2021 Breakout Youngster

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by Patrick167, Dec 11, 2020.

  1. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    #276 Clint Eastwood, Apr 7, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021
    I'm OK with us not having actual criteria.
    Each person decides for himself, and we have a vote at the end.
    We could argue about the qualifications until the cows come home. There's no referee to say who's right or wrong.

    Most years there's just been an obvious winner by any criteria.
    We may have an obvious winner by the end of this year too. We're down to just a few candidates in my mind.

    When I created the first thread of this series, I used the definition of the USYNT boards to define youngster.
    In other words it had to be a player eligible for USYNTs. To me that just avoided any confusion and set a firm boundary.

    FOr this year I don't mind if we keep the cycle that ended during this year as the age cutoff. So THIS YEAR players born in 1997 were actually still eligible for the Olympic team. I think we're unlikely to award it to players that old anyway, but that's my personal age cutoff. The winner is likely to come from a player born around 2000-2001 like Richards, Dike, Hoppe, etc.

    So next year, the definition of youngster for me then moves to players eligible for the 2024 Olympic cycle. A qualifying campaign that is only two years away!!! So those are 2001s and younger. Matthew Hoppe fits that definition. Daryl Dike does not. So Daryl Dike will have aged out of being considered a "youngster" after this year.
     
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  2. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    #277 KALM, Apr 7, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021
    You're correct that your original 2016 thread didn't have the same criteria.

    But every thread since then, including the 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, and 2021 thread has stated the 22 and under with 10 caps or fewer criteria in the opening post.

    That strikes me as a pretty long and consistent trend at this point. (Although we do appear to have switched the starting point from the beginning of the European season to the beginning of the calendar year.)
     
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  3. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think it’d be be bad luck for us to change it now lol.
     
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  4. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
     
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  5. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    Good news. Upamecano is the projected replacement for Boateng at Bayern...
     
  6. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Yeah, I don't see a starting role next year at Bayern for Richards.
    Maybe if Bayern really wants to keep him in the fold, the loan can simply be extended thru next year.
    Then they can reassess.

    A reminder that FCD gets 40% of Richards' next transfer fee.
    They've been rolling in the cash recently.
     
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  7. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    Alaba is leaving as well, so that's two of their three regular CB starters this season who are leaving. Even if you replace Boateng with Upamecano, that still seems to leave at least one opening in that rotation, right? Unless there's another incoming transfer I've missed.

    (They've also got a couple other guys who could play there in an emergency, but who are generally preferred in other positions.)
     
  8. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    They also have young CBs other than Richards in their pipeline. For instance, the 18 year old French kid that they bought from PSG, Tanguy Nianzou. Richards also not the only CB they have out on loan. German youth international Lasse Mai is an example there. They always have the next batch of prospects coming thru.

    And Bayern can just spend 50 million on one of the best CBs in the world any time they want.
    The standard is extremely high.

    So do we want Richards "in the rotation" at Bayern, or do we want him as a week-in, week-out starter at Hoffenheim. I'll take the latter.
     
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  9. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    Yeah, I'm not saying Richards is the clear next in line, but I'm not sure he's clearly below anyone else at the moment either, unless they purchase another CB. I just don't want to write off his chances at Bayern yet until it's clear that he's not in the picture.

    And, when I say "in the rotation," I mean the 3 man CB rotation Bayern have used this season, which has ensured plenty of starts for all 3 CBs. Alaba, Sule, and Boateng have all made over 30 appearances for Bayern this season across all competitions, the vast majority of them at CB.
     
  10. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
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  11. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It’s time and there’s no shame in that. I hope he can latch on somewhere like Hertha - where he was rumored to go last year. For some reason, he’s received a lot of flak, but from when I’ve watched him play - which I’ve caught most of his minutes, I’ve been very impressed by him. He’s a silky smooth operator.
     
  12. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    As we know, a bunch of other young winger/forwards are now firmly ahead of him in the pecking order. I think we all understood that he was in the first team early in the season due to injuries and an inability for Barca to spend any money on reinforcements.

    Here's another kid I'm keeping a really close eye on. There's a real chance for Justin Che to turn into Chris Richards 2.0. Justin is only 17. Bayern isn't playing him with their U19s, but instead bumped him up to their Bayern II team in the German 3rd division.
     
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  13. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Chris Richards resume buildling.
     
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  14. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    If Reynolds starts consistently for Roma he'll really zoom into contention.
     
  15. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Becoming a real horse race now. Very exciting. At the quarter pole...

    1. Dike
    2. Richards
    3. Aaronson
    4. Hoppe
    5. Reynolds

    Dike is going to have to have a Jozy at AZ season (30+ goals) if he doesn't get a move. I have him in pole position because I fully expect him to get a move into a Top 5 league or a UCL club from a minor league. Reynolds could be top by the next pole.
     
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  16. sXeWesley

    sXeWesley Member+

    Jun 18, 2007
    Club:
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nice breakdown, it's Richards for me as long as he continues playing well in the Bundesliga, even if defenders are not at sexy, it's a clear level above everyone else unless Reynolds really breaks through imo.
     
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  17. RossD

    RossD Member

    Aug 17, 2013
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    I'm assuming this goes into next season. If there are some big transfers this summer this could get absolutely crazy.
     
  18. TxEx

    TxEx Member+

    Tottenham Hotspur, Crystal Palace, FC Dallas
    Aug 19, 2016
    DFW
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    For me Aaronson has already broken out so I'd add de la Torre. He's #5 on that list but he deserves recognition for the huge step forward his career has taken at Heracles.
     
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  19. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Same for me.
    I would take Aaronson off.

    For the moment its de la Torre, but there are a lot of options from MLS as the season progresses. Some are going to make Reynolds-like moves, and zoom up the charts.

    This list can be very dynamic. There are guys like Owen Otasowie that have the capacity to move quickly.
     
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  20. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Just want to make sure I got this right...

    Player A: MLS starter in 2019, stays and MLS starter in 2020.
    Player B: Moves for a record sum from MLS, starts for a UCL club, plays in Europa League, will play in the Champions League. Goes from no A team USMNT caps to being one of the first options off the bench and probably getting starts in Qualifying.
    Player C: A player starts for a mediocre Dutch team not named PSV or Ajax; is actually too old to be eligible.

    Player A is a break out for you. Player B is not a break out. Player C is a break out.

    Correct?
     
  21. TxEx

    TxEx Member+

    Tottenham Hotspur, Crystal Palace, FC Dallas
    Aug 19, 2016
    DFW
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Player B, Aaronson, isn't a breakout because I count his breakout as his last season with Philly that got him the big move. Now he's grown since then and has taken another huge leap forward but imo everyone saw his potential realized, at least to get him that move to Europe, while he was in MLS. As such I don't count him but again that's just my interpretation of "breakout."

    de la Torre had traded on hype because he was at Fulham but over the course of several seasons it never materialized because he didn't play much beyond U-23. By the time he left most thought, he had blown his chance for a good career because he sat on the bench for so long. I didn't know he had this growth in his game. Now I don't think he's a star. He's probably never going to be a must start in an upper table team in a top 5 league but it appears he can carve out a solid career which from where he was till now is a massive leap forward.

    He gets #5 on my list because he's forced himself into a starting role on an average Eredivisie team. A quality pro league filled with players who could make him look meh but haven't. He's delivered and that level could see him play in Europe for another 10 years. Leagues across the continent are filled with washouts who never achieve even that.
     
  22. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    For me the concept is that you only break out once. If a player IN ANY LEAGUE is a full time starter, and based on that performance level gets a callup to the USMNT............then he's already broken out. So for me Brenden Aaronson broke out already. He just didn't win the award. The clock didn't restart when he moved to Austria.

    I also, by the way, think Yunus Musah and Bryan Reynolds are borderline candidates. You can argue that they broke out in 2020. I don't, but the argument can be made.

    I've already said that my definition of "youngster" is one eligible for USYNTs. And Luca de la Torre was eligible for the Olympic qualification team. I don't think he's going to win because he's well behind the top 3. By the way, I have the English Championship and the Eredevisie as roughly the same in the 2nd tier (with Austria too), so Dike doesn't automatically get moved ahead of de la Torre due to league. I have him third on my ranking due to impact in the Championship. That doesn't trump the impact in the Bundesliga of Richards and Hoppe.

    Again, there is no definition set in stone. So people can have their own interpretation. My interpretation of Breakout and Youngster is different than yours. That's fine.
     
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  23. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    So, every player that gets a cap in January camp has to win that year or they are out?

    Breaking out is not getting starts in MLS. Adams had those and caps and obviously won the award later. Dozens of players get starts in MLS. Dike broke out at Orlando last year and that is it?

    I think you guys are missing the forest because of the trees.
     
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  24. STR1

    STR1 Member+

    Atlanta United
    May 29, 2010
    McAllen, TX
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    The thing with Che is that if he turns out to be too good he'll pick Germany over US.
     
  25. deejay

    deejay Member+

    Feb 14, 2000
    Tarpon Springs, FL
    Club:
    Jorge Wilstermann
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Germany is too caught up with making sure that their players are properly "German". I'm sure that the US will be the first in line in getting his allegiance at a minimum.
     

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