2021 Gold Cup, Olympic, and even WCQ player pool prediction roster thread

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by Eleven Bravo, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    2020 Covid pandemic caused the biggest disruption to the soccerverse than any other event in our lifetimes (unless you were around in the 40’s), so we, like every other nation, will have to rebuild. On that point, I actually believe we benefit more than other nations with a do-over. We were falling off a cliff, and now we have some players really making a name for themselves who were not in the picture a year ago (or they were injured). That said, what’s the core of your group as you build towards the big events in 2021 - The Gold Cup, Olympics, and WCQ?

    First off, Olympic eligible players who are too valuable to the senior team to be included:

    -Christian Pulisic - WF, CAM
    -Tyler Adams - MF
    -Wes McKennie - MF
    -Sergino Dest - R/LB
    -Gio Reyna - CAM
    -Josh Sargent - FW

    It’s questionable if Antonee Robinson, Tim Weah, Konrad de la Fuente, Johnny Cardoso, Jackson Yuiell, Branden Aaronson, Reggie Cannon, Chris Richards, and Sam Vines will need to play up. But for now, I’ll count them case-by-case.

    Also, there will probably still be a different Qualifying team from the Actual team, as I am going to consider all abroad players as ineligible for the Qualification - unless declared otherwise.

    More so, I’ll also point out that our Olympic aged Goalkeeper situation is atrocious. And our #2 goalkeeper in the pool should be the de facto starting keeper for the Olympics. Right now, I’d look to give that spot to Matt Turner, for that reason.

    Okay, that said...

    Our primary player pool for the WCQ (4 deep + some possible January Camp contenders)

    GK: 1. Steffen, 2. Turner, 3. Guzan, 4. Johnson
    ...Hamid, Frei

    RB: 1. Yedlin, 2. Cannon*, 3. Chandler, 4. Araujo*
    ...Lennon*, Reynolds*, Lima

    LB: 1. Dest* (RB), 2. Antonee, 3. Gasper, 4. Ream
    ...Vines*, Bello*

    CB: 1. Brooks, 2. Richards*, 3. Palmer-Brown*, 4. Long, 5. Zimmerman, 6. Alvarado, 7. Miazga, 8. Carter-Vickers*
    ...McKenzie*, Miles*, Opara

    MF: 1. McKennie*, 2. Adams*, 3. Johnny*, 4. Nagbe (?), 5. Morales, 6. Yuiell*, 7. Pomykal*, 8. Sands*
    ...Acosta, Delgado, Roldan

    AM: 1. Reyna*, 2. Aaronson*, 3. Lletget, 4. Ledezma*

    WF: 1. Pulisic* (AM), 2. Konrad*, 3. Morris, 4. Mueller, 5. Boyd, 6. Holmes, 7. Ferreira*, 8. Llanez *
    ...Arriola (injured), Rodriguez, Baird

    FW: 1. Sargent*, 2. Weah*, 3. Zardes, 4. Altidore, 5. Johannsson (+)
    ...Ebobisse*, Akinola* , Bunbury, Shelton, Wooten, Agudelo

    Olympic Qualifying Player Pool (4 deep) - MLS Only:
    GK: 1. Marcinkowski, 2. Ochoa, 3. Klinsmann, 4. Scott

    RB: 1. Araujo (RW), 2. Duncan (LB), 3. Reynolds, 4. Dotson (MF)

    LB: 1. Bello, 2. Vines, 3. Herrera (RB), Real

    CB: 1. McKenzie, 2. Miles, 3. Glad, 4. Pineda, 5. Pines, 6. Campbell, 7. Akanyirigie, 8. Keita
    ...Boateng, Trusty

    MF: 1. Pomykal, 2. Sands, 3. Yuiell, 4. Williamson, 5. Tessman, 6. Servania, 7. Amaya, 8. Parks
    ...Atencio, Cerrillo, Haak, Maher, Hoffman, Berhalter, Leyva

    AM: 1. Aaronson, 2. Busio, 3. Bassett, 4. Mihailovic

    WF: 1. Ferreira, 2. Lewis, 3. Lennon (RB), 4. Fontana, 5. Michel, 6. Robinson, 7. Cowell, 8. Wolff

    FW: 1 Ebobisse, 2. Akinola, 3. Pepi, 4. Dike
    ...Vasquez, Ocampo-Chavez, Conway, Fernandez, Toye, De Vries, Sealy

    Yanks abroad, not forgotten, but not on the senior qualifying list nor Olympic qualifying list (because they’re playing abroad):
    GK - Horvath, Odunze*, Las*

    RB - Olosunde *, Scally *, Moore *

    LB - Kobe *, Travian *, Sepulveda *

    CB - Edwards *, Maloney * , Piere * (dual), Sandler * (Dual)

    MF - Kayo *, Durkin *, Otasowie *, Cappis *, Musah * (dual), Booth *

    AM - Mendez *, Green * , Miljevic *, Sonora * , De la Torre *

    WF - Harper *, Sabbi *, Amon *, Vassilev *, Gooch, Efford, Saucedo *, Tillman brothers * (dual), Akale *, Perez * , Ritaccio * , Taitague *

    FW - Hoppe *, Gioacchini *, Balogun * (dual), Wright * , Novakovich, Wood, Soto *, Sanogo *, Kelman * , Siebatcheu *, Gomez *, Butler *, Malone *

    Guys we don’t need to see anymore:
    Lovitz, Roldan, Bradley, Trapp, Lima, Baird
    (Zardes and Altidore are still necessary)

    Gold Cup Roster Prediction:
    GK Steffen, Guzan, Johnson
    RB Yedlin, Cannon
    LB Dest, Antonee
    CB Brooks, Richards, Long, Alvarado
    MF Adams, McKennie, Johnny, Nagbe
    AM Reyna, Lletget
    WF Pulisic, Morris, Konrad, Mueller
    FW Sargent, Weah

    Olympic Tournament Predicted Roster (* = overage)

    GK Turner*, Marcinkowski, Odunze
    RB Araujo, Duncan
    LB Bello, Vines
    CB Palmer-Brown, McKenzie (CPT), Carter-Vickers, Miles
    MF Yuiell, Pomykal, Sands, Busio
    AM Aaronson, Ledezma
    WF Ferreira, Llanez, Vassilev, Taitague
    FW Ebobisse, Akinola
     
  2. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So, that being the player pool, the next steps are:

    1. who is the captain?
    2. What type of playing style do we want?

    On the captain, it really should be between three choices: McKennie, Pulisic, or Adams. This is their team. And they need to step up and lead it. In that race, Pulisic is my clear, cut third choice. He tends to be the most injury prone, but he’s also the most soft spoken. Then, I’d say Adams falls short because of his injury history, even though he seems to be the leader type - reserved, but outspoken when he needs to be. Cares about the team, but looks like he’ll light into someone when needed. Thus, McKennie is it - especially after his transfer to Juventus, where he sure is to lift a trophy this year. He’s the most outspoken and has the most gregarious personality. In short, no more rotating the damn thing around like it doesn’t mean anything. This team needs leadership. And we need our leaders to step up.

    Next > playing style. I’m okay with the Dutch style 433 playing formation. It seems to fit our best players and Berhalter seems married to it. Now, a few things need to be sorted out. One, our center backs is a weak link, so we need to be aware of that. But our strength is our up-and-comer attacks. For example, if everyone stays healthy and in form, Weah has a resurgence, Antonee starts playing, and Konrad emerges for Barcelona - relatively reasonable requests - this team should boss teams in the attack. In other words, attack, attack, attack. Pulisic, Reyna, Sargent, Weah/Konrad/? pressing the attack. McKennie and Adams police the field, cleaning up loose balls and getting it to one of the main attackers. And Dest and Antonee bombarding the wings. None of this let’s pass it around the back forever crap. No, let’s go direct, realize that an attack that consists of what we possess should be good enough to contend with the best of them. That doesn’t mean we don’t defend. But we need to play with some attitude.
     
  3. FC Tallavana

    FC Tallavana Member+

    Jul 1, 2004
    La Quinta

    Are there conflicting qualifying dates that would prevent our top U23s from playing in the Olympics?
     
  4. TarHeels17

    TarHeels17 Member+

    Jan 10, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, but it's pretty unreasonable to ask the club if they can play in two tournaments considering the offseason for the player would be miniscule. The Olympics are technically a youth tournament and thus the club can turn down the call up. It's why Neymar didn't play in the Copa America in 2016 - his club said they'd turn down the Olympics if he played both, so they agreed not to call him up for the CA if he could play in the Olympics.
     
  5. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Honestly, I’m conflicted on the prioritization between the Gold Cup and the Olympics. Personally, I favor the Olympics. I think it would matter more if we went far in the Olympics, compared to a good result at the Gold Cup.

    If we were to prioritize the Olympics my line-ups would be:

    Olympic:
    GK Steffen *, Marcinkowski, Scott
    RB Dest, Cannon
    LB Antonee, Bello
    CB Brooks*, Richards, Palmer-Brown, McKenzie
    MF McKennie, Adams, Johnny, Sands
    AM Reyna, Aaronson
    RW Konrad, Llanez
    FW Sargent, Weah
    LW Pulisic, Ferreira

    Gold Cup:
    GK Turner, Guzan, Johnson
    RB Yedlin, Araujo
    CB Long, Zimmerman, Alvarado, Miazga
    LB Gasper, Vines
    MF Yuiell, Morales, Nagbe, Durkin
    AM Lletget, Ledezma
    RW Morris, Boyd
    FW Zardes, Altidore
    LW Mueller, Holmes
     
  6. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    largegarlic repped this.
  7. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    #7 IndividualEleven, Oct 2, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2020
    Doyle actually did a good job with his reasoning on the selection of the various rosters.

    He provided the following dates:
    Gold Cup: July 10 - Aug 1
    U20 WC: May 20 - June 12
    Olympics: July 22 - Aug 7
    Concacaf Nations Cup: TBD, but likely in June and preceding WCQing.
    World Cup Qualifying: for the US, likely starts in June.

    A-Team goes to:
    Nations Cup then WCQing

    Send Matt Turner(whom Doyle thinks should be the #1) to the Olympics

    The quibbles over each roster would:
    US Olympic Team:
    Aaronson
    will likely be in Austria and so not available.
    Would Yedlin's Euro-team release him?
    Opara stated he was not interested in International soccer

    U20s
    USL players should be considered, especially at the weaker positions. USL C'ship is good level for U20 player. Jonathan Gomez. Jose Gallegos. Alec Diaz or another USL striker.

    Araujo should be starting, either at rb or on as a shuttler. He's been very good in league play--better than Reynolds. Give Reynolds a shot at centerback. The move worked for Jonathan Spector....at least until the hip surgery.

    Gold Cup:
    Unless his game improves, Roldan is best used as a shuttler.
    Boyd has struggled.
    Durkin does not appear to be excelling in Belgium.
    I'm not sure about Moore. We have Dest, Cannon, Araujo, Herrera, Duncan, Bye, Yedlin, Lima, and Hollingshead.
    Hopefully Farfan is out of Portland and starting somewhere.
     
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  8. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You send the same core group to qualifying as Nations' League, but lineup selections for the latter could be impacted by not wanting anyone that important to pick up a knock. So it could be more the backups than starters, not full A team. You hate to potentially sacrifice a title, but we didn't care the Gold Cup was won when we were dq'ed for the WC last cycle.

    I think at the very least there should be some rotation involved to keep players fresh & not increase the chances of muscle injuries. The UNL & WCQ'ers will presumably be close together.

    As far as the Olympics go, there is no conflict internationally, & I'd risk the player or two falling out of favor w/ their clubs, for a chance at a major title. So I'd still effort to get as many players included as possible, & use the GC as leverage, threatening we'd call them up for that anyway. Given it's a young group, many wouldn't be integrated w/ the NT, so we may want the opportunity either way.
     
  9. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Vis a vis Doyle's lineup suggestions:

    - Too much riffraff w/ the seniors. Turner or Horvath should be there. Aaronson & Pomykal should be over also-rans like Arriola & Yueill. Lima over Yedlin?!?! Zardes has played well enough for club & country to be at qualifying/UNL.

    - Criminally underrates Araujo. Should be starting in u-20 WC & u-23 OQ. Maybe he's the center back so you don't have a weak link next to Otasowie.

    - Paredes needs to start at the u-20 WC too. Also too good & versatile - shout at lb or cm. Heck, I may start him in OQ too, at winger where we have a dearth.

    - Gioacchini is playing at a reasonable level & better at his than Pepi, so I think that's a battle. He doesn't even have Nick on the roster.

    - I think Booth is overrated, but wouldn't exclude him from the roster entirely.

    - Even though that's a b-team or worse GC roster by Doyle's own admission, that's pretty extreme, & I don't think would ingratiate the region or fed.

    While I more or less agree w/ Doyle's philosophy, his execution is mediocre at best. Of course you always have to consider the financial incentives.
     
  10. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    When it was World Cup Qualifying in June and the Gold Cup in July, it made clear sense for the Gold Cup roster to be a B team.

    But with Nations League in June and the Gold Cup in July, why are we set on that dynamic?

    Doesn't the Gold Cup offer more games? Are we certain the level of competition will be higher in Nations League? Don't we want our roster to have more time together, especially with more players like Reyna and Dest coming in?

    If I had to pick, I feel like the Gold Cup gives the A team more time to prep for what is likely to be qualifiers in the August/September timeframe.
     
  11. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think qualifiers are still tentatively scheduled for June, right after a Nations' League mini tourney. If they moved them back even further like was being considered it's a serious question if they could even get them in. So as of now, staying hopeful they could get them in. If they can do UNL at that pt why not WCQ's all the same?

    UNL acts as prep for WCQ'ers, we are deep in them already (into the semis), & have played largely a-teams thus far. You figure the opponents will the rest of the way. So it's a more meaningful comp for tests & accomplishment than the consolation prize GC tourney after we lost the 1st one. That should be largely a throwaway/integrating exercise. Though I think we can provide a more talented team than Doyle provides.
     
  12. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    The pre-Ocho qualifiers have been pushed back, with the last scheduled matches in June.

    I suppose they could start the Qualifiers and force them in, but I am not sure if they can get the pre-Ocho matches in and then also have room for the Ocho.
     
  13. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    https://www.concacaf.com/en/world-c...s-draw-sets-path-to-fifa-world-cup-qatar-2022

    The Final Round of the Concacaf Qualifiers for the FIFA World Cup Qatar 2022 will see the three winners from the Second Round join the Concacaf Member Associations ranked 1-5. The eight teams will play each other home and away, with each team playing 14 matches.

    The Final Round will begin in the double FIFA match window in June 2021
     
  14. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Right, but that has the pre-qualifiers starting this month, and I believe they've been canceled.
     
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  15. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    It looks like they won't finalize the schedule, again, until they know whether the November matches will go ahead.
     
  16. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It looks like we’ll have our first game since Covid. And I’ll admit, I’ve been more checked out in 2020 than I’ve been since my deployment in 04 and since I was 8 years old.

    Nevertheless, my 23:

    GK Steffen, Horvath, Odunze
    RB Cannon, Moore
    LB Dest, Robinson
    CB Brooks, Miazga, Richards, Palmer-Brown
    M6 Adams (Durkin), McKennie, Johnny
    10 Reyna, Ledezma
    WF Pulisic, Konrad, Weah, Boyd
    FW Sargent, Wright, Johansson

    On standby: Gioacchini, Novakovich, Diskerud, Chandler, Llanez, Shashoua, Balogun, Musa, De la Torre, Vassilev, Siebatcheu, Ream, Sabbi, Alvarado, Carter-Vickers, Green, Morales, Cappis, Piere, Miljevic, Kayo, Gloster, Kobe, Otasowie, Kelman, Soto, Sanogo, Gall, Gooch, Saucedo, Tillman, Holmes, Mendez
     
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  17. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    The Olympics versus Gold Cup argument has been goin' round since the beginning of the era. We also, by the way................have the U20 and U17 World Cups next summer should we qualify. Busy, busy year. Not to mention the League of Nations and the start of WCQing with the senior team.

    The truth is simple. Clubs can reject callups to the Olympics and not the Gold Cup. Talking about callups to the Olympics is putting the cart before the horse, though. The U23 CONCACAF Championships (aka Olympic qualifiers) are our biggest house of horrors. A rather large portion of our U23 player pool won't be available for them. From the recently cancelled qualifiers................we probably won't be able to get Cannon, Aaronson, and Llanez now. Maybe not Ledezma either.

    I wonder what percentage of our top 50 U23s won't be available for the Olympic qualifers. Very high. And folks always assume MLS clubs will release their players. But remember.....................Atlanta. If folks think we'd get Miles Robinson, dream on.
     
  18. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Updated... looks like Pulisic will be out. Same with Adams. Also, I think Fredo is hurt too.

    My updated roster (all YA’s)

    GK Steffen, Horvath, Odunze, Las-
    RB Dest, Cannon, Chandler-, Yedlin-, Moore-
    LB Antonee, Gloster, Ream-, Kobe-
    CB Brooks, Miazga, Richards, Palmer-Brown, Alvarado-, Carter-Vickers-, Piere*-
    M6 Durkin, Otasowie, Kayo-, Cappis-
    M8 McKennie, Johnny, Mendez-
    10 Reyna, Ledezma, Holmes-, De la Torre-
    RW Musa*, Green, -Sabbi
    LW Weah, Konrad
    , Llanez-
    FW Sargent, Johannsson, Balogun*-, Wright-, Soto-, Novakovich-, Gioacchini-, Kelman-

    Note: I doubt Musa accepts, but I’d beg and plead. I’d consider a third CF (Wright) over another winger if he refuses.


    Guys I’d consider calling up from MLS to fill holes:
    GK: Turner (Odunze is a long ways away from even a #3 spot)

    LB: Vines or Bello; maybe Gutman

    DM: Nagbe (If he accepts, he goes), Yuiell, Sands (out - injured)

    M8: Aaronson - move Johnny to DM (it’s safe to leave Aaronson for now but he’s got to be included soon)

    WF: Mueller, Morris

    No need for this camp because I want to check out European options: Johnson (GK), Hamid (GK, McKenzie (CB), Dike (FW), Zardes (FW), Araujo (RB/RM), Lletget (AM)

    Comments:
    There’s a lot I’m looking for: Reyna, Dest, CF, who is going to captain, etc.

    I want to see some consistency at CB.

    I’m scared to death who is behind McKennie and Adams.
     
  19. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    One piece of good news from this year so far is that we're building depth at the #9 position at the Olympic-eligible age group. About 6 months ago we weren't sure who was really competing with Sargent. But we have Ebobisse, Dike, Akinola, etc. playing well in MLS. Wright, Sabbi, Gioacchini, etc. advancing in Europe. I don't know what the ceiling of these players is, but at least we're building depth. A bunch of them aren't cap-tied and we may not retain them all. Dike, Akinola, Sabbi, Gioacchini, etc. are all still eligible for other nations. Ebobisse is too, but I'm not worried about him. He was born in Paris, and may also be eligible for Cameroon.

    The disappointment amongst the U23 forward pool has been Jesus Ferreira.
     
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  20. laxcoach

    laxcoach Member+

    United States
    Jul 29, 2017
    intermountain west
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I see Durkin but no Adams....I know it's a mistake. Thought I'd point it out so you could fix it. Love the lineup btw.
     
  21. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He’s hurt, I believe.

    Sadly, that’s the drop off.
     
  22. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    FYI, Cajuste is likely off the table. Always seemed a reach, but it was worth a try.
    1323989797409611778 is not a valid tweet id
     
  23. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    #23 IndividualEleven, Nov 4, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2020
    Cajuste has been doing well against top teams in UCL. It's a huge loss of potential.
     
  24. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Sure, but there have been a lot of eligibility questions with Cajuste.

    THis is a player that had already been representing Sweden. We were exploring whether we could peel him away. Sweden made sure that didn't happen. We're not going to have a 100% success rate in these cases.

    Its amazing how often this gambit by dual nationals works. Have somebody in your camp leak to the press that you're talking to coaches from other national team program. You get called up quickly. Just worked for Sebastian Soto.
     
  25. Jimmy Skitz

    Jimmy Skitz Member+

    Leicester City
    England
    Nov 4, 2020
    My friend you have no idea how far from ready he is, he isn't even first choice for our under 18 team (I am a Leicester fan) and in his last game he conceded 8 goals, I was actually quite shocked he got called up
     

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