2020/21 Hot Seat

Discussion in 'Women's College' started by Chris Mahr, Aug 13, 2020.

  1. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    There isn’t any evidence that’s a trend.

    there is a lower percentage of female head coaches now than there was historically.

    in 1974 90% of women’s soccer head coaches were women. A 2017 article by Equalizer cites the percentage then as 26.2%.
    Another study showed 26.5% for a slightly different subset of colleges.
    https://www.cehd.umn.edu/tuckercent...T_Head-Coaches-of-Womens-Collegiate-Teams.pdf
    A follow up study in 2019 cites 27.1%.
    https://www.cehd.umn.edu/tuckercent...h/WCCRC_Head-Coaches_2018-19_D-I_Select-7.pdf


    A half% increase is hardly a huge trend, more a rounding error.
     
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  2. Collegewhispers

    Oct 27, 2011
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    In recent months we have examples of two mountain west programs deciding they would only hire a female coach regardless of qualifications. Northern Illinois did the same thing. When an athletic department makes a decision they are only hiring someone of a specific gender that seems like discrimination.
     
  3. ytrs

    ytrs Member

    Jan 24, 2018
    It happens in the men's game 98% of the time.
     
  4. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    no. In D1 the percentage is a consistent 100%.

    there are no D1 mens teams with womens coaches. I don’t believe there ever has been. There is, in fact, only one woman coaching a mens team out of something like 526 teams., and that in D3.
     
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  5. cpthomas

    cpthomas BigSoccer Supporter

    Portland Thorns
    United States
    Jan 10, 2008
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That actually is not what a school has to prove. Rather, if the evidence shows a significant hiring imbalance favoring men over women, the school has to prove that the imbalance is not the result of discrimination on the basis of sex. Once the school proves that, then the person claiming to be the victim of discrimination has the burden of proving she was discriminated against.

    If a school is looking exclusively at women for a soccer head coach job, there is at least a good chance the reason is the AD knows that the school has a significan head coach hiring imbalance favoring men. And there is at least a good chance the AD thinks the school cannot show there are reasons other than sex for the imbalance or the AD thinks it is not worth the effort (or the risk of the effort being unsuccessful) to try to show it.

    And lest anyone forget: In 2004 there were 201 male and 99 female head coaches. Although the individuals have changed, currently there are 241 male and 99 female head coaches. So whatever ADs are doing in specific instances, the overall effect of AD decisions has been to increase the disparity rather than decrease it.
     
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  6. Collegewhispers

    Oct 27, 2011
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    And it shouldn’t happen. Again two wrongs do not make a right.
     
  7. BigBear

    BigBear Member

    Apr 20, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So you sat in those meetings - at three different schools - where the hiring committees all openly discussed not considering males for the job? Interesting consulting role you have. Come on...

    No, rather your likely evidence is that you know one or more mid-40s males with 15+ years of D1 coaching experience who have probably won a few rings in their time get passed up for the jobs.

    Maybe the AD heard from alumni that they would be fired up for a younger, energetic female coach; or maybe the players want a role model coach who has gone through the same things they have; etc.

    There's so much that goes into these hiring decision. The best CVs are not always the best candidates.
     
  8. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    a little further research shows the Kim Wyant, the head coach of D3 NYU is the only woman to ever have coached a men’s soccer team in any of the three divisions in the history of the NCAA.
    So if you compute to three digits and round, it’s still 100%. And in D1 and D2, it’s a pure 100%.
    There have been only a smattering of women assistant coaches, some in a volunteer capacity.

    for those of you too young or with short memories, Wyant was the goalkeeper between the pipes for the uswnt in its first international match when they played Italy in 1985.
     
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  9. HouseofCards

    HouseofCards Member

    Nov 26, 2012
    False
     
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  10. Jackofalltrades

    Jackofalltrades New Member

    Liverpool FC
    Scotland
    Oct 22, 2021
    how many women apply for D1 mens HC positions?
     
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  11. SuperSoccer1978

    Barcelona
    Nov 24, 2011
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    I've heard very similar from club coaches in Colorado about Hagen at CSU. Players aren't happy with her coaching style and personality. He quoted former players of his, saying "she's completely fake."

    Lots of parents aren't happy at all and have voiced their opinions to the administration.
     
  12. Collegewhispers

    Oct 27, 2011
    Club:
    Columbus Crew

    Both schools used a hiring firm to search for candidates. Because of that you always know of people who reach out that are interested in the position and both situations were the same; the hiring firms were specifically instructed to contact female candidates. So yes I do know that the hires were gender specific.
     
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  13. ytrs

    ytrs Member

    Jan 24, 2018
    No offense but I have a hard time believing an administrator or a search firm would say that they were only hiring a female out loud. The liability is too high. But, your phrasing says, 'instructed to contact female candidates'. If that is what they said, they were at least trying to expand their pool with as many good female candidates as possible. But, that doesn't mean they were only going to hire a female.
     
  14. Collegewhispers

    Oct 27, 2011
    Club:
    Columbus Crew

    Ok.
     
  15. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    You are welcome to name any other womens coaches of male ncaa soccer teams…
     
  16. HouseofCards

    HouseofCards Member

    Nov 26, 2012
    Your little bit of research requires further research, I’m not doing it for you, but you’re wrong.
     
  17. Sophos

    Sophos Member

    Feb 20, 2020
    I really don't want to get into the middle as of this debate as 1, This is somewhat the exception that proves the rule that there are simply not many women coaching men's teams and 2. I'm not sure that the lack of female coaches coaching men's soccer is the end all argument some think it is. but having said that. Amy Machin-Ward (sp?) coached the Regis college men's team through a good chunk of the 1900's. For the record those teams were good and they had a fair bit of success.
     
  18. Jackofalltrades

    Jackofalltrades New Member

    Liverpool FC
    Scotland
    Oct 22, 2021
    No one will be able to provide this information, unless its anecdotal - but it would be interesting to know:

    How many females actually apply for Assistant or Head Coaching positions for female teams at the D1 level?

    How many females actually apply for Assistant or Head Coaching positions for male teams at the D1 level?

    The answer to these questions may give a better insight as to whether there is any bias in the hiring process.
     
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  19. spykemanne

    spykemanne Member

    Jan 25, 2015
    Las Vegas, NV
    Club:
    Queens Park Rangers FC
    Maryland finishes the year 0-7-3 in the conference (4-9-5 overall)
    Leone's record from the Terp website

    2016 Maryland 3-15-1
    2017 Maryland 7-8-3
    2018 Maryland 4-10-5
    2019 Maryland 9-8-3
    2021 (Spring) Maryland 0-10-2
     
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  20. J&S_LFG

    J&S_LFG New Member

    Liverpool FC
    United States
    Oct 18, 2021
    Yeah, you got to think Leone's time at college park has to be over!?!
     
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  21. Jamie JBS

    Jamie JBS Member

    Fulham
    England
    May 10, 2021
    Such a shame. Seemed like it was a good hire on paper but sadly not working out at all. We have heard similar at our club.
     
  22. ThePonchat

    ThePonchat Member+

    #ProRelForUSA
    United States
    Jan 10, 2013
    I've Been Everywhere Man
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Carrie Taylor was the first-ever coach for the College of Mount Saint Joseph men's soccer program in Cincinnati -- they are DIII and in the HCAC. She coached there for four years (2005-2008). She's made quite the name for herself in coaching (and soccer) since then.

    Do people think that there is truly a large amount of female applicants for vacant men's jobs? I know one that was open a couple of seasons ago, the applicants: former MLS coach (and USL coach), another was the former interim USMNT coach, the associate head coach of the program (who got the job), amongst others.

    How many females would have the credentials to go after that job? And, why would they leave their current job (if employed) to go to that job? The same can be said for many of these men's jobs each year.
     
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  23. ytrs

    ytrs Member

    Jan 24, 2018
    But that is because women were given less opportunities for years. How do you expect them to catch up? They have to be afforded opportunities. And, a hire that looks good on paper is not always the right 'fit' for a university/program.
     
  24. Collegewhispers

    Oct 27, 2011
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Afforded opportunities at the expense of a male coach that is more qualified? Or just being given fair opportunity?
     
  25. Bannedagain

    Bannedagain New Member

    Villareal
    Oct 24, 2021
    So having sadly seen that the DeathSlayer keeps being banned by the admins on this site who clearly have no idea how to let people have an opinion with a piece of banter hopefully this brief appearance of Wenger isn't silenced too!

    Colorado State just qualified for their conference tournament. I would argue that this is a good start for a first year staff. They also have a total stud of an assistant in Eric Masters who is going to be a great asset with the program. Watch this space as CSU keeps growing.

    With the current vacancy at Kentucky any bets on Citowicki? Montana crushing it again this year. I could also see Villanova going for a coach with in region ties that has had success. Gore at Northwestern State has had an unbelievable start there and I could see him being looked at for the gig.
     
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