to concede at least 1 goal against any opponent whilst morroco has been like Fort Knox almost impenetrable hitting teams very effectively on the counter attack

    It’s going to be a classic either way
    The World Cup in Qatar has regained its position as the highest standard of football.
    International football just hasn’t been this good for a very long time
     
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  3. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member+

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
  4. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Juventus Football Clube Ajax Mineiro de Deportes
    Jun 11, 2012
    GK - Livakovic
    RB - Hakimi
    RCB - Castelletto
    LCB - Gvardiol
    LB - Hernandez
    LCM - Rabiot
    CM - Tchouameni
    RCM - Ounahi
    AM - Fernandes
    AM - Griezmann
    F9 - Messi

    Rabiot is back. Hernandez is in, despite somehow causing a penalty with his shoulder? (What an insult to Jaap Stam's career.) Mbappé is out but France and Griezmann are king. I'm still waiting for another centerback to impress. Will the great Castelletto last?
     
  5. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member+

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    if that is red, then this is 1 year ban from football:

     
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  6. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Juventus Football Clube Ajax Mineiro de Deportes
    Jun 11, 2012
    In hindsight, Tchouameni did foul Saka, causing a penalty. So then it's Saka or Gakpo instead of him, although both Messi and Fernandes outcompete Saka from the right.
    GK - Livakovic
    RB - Hakimi
    RCB - Castelletto
    LCB - Gvardiol
    LB - Hernandez
    LCM - Rabiot
    RCM - Ounahi
    AM - Fernandes
    AM - Griezmann
    FW - Gakpo
    FW - Messi
     
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  7. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    #132 PDG1978, Dec 11, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    Since I've been updating my squad after every phase, I'll do that now too (not quite so many changes this time)....

    GK - Livakovic (Szczesny/Bono)
    RB - Juranovic (Hakimi)
    RCB - Stones (Lovren)
    LCB - Thiago Silva (Gvardiol/Ake)
    LB - T.Hernandez (Sandro)
    DM/CM - F.De Jong (Casemiro)
    CM/RM - Bellingham (Fernandes)
    AM/LAM - Griezmann (Tadic/Joao Felix)
    RW/RF - Messi (Gakpo/Dembele)
    LW/LF - Mbappe (Mitoma)
    CF - Kane (Morata)

    EDIT - I think I'd have Griezmann/Mbappe/Messi as the 1-2-3 now in terms of best performers (possibly in that order, but still close enough to be in the balance for sure, particularly between the French players I think). A couple of Croatian midfielders might yet challenge for a CM spot rather than Fernandes (or Pedri - at the moment I think Fernandes in that position is 'ok' enough in terms of role and mainly because of the end product difference feel he has to go in rather than Pedri still) - Modric mainly because of the Brazil game (and the potential to repeat similar displays) and Kovacic because I think it's fair to say he's been somewhat variable but generally played well or very well. I'm more sure on right backs then left backs at this point (and possibly think of the two right backs I put in as the top full backs of the tournament all things considered; I was close to bringing back Jordi Alba and/or Shaw on the left even maybe).

    I'd mention that Dutch free-kick goal, and the Neymar one after the one-twos and going around Livakovic, as stand-out contenders among the goals (I think I named seven on the thread now, but going back to the start of the tournament I reckon there'd already be a good selection for say a top 20 goals, although ideally more would still be to come).
     
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  8. That was as bad ass by Koopmeiners as it can get, to do that with only seconds left, instead of a direct kick on the target.
     
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  9. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #134 PuckVanHeel, Dec 11, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    https://theathletic.com/3988375/2022/12/10/argentina-netherlands-picture-world-cup/

    Another piece of proof of what enemies they are, these clickbait machines. Had this been done the other way around, we all know there wouldn't be an article like this. Besides, it was Argentina starting with all the shootout antics (see professor Geir Jordet his twitter thread).

    The various mouthpieces of 'The Establishment' had decided beforehand Argentina should win.

    The 'Financial Times' had placed us already in the corner of an "ugly team" (sic). Same for The Times. The Establishment was mostly in Argentina's camp. Luckily for them, the ruling class, France won yesterday :thumbsup:

    Lahoz has a track record for over a decade, still gets big games because he serves a special need and purpose (with incompetence as shield and 'plausible deniability').
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/match-57-qf-ned-arg-mateu-lahoz-esp.2123842/page-16#post-41040713
     
  10. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #135 PuckVanHeel, Dec 11, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    This particular quote is a little bit ludicrous.

    They used comments or incidents of decades ago (for ex. Van Gaal vs Riquelme) to fire themselves up. Used quotes by that cokehead and born fraud Maradona, as if that is some higher wisdom.

    They had been busy with that for months (and also busy lobbying for the right referee, number of match tickets, threatening and abusing the oranje fans). They started the bad blood and this "grandpa" comment was a reply to all of that by an (awful) ex-journalist. That was like 10% of the press.

    Most of the media had all sorts of eulogies about how great Messi/Argentina is, including the captains (VvD). This is the reality. Often they talked about how awful Netherlands is and don't deserve more than the quarter finals (ignoring how many other teams had large spells of not firing shots on target).

    All that glorified craftiness and viveza can only materialize because they had 80% of the world on their side, and yes, also the FIFA + officials (within a fully blue stadium). We are a threat for the FIFA establishment (to which Argentina certainly belongs). Lahoz was from the first minute talking very friendly to the Argentines (who were already applying their 'viveza'). The cloak of incompetence has a special need.
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/match-57-qf-ned-arg-mateu-lahoz-esp.2123842/page-16#post-41040713

    The media, the folks in the studio, here have been consistently more negative about 'our own' team than about Argentina or the other semi finalists.

    You are ultimately not more deserving of a semi final place as France, is the overwhelming opinion, but then again, they have also more resources (one Mbappe profile mentions the coaching at Bondy - 30% unemployment - had been free for everyone; this is only possible because of the 'football money' and is not a possibility or affordable here - the football infrastructure cannot be as rich or well funded). One the reasons why the viewing figures were so low this time.
     
  11. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Obviously, things are never that predictable in the SF, but France is easily the best team Morocco will be playing this tournament. Having someone like Giroud certainly help against a low block.

    I'm not so sure if its the highest standard of football. It's clear that teams that try to implement anything too complex hasn't had the best of time as INT football simply doesn't lend itself to it.

    It has certainly been entertaining, at least in the knockout stages. Lots of good games, and the refs aside, lots of memorable moments as well. It certainly helps that there are a couple of good narratives to follow as well.
     
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  12. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord




    Morocco has a few very highly rated players, also some lowly rated ones (not that this says all, for ex. Noppert of Holland was/is the lowest rated one of his team in both metrics).

    It helps that the highly rated players are more or less evenly distributed across all departments in the field.

    It sucks when they are all located in the same position (I.e. slovenia their goalkeepers)
     
  13. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Juventus Football Clube Ajax Mineiro de Deportes
    Jun 11, 2012
    I agree on Griezmann being the best performer. The only match he wasn't clutch was the easy one vs Poland. That was where Mbappé took full advantage of the time and space given to him.

    Regarding Messi, I do feel he is the sole effector of a poor team, similar to Argentina 86. There is a lot of room for interpretation though. Would the ratings for his last match have been good if there was no penalty and a few cards for diving or that handball?
    There are still opportunities for change. But Griezmann is ahead of Livakovic, whom I see ahead of Messi.
     
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  14. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Griezmann has played against better opponents and defenses I have to say.

    Amazing how Argentina has only one suspended player for the semi finals. Could have been many more (yellow card accumulation).
     
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  15. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #140 PuckVanHeel, Dec 11, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022




    Except that those "neutrals" were not really neutral.

    They had an emotional and associative connection to Italy, the football they know, while Korea was just an anonymous bunch.
     
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  16. Gregoire1

    Gregoire1 Member

    Dec 4, 2020
    Who is best GKso far:
    Livakovic, Martinez or Bounou?
     
  17. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
  18. Al Gabiru

    Al Gabiru Member

    Jan 28, 2020
    This is the world cup with the most goalless draws (7), along with the 1982, 2006, 2010 and 2014 editions. But this world cup is not over yet. maybe will break the record

    I was surprised how 1982 had so many goalless draws. And 2018 just one.

    Although the 32-team World Cup started in 1998, it is a worrying trend that four of these five editions are recent (2006, 2010, 2014, 2022).
     
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  19. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord


    Nor was there any TV replay of this, by the Qatar TV directors (convenient, isn't it?).
     
  20. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    #145 PuckVanHeel, Dec 11, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    This is imho because more and more teams know how to organize, know what works in tournament football and draw more often on foreign-born (European born) players, or players who play in Europe. Smaller nations such as Croatia can draw on players born abroad.

    Especially the 2004 eligibility change is relevant here. In 2004 there was a significant change in the eligibility rules, benefiting the African teams (Tunisia, Cameroon, Senegal, Ghana).
     
  21. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    It is not a bug, it is a feature. Belongs to the FIFA script and playbook



    Explains the lack of suspensions and their super easy route to the final in 2014 and 2022.

    Pathetic:
     
  22. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member+

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    Convenient for your narrative. I am not sure you've noticed, but last 20 minutes of the match were quite eventful.

    This is not a foul imo. Gakpo literally at the last second moves right into the path of Molina. What did he expect, Molina to instantaneously deaccelerate and avoid any kind of contact? Molina doesn't push him, doesn't tackle him, doesn't step on his right foot (quite contrary, Gakpo steps on Molina's right foot). Molina landed on Gakpo's left foot after Gakpo already lost control, but then you can argue that ball hit Gakpo's hand before that.

    There is such thing as "silent check". And it's absolutely feasible that they've checked the situation behind the scenes and saw no need for correction.

    You story doesn't add up. Why would Lahoz, the referee who was apparently on the mission to help Argentina by any means necessary give so many yellow cards to Argentina's key players for argument, insist on 10 minutes added time (add another minute after that) and give Netherlands multiple arguable fouls around the penalty box, after which Netherlands eventually scored.

    If a referee is biased towards a certain team, it makes sense that he would help the team by edging 50-50 calls to their side, but Lahoz didn't do that.

    What you are doing here is cherry picking..

    Maybe Gakpo was looking for this:



    After all, netherlands have history of being dirty, cheaters.
     
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  23. Al Gabiru

    Al Gabiru Member

    Jan 28, 2020
    Yes, 2018 was an aberration. With just one game ending in a goalless draw. The lowest number since 1954.

    I think VAR gave too many penalties in 2018 (29). In Qatar there were only 12. FIFA could encourage referees to award more penalties, if wanted more goals without a drastic change in the rules
     
  24. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Its possible that FIFA just went a little too gung-ho with their new technology.

    If oil money is truly as influential as they say, the least they can do is "nudge" the refs towards more penalties and less goal-less draws :D
     
  25. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I do have to say, the group stage, with only a few exceptions, was not the most entertaining group stage.

    It is certainly worrying that this is a recent phenomena, but as we all know, the "smaller" teams and their coaches are just so good at organizing their teams now. On the other hand, the type of offensive organization required to break down these types of defenses usually require quite a bit more time than that afforded by NT football.

    Unless you have a team that draws heavily from 1-2 teams (eg. Spain 2010) or a team that has been together for quite a while, including the manager (Germany 2014) you are unlikely to be very smooth.

    England, of course, has had that opportunity with Southgate, but the team has been through quite a bit of changes. This new lot now has a couple of years to prepare, especially the midfielder which are all quite new but are entering their prime. If Southgate remains, we should be expecting some pretty decent football from his team.
     

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