2020 Olympic Berths?

Discussion in '2020 Women's Olympics Soccer' started by toad455, Aug 18, 2016.

  1. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    Should the # of berths per federation change for 2020??

    Host(1): Japan
    AFC: 2
    UEFA: 3
    CONCACAF: 2
    CAF: 2
    OFC: 1
    CONMEBOL: 1
     
  2. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    #2 blissett, Aug 18, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2016
    I said multiple times that, in my opinion, since FIFA moved Australia from OFC to AFC, AFC should get at least an half-slot more (i.e. third-ranked team in AFC playing-off with the OFC winner = New Zealand). If you freely "play" with the notion of continent to the point that NZ has a guaranteed spot in every competition, the end result isn't very fair nor reflects accurately the state of the game.

    In the particular case of Tokyo 2020, this problem is somehow "concealed" by the fact that Japan will get an automatic berth as the host, so AFC will get three teams anyway, but it will remain not-solved for the future.

    Also: CAF having two spots, the same number as CONCACAF, is a lot, considering that CONCACAF is one of the most winning federations in the world of women's football, while CAF's teams use to be cannon fodder. But I can see how CAF represents a boatload of people and nations, some of them even moderately successful at least at youth level, so I can accept 2 spots for them.
    What I can't accept, I repeat, is 1 full spot for OFC, that, starting from the moment you took away Australia from it, represents just a handful of federations, mostly insignificant on the international stage (NZ being the only exception!). I can understand geo-political reasons, wanting each continent being represented in Olympic Games, but frankly how can you move away 90% of Oceania, in surface and people (= Australia), and then claim that Oceania deserves a spot anyway? Can't you all see the fallacy implied in this logic? :confused:
    One solution could be that, since Olympic International Commitee always claim that they are independent from FIFA, they could restore an OFC qualifier including Australia, just for Olympic Games (after all, Australia's medals count as Oceania, in Olympic Games, don't they?): this way, they could keep 2 spots for AFC and 1 for OFC and no-one would get to complain (except New Zealand, who finally would be given a run for their money).

    Of course, another solution would be opening the women's Olympic tournament to 16 teams. This would simplify other issues also, but it's been overly discussed in other threads and it doesn't seem like it's going to happen soon.
     
    jagum, Lechus7 and gricio61 repped this.
  3. Airox

    Airox Member

    Mar 14, 2016
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My thoughts:

    Host(1): Japan
    AFC: 2.5
    UEFA: 3
    CONCACAF: 2
    CAF: 1.5
    OFC: .5
    CONMEBOL: 1.5
     
    gricio61 and blissett repped this.
  4. SiberianThunderT

    Sep 21, 2008
    DC
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    If you fold the host spot into the rest, the past two tournaments have been
    AFC: 2
    CAF: 2
    C'CAF: 2
    C'BOL: 2
    OFC: 1
    UEFA: 3

    For the 12-team tournament before that, AFC had 3 and CAF+C'BOL had 1.5 each.

    While I agree Australia moving to AFC definitely makes it seem like OFC's guaranteed slot is too much for a 12-team tournament, I'm not convinced AFC should go back up to 3 or even up to 2.5 since AFC hasn't performed particularly well in the 12-team tournaments so far... Granted, neither has CAF. I think that, if we stick to 12 teams, I'd say

    AFC: 2
    CAF: 1.5
    C'CAF: 2.5
    C'BOL: 2
    OFC: 0.5
    UEFA: 3.5

    If we expand to 16, though, (wishful thinking,) I'd make it

    AFC: 2.5
    CAF: 2
    C'CAF: 3
    C'BOL: 2.5
    OFC: 1
    UEFA: 4
    host: 1
     
    Lechus7 and lil_one repped this.
  5. BlueCrimson

    BlueCrimson Member+

    North Carolina Courage
    United States
    Nov 21, 2012
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Club:
    Sydney FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Considering that the current regime of the IOC isn't as big of a stickler about the number of athletes as the previous one was (there were 5 new sports added for 2020 without any existing sports being taken out), I have some hope about the number of teams increasing to 16 in the near future.
     
    Lechus7, JanBalk and blissett repped this.
  6. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    won't happen for the 2020 Olympics as schedules are already being set. We'd have to hope for the 2024 games to expand to 16 teams.
     
    blissett repped this.
  7. amerinorsk59

    amerinorsk59 Member

    Mar 9, 2007
    Chicago area
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    Norway
    I always feel Europe is cheated at the Olympic Games for ladies football (How many teams in world top twenty are from Europe?). NZ has a permanent seat (in effect) at every Olympics and World Cup. Not fair! Not that it is related, but look at the 12 ladies handball teams at the 2016 Olympics: 8 out of 12 teams were from Europe! Host Brazil, Argentina (Pan Am games I believe), Angola and S. Korea. Handball tournament is more competitive than ladies soccer field due to the strength of Europe team talent being reflected in the selection of Olympic teams from Europe. Africa and Asia and Americas still represented.
     
    gricio61 repped this.
  8. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    Just expand the Olympics to 16 for the women.

    UEFA: 5
    AFC: 3
    CONCACAF: 3
    CONMEBOL: 2
    CAF: 2
    OFC: 1

    Case closed.
    Whoever is hosting is counted toward the total above.
    For example, in 2020, Japan counts as one of three AFC slots.
     
  9. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    It was decided on Sept. 14 the number of berths per confederation.
    Host(1): Japan
    AFC(2): tba tournament
    UEFA(3): top three from 2019 World Cup
    CONCACAF(2): tba tournament
    CONMEBOL(1): Copa America 2018
    CAF(1): tba tournament
    OFC(1): tba tournament
    CAF-CONMEBOL play-off(1)

    And I think it's time to expand it to 16 teams by 2024(Paris).
     
    Lechus7 and blissett repped this.
  10. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I totally agree: these numbers are ridiculous and will leave many worthy teams out. :devilish:
     
  11. shlj

    shlj Member+

    Apr 16, 2007
    London
    Club:
    FC Nantes
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    I think the biggest block for a 16 teams tournament is the IOC. They are the reason why it is 18+4 players selected and not 22. They don't want more athletes and sports are competing hard to get in.
     
  12. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    and of course, New Zealand gets a free pass. That play-off should have been for CAF-OFC.
     
    blissett repped this.
  13. jagum

    jagum Member

    Montreal Impact
    Venezuela
    Jun 20, 2007
    Panama City, Panama
    Club:
    Montreal Impact
    Nat'l Team:
    Venezuela
    Totally agree. Although Africa has not shown great achievements in the Olympic women's football, since 2012 they have always had two seats and now suddenly they will only have a single spot, does not seem fair to me.
     
    blissett repped this.
  14. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    In theory, they should have 32 teams by 2024 (but of course they won't).
    With the way Denmark, Austria, and Belgium are improving, and the emergence of Iceland, it's time. The World Cup and Olympics both need to be 32 nations.
     
  15. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    But New Zealand might be screwed if that 2nd place CAF teams ends up being Nigeria. Their speed might be too much for their Fern legs. Same for Cameroon.
     
  16. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    That's just what they should get: actually having * to work * to get their qualification, as well as many teams in Europe, Asia and elsewhere have to do! :devilish:
     
    jagum and toad455 repped this.
  17. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    Well, I predict New Zealand will be put into Group F (the Group of Fluff) in 2019.

    Group F (2019)
    Canada
    Italy
    Ghana
    New Zealand

    Therefore, their OFC path, and 2019 Group Stage path will not be too difficult.
    Then they'll upset Netherlands in the Round of 16.
     
  18. SiberianThunderT

    Sep 21, 2008
    DC
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    I didn't comment on this earlier, but will so now (and you'll see why in a little bit):

    This is not the right thought process. The Olympics are supposed to be a much smaller version of the World Cup, so of course there will be many "worthy" teams left out. That's the point. Remember that the only reason the women's Olympic tournament is for fully senior squads while the men's is U23 is that the men already have a second major international senior-level tournament in the Confederations Cup - which is only 8 teams versus the men's WC 32 (soon-to-be 48). The women getting 12 teams in the Olympics to the 16 they had in the WC (now 24) is downright generous in that comparison.

    But the real reason I'm replying is from a tidbit I read earlier in an MLS article about the CWC... Apparently there's talk of FIFA actually cutting the Confederations Cup from the competition structure altogether. If that were to happen, especially if it were in time for Paris games, they I think it would follow that the women's Olympic tournament would be "demoted" to a u23 competition like the men's was. No reason for the women to have two full-senior-level competitions when the men would only have one.
     
  19. shlj

    shlj Member+

    Apr 16, 2007
    London
    Club:
    FC Nantes
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Qualified teams :

    Host (1) : Japan
    AFC (2) :
    UEFA (3) :
    CONCACAF (2) :
    CONMEBOL (1) : Brasil
    CAF (1) :
    OFC (1) :
    CAF-CONMEBOL Chile v ?
     
    Lechus7 and blissett repped this.
  20. JanBalk

    JanBalk Member+

    Jun 9, 2004
    Uppsala, Sweden
    Nat'l Team:
    Sweden
    Doubt it, the reason the men Olympic is pretty much a U23 is that a full MNT Olympics would decrease the impact of FIFA's cash cow the Men's WC.
    Since the Women's WC isn't generating a massive amount of money for FIFA I think they are prepared to accept the competition with a full WNT Olympics as a great way to increase the interest for WoSo (so that the WWC sometime in the future can be a big FIFA moneymaker, then and not before they will curtail the competition from the Olympics).
     
    blissett repped this.
  21. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    Host: Japan
    AFC: Australia, China
    UEFA: England (Great Britain), France, Germany
    CONCACAF: USA, Canada
    CONMEBOL: Brazil
    CAF: South Africa (for some reason, they seem to step up more in Olympic Qual.)
    OFC: New Zealand (after their 23-0 victory over Tonga in the OFC Final)
    12th nation: Chile (these cats can ball if they eat a bowl of chili before the game)

    This is what we're currently trending toward.
    Netherlands may find their way in.
    And Sweden always seems to find a way to the Olympics.
     
  22. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    I'm just the 2024 Olympics expand the tournament to 16 teams.
     
  23. toad455

    toad455 Member+

    Nov 28, 2005
    2024

    Hosts (1): France
    UEFA (4)
    AFC (4)
    CONCACAF (2.5)
    CONMEBOL (1.5)
    CAF (2)
    OFC (1)
     
    blissett repped this.
  24. WWC_Movement

    WWC_Movement Red Card

    Dec 10, 2014
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Papua New Guinea
    It would probably come closer to mirroring the 2011 Women's World Cup, the last major tournament to have 16 teams.

    Host (1)
    UEFA (4) (receives an additional 1.0 slot from Olympics of the past)
    AFC (3) (receives an additional 1.0 slot from Olympics of the past)
    CONCACAF (2.5) (receives an additional 0.5 slot from Olympics of the past)
    CONMEBOL (2.5) (receives an additional 1.0 slot from Olympics of the past)
    CAF (2) (receives about the same or added 0.5 slots from Olympics of the past)
    OFC (1)

    Every recent Olympics of the past had 4 of the 12 teams from the Western Hemisphere (CONCACAF + CONMEBOL). That is 1/3 of the entire field.

    Therefore, if the field expands from 12 to 16 teams, then the Western Hemisphere should get an additional bid, and Eastern Hemisphere gets 3 additional bids. This keeps things nearly linear and proportional to how it was before.

    As a result, a 16 team field should have:

    5 Western Hemisphere teams
    11 Eastern Hemisphere teams

    Just like the 2011 World Cup, and this stays within nearly the 1/3 ratio of the overall teams being from the Western Hemisphere.
     
  25. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I never heard that someone was caring about balancing eastern and western emispheres. :confused:
     

Share This Page