2021 Nations League "Finals"

Discussion in 'Italy: National Teams' started by calabrese8, Oct 4, 2021.

  1. johnny6

    johnny6 Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    Jun 29, 2011
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    No one cares about 3rd place in a meaningless tournament
     
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  2. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I don't get why they would have a 3rd place game this tournament but not in the European Cup whic was way more important....
     
  3. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Didn't I just say it is a glorified friendly? Still useful to keep good form in preparation for the upcoming WC qualifiers, which do matter.
     
  4. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    I think we played very well, except for shaky defense in the last third of the second half. They are old and we need a solution to replace them but when Bonucci and Chiellini are not playing, our defense is shakier.

    Well, Bonucci was almost single-handedly responsible for our loss to Spain; one can't win against the best possession-keeping team in the world with one man down.

    But when he is not boneheaded and Chiellini is also there, there is no doubt that our defense plays better.
     
  5. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Donnarumma played well and had important saves but failed in their goal in comic fashion, with the ball going between his legs.
     
  6. Nek Sanalet

    Nek Sanalet Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    Dec 30, 2013
    NYC
    Club:
    AC Milan
    So we lost because of Berna and Barella, but not Insigne missing a sitter my nonna would of scored on. And I’ve watched Kean and Raspadori quite a bit. Neither will come close to being as good for their clubs as Immobile or Belotti. They are second rate. Mancini is right going with a false 9 when his two CF’s are out. I’m pretty sure Berna started because Berardi had a slight knock.

    And let’s relax with Tonali. After a spun par first season with Milan, he’s been great this year. Still very young. Absolutely no reason to start him on the national team against Spain. Let him slowly work his way into the Azzurri. I agree about Donna 100%. You explained it perfectly.
     
  7. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    #82 Brasitusa, Oct 10, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2021
    Milan fans are making fun of Donnarumma in social media. Funny twitter saying "Milan fans did this to him" with a picture of the ball going between his legs, with the caption say "4 Milan fans whistled him, now he can't stop spreading his legs for the opposition."
     
  8. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    #83 Brasitusa, Oct 10, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2021
    Yes, Insigne's miss was terrible; I did talk about it at the time, said that game could have been very different if he had scored; just forgot to include it in this post you quoted, but agreed on this.

    --------

    Stats for Tonali for this Serie A season show unprecedented 99 percentile in ALL fundamentals for his position: assists, passes completed, passes attempted, total passing distance, progressive passing distance, pass completion percentage (short), passes completed (long), passes attempted (long), passes into final third, progressive passes, dead-ball passes, passes from free-kicks, switches, corner kicks, passes attempted (right), SCA (PassDead), GCA (PassDead), touches, pass targets, passes received, xA, key passes, live-ball passes, straight corner kicks, high passes, GCA (Def), Carries.

    That's a player who should be starting for ANY team including the national team, in my book. The only thing against him is that he is young. Young and brilliant. If managers of national teams were always prejudiced against young players, Pelé would not have been decisive at age 17 in winning the World Cup for Brazil in 1958.

    I'm not saying that Tonali is Pelé... I'm just saying that Mancini sometimes favors veterans over better younger players. I think that's a fact. I think that since this tournament is a glorified set of friendlies, it would have been nice for Mancini to give Tonali a shot against Spain.

    --------

    You may be right about Kean and Raspadori though; both unimpressive today except for one scoring opportunity for Raspadori.
     
  9. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    At least they won another medal.

    Just think back to where Italy’s national team program was when they were eliminated from World Cup in 2018 and they hit rock bottom.

    Since then, Roberto Mancini steered. the program to 38 wins and 1 loss.
     
  10. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Another twitter, "in my life I've never seen a goalkeeper spread their legs so wide that close to an attacker. What did he expect?"

    So, Donnarumma in these two games was far from the form he showed in the Euro.

    Not playing for months, warming PSG's bench, is taking a toll.

    Which is a problem for the qualifiers, because we don't have any Italian goalkeeper any close to Donnarumma's talent when he is in top shape. So, we'll have to continue the WC Qualifiers with a diminished Donnarumma. That's a concern.
     
  11. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Agreed but just a correction; it's not 38 wins, it's 38 undefeated games with some draws counted in that number.

    Mancini's record for Italy has 30 wins.
     
  12. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
  13. johnny6

    johnny6 Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    Jun 29, 2011
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Yep, warming the PSG bench and having our own fans boo Donnarumma is definitely taking its toll on him physically and mentally. By all means i'll never fault an individual for pursuing his monetary worth but it is definitely and a double edged sword.
     
  14. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Yes, sure, the Nations League is a set of glorified friendlies, but I wouldn't put down what we did. You know, all nations in Europe participated, and we placed higher than all of them except two, got bronze medal, almost exclusively because of one bad move by Bonucci who elbowed an attacker and doomed our team (nobody beats Spain one man down). I have no doubt that we'd have beaten Spain if we hadn't played one man down for 62 minutes plus stoppage time. Before the red card we were playing better than they were (not by much, but yes); that miss by Insigne was also instrumental; if scored, the game would have been very different.

    So, we lost by the minimum score (2-1) to a very excellent team, playing 1 man down for most of the semifinal, and convincingly won the 3rd place match.

    The last 4 had arguably the best 4 European teams (Spain, France, Italy, Belgium), England would be in the top 5.

    So 3rd overall by a hair after an unfortunate event in the semifinal, is definitely not bad.

    We are missing a good center forward. We need a replacement for center back. LB, we're all set assuming that Spina recovers nicely and comes back showing the same form he had before the injury. RB, Di Lorenzo and Florenzi are not brilliant; likely Calabria is better than they are but Mancini doesn't favor young guys. Donnarumma is no longer in top shape. So I see our defense as vulnerable; our midfield is great as usual, and if we can solve the center forward problem, we'll be dangerous in Qatar.

    Even with the booboos we have, we are definitely among the top 5 European teams, and closer to top 2 than top 5.

    Qatar basically adds Brazil and Argentina... all the other add-ons can't compete with the top European teams.

    So, we're top 7 for Qatar. Likely top 4. We can win it. It won't be easy. We'll have to count on some things falling favorably on our lap.
     
  15. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I stand corrected...

    It wasn't 38 wins it was 37 games without a loss....

    As far as football records go, the Italians’ record 37-match unbeaten streak remains a remarkable feat

    Anyway since 2018, Italy set the new world record and had a great run culminating with their Euro Cup win!

    All they need now is to qualify for World Cup 2022 and do well in that tournament.

    Forza Italia!
     
  16. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    It’s worse in California. At least you aren’t here!

    We even have an Italian named Nancy Pelosi who actually met with the Pope yesterday!

    mamma mia!
     
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  17. r0adrunner

    r0adrunner Member+

    Jun 4, 2011
    London, UK
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Of course it is far from the prestige of the EC, but the win today still counts for FIFA ranking points which will be used to decide the seeded 8 teams in next April's WC draw.

    Also, winning is always positive, no matter what game you are playing. Mancini has cultivated a winning mentality in this squad and that is very important. To win helps to win, after all.

    Overall, we did not learn much that we did not already know in this tournament. All the focus now should be on arriving in the best possible condition for the game against Switzerland next month.
     
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  18. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Yeah Pelosi is a joke! I got yelled out for not wearing a mask outside. I never do though.

    Anyway, as far as the Nations League tournament is concerned, it was invented to replace the international friendly matches previously played on the FIFA International Match Calendar and so the games would be more competitive.

    In that respect, I can see the importance of these games. I’d rather have Italy play in this competition as opposed to a meaningless friendly game where all a coach does is try out players , formations and tactics.
     
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  19. Mean Machine

    Mean Machine Member+

    May 23, 2018
    We played well. Disappointed in that loss to Spain, but we really only have ourselves to blame, especially Bonucci getting sent off. We will never beat Spain a man down, regardless of tactics. With that said, I do think we would've been better to deploy physical and counterattacking tactics against Spain as another user mentioned. Really trying to do possession based against Spain really isn't a good idea, because Spain are extremely experienced and masters at possession football. It's almost impossible to outplay them in possession. Honestly even if Spain faced a club team like Real, Barca, or Bayern, I would fancy Spain to shade possession at least by a bit. Can't win everything, and Nations League isn't as big as the European Cup. Nations League is more like Coppa Italia for National Teams. It's like comparing coppa Italia to Champions League. Obviously UCL is a lot more serious.

    Anyways glad to get third place! Seriously, why don't they have a third place in the European Cup? Definitely something I wondered. Many people will disagree with me, but I value the importance of third place matches especially because it hurts to lose in the semis, and at least you can make third place if you do lose and end with a win. Just gives teams a second chance to end their tournaments with a win.
     
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  20. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    There should be a 3rd place game in the Euro Cup.

    I don't really know why there isn't any such game.

    Anyway, the crowd at the Juventus Stadium seemed lively and was totally behind Italy even if it was only a bronze medal game.

    I'm wondering why Italy got to host both the 3rd place and the final game of this Nations League?

    Is it because they won the Euro?
     
  21. 'Uaglio

    'Uaglio Member+

    Jun 8, 2004
    NYC
    We played very well against Belgium. Neither team was full strength, but we definitely deserved the win. Chiesa is playing out of his mind, and Barella was very good today too. Actually, Berardi was great as well.

    The one thing I don't like is that we still are a little too leaky on defense. Belgium broke us down a few times. The fullbacks are not protecting the CBs enough, and Acerbi just doesn't cut it for me in the middle. Bastoni needs more experience but the talent is there.
     
  22. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
  23. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    #98 Brasitusa, Oct 10, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2021
    You're 21? You'll grow older and (hopefully) you'll learn some manners, and some respect for others. I'll credit your immaturity and rude behavior to your young age, and will think that you're not a lost case yet. Do learn, though. On the other hand, I don't have to interact with rude youngsters like you, so now you're a proud member of my Ignore list. Have a long and safe life.
     
  24. Brasitusa

    Brasitusa Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    May 14, 2014
    Club:
    New York City FC
    #99 Brasitusa, Oct 10, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2021
    These games were scheduled to happen in Italy way before the EURO was played.
    Yes, the Juve crowd was more generous to the Azzurri than the Milanisti. Like I said earlier in this thread, I personally would not have whistled Donnarumma, but I understand why some did. Psychologically speaking, it does make a bit of a difference to have the home crowd fully behind the team. Professional players shouldn't be that susceptible to crowd behavior, but they are human beings, too.
     
  25. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    #100 falvo, Oct 11, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2021
    He is still dominant in my opinion, regardless of his age.

    He is also 5 times better than Acerbi.

    Even against Spain , he came in and settled the defense right away and should have started that game.
     

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