2006 Defenders: Europe or MLS?

I think MLS is doing a great job of developing central defenders for the US team. I have been disappointed in the lack of quality outside backs emerging from the league. Barrett is probably the best American outside back in MLS, and I still have doubts that he can be an answer in International Soccer. I hope so. Gbandi is a potential star, but I am keeping my fingers crossed that he can show the game he had before this last injury.

OTOH, we're not exactly developing outside back stars in Europe, either. JOB is a very good left back for Ajax, but until an American can surpass his skills in the midfield, he will be a central midfielder for the US. Cherundolo has been up and down at Hannover, but if he can raise his game to the level he just displayed against Leverkusen and get physically stronger, he has the potential to lock a right back position down.

The US looks potentially strong in coming years with a host of young forwards including Twellman, Mathis, Wolff, and Donovan. They also look strong in central defense with Pope, Suarez, Bocanegra, et al. We also look to be covered at DMid with Mastroeni and Mulrooney (when he gets back from his ankle injury). Of course we are strong in goal. Left wing is DMB's spot to lose. The question marks, in my mind, reside at the right midfield position and with the outside defenders. As always, we could use a few more creative midfielders, too, although there is potential in Martino.

BTW, you forgot Vanney.

 

Right now I see a see only 2 players in MLS I would feel comfortable with, Pope and Bocanegra. In Europe I'm not sure it is much better. Cherundolo and Sanneh right now.

Let's hope Gbandi recovers from injury and gets citizenship or that we can afford to put Mastroeni in defense.

There are a few people who *might* pan out from MLS like Garcia and I wonder if Daniel Hernandez gets his head screwed on straight if he could slide back to a defensive role. He's played it before.

 

In the midfield, ther seems to be several players with a lot of talent that we'r looking forward to developing. In defense, our strength is moer in numbers, I think. We seem to have a lot of unproven players that have skill. It's less obvious who the potential nats are back there.

If you take a look at a position like right back, you see that we have Gooch, Suarez and Cherundolo. I can't say which player will develop there, b ut I feel pretty confident that one ofthose three will step in.

then there's the question of the youngsters, mostly in Europe, that we haven't seen yet, but will see in the next couple of years. Whitbred, Marshall, Simek, Anderson ....

WE don't know who will emerge, but I feel confident that someone will.

 

Pope is overated on his marking ability. He is OK with air ball, but in freekick he lost his mark all the time. Same with Sanneh. We will need to step up with good air defending, good marking ability, good one-on-one defending, and good ball control skill. Those a new requirement for US defenders if we want to become a top 10 team.

For outside backs, kids like Denton and Ziadie have skills but need to learn more about when to go forward and one to stay home.

 

One possibility at right midfield is Chris Klein.

Also, you brought up Vanney. If he wouldn't have gotten hurt, I would have liked to see him at left back in Korea.

 

Yes, outside back continues to be a weakness in our pool.

FYI, Bob Bradley has had Bocanegra play outside a fair amount for the Fire this year. In much the same way as he got DMB to concentrate and improve his defense -- as though it were part development effort to prepare him for the national team -- Bob has given Carlos some freedom to get forward deep and participate in the attack when playing on the outside.

I had the feeling that this year the plan was to play Whitfield and Boca on the outside, with Curtin/Gray and CJ Brown on the inside. Injuries prevented that, but don't be surprised if we see this configuration next year, which would get Boca 20 games or so on the outside in a 4 back set.

Clearly, Boca has the height and the speed to play on the outside, so stay tuned on this front.

I think some of our younger defenders need to turn pro next year -- Klaas and Simo are two prospects. It was heartening to see Akwari in an MLS uniform. We need a youth infusion here badly -- and quickly.

 

I think we don't develope outside backs for two reasons.

Your "skilled players" arguement AND because at least where I grew up playing there was no such thing as an outside back. We all played with 2 man markers and a sweeper. At that time we thought nobody outside of Italy used a zone defense. But in our entire state there was almost universal use of wing midfielders and a sweeper.

Now, for the most part BA likes a flat 4 zone defense or 3 central defenders. In either situation I think the defenders we developed would play in the middle 2-3. Not that nobody used overlapping defenders, but BAs system almost makes the wide defenders play slightly in front of a back two.

 

Right Mid Fielder...........Ben Olsen.

I will tell you that I was one of the first guys to say that he would not recover from his string of injuries, but I must say he looke really good last night in the game against Dallas. He will be back to himself next year barring any further injury. Go Benny!

 

I wonder why MLS has such a hard time producing decent outside defenders?

To add/supplement Eliezar's list:

I think the main reason we have yet to develop outside defenders has been the general lack of creative skill in the midfield. On top of that, there is a prevailing thought among Americans that if a player has any skill on the ball at all, that player would be wasted in defense. This is an attitude that permeates all levels of American Soccer, and one that needs to change to develop a more complete team.

Let me provide an example of what I mean. In the run-up to the 2002 World Cup, a frequent speculation among BS posters and other media was made that Claudio Reyna might be an answer at Right Back for the US. That speculation was met with scorn and ridicule by the majority of MNT fans. At the time, the majority was probably correct for the simple reason that we had nobody who could replace Claudio in the middle of the field.

But the thought itself might not have been a bad one - IF we had depth in the Central Midfield, and only if. When you look at the requirements of an outside defender in Bruce Arena's system, and then compare those requirements with those of a Central Midfielder, you will find that they are in fact very similar.

- Ability to hold the ball and distribute under pressure
- Ability to read the game and find open teammates
- Ability and a commitment to defense
- Creativity to make plays and choose spots in the right circumstances

If anything, the job of a good outside back actually requires MORE skill and a better understanding than those of a central midfielder. If you make even the slightest mistake, you put your team at serious risk. For example, let's say you get dispossessed of a ball at a crucial moment (David Regis), or that you make an ill-advised pass that ends up in the wrong hands (Jeff Agoos), or that you get caught too far forward on a counter attack (Steve Cherundolo) - you could very well cost your team the game.

There are some attributes of both positions that do not carry over quite as much. For example, the best outside backs seem to have exceptional work rates and are capable of running non-stop for 90 minutes. They are usually very strong and very fast. In contrast, the best central midfielders are usually better on the ball, have exceptional vision, and are deft and accurate passers. These skills are not mutually exclusive, and more and more in the International Game, they are required of EVERY player on the field.

It turned out that some of Claudio's most important work in the 2002 Cup was at the right wing-back position against Mexico. Because we played a 5-man midfield, it wasn't a true outside defender position that you typically see in a 4-4-2, but it was VERY close. Claudio responded with terrific defensive work on the right side, combined with a beautiful run that led to our first goal.

Still, we have not developed enough depth in the Central Midfield that would allow us to convert one of our most talented central midfielders to an outside back position on the MNT. For this reason, you will probably not see JOB play left back, as he does for Ajax, for the US. You will probably not see Claudio Reyna play right back, as he did on occasion for Rangers, for the US. IF (a very BIG if), we see the rise of young great central midfielders in the next 4 years, those options will become available. Should Kyle Martino, Bobby Convey, Landon Donovan, Pablo Mastroeni, Freddy Adu, et al develop into world-class midfielders and force themselves into the midfield, then Claudio Reyna and John O'brien could become the two best outside defenders the US has ever had. I don't see that happening, but I would LOVE to be wrong.

 

At right back I wouldn't be surprised to see another midfielder make the adjustment that Sanneh did. Assuming he's not retiring and just taking a rest I wouldn't be surprised to see Claudio Reyna become our right back of the future. Mulrooney and Klein are two other guys who could adjust their games to fill that position.

At right mid... I have to agree that I never thought Olson would be back, but he sure looked sharp last night. He also seemed to play smarter than I remember him playing in the past (I alway thought he was the next moderately improved Cobi Jones). Another player I'm anxious to see is John Thorrington, if he can stay healthy.

The big question now and as always is, who will play left back?

In regards to the original question. Defense will probably be a 50/50 mix. While I expect that we'll have more European options in the future, I also expect that MLS will continue to improve.

If I picked for today I'd say: Reyna, Sanneh, Pope, who knows? across the back.

 

I have no worries in defensive midfield with the U.S.

I think that outside midfielder isn't too much of a concern with DMB, Convey, Davis, and possibly Lewis on the left and the right isn't too bad either with Olsen and Brian West and probably someone else I'm forgetting.

Don't know much about Gray. I've seen him play but I can't remember if he is in the midfield or in central defense. Then there is also Bocanegra, Califf (seen him several times but can't decide if he should be with the nats), also not sure about Curtin. I think Pope may be able to continue in the back.

Outside isn't too great but there are some like Cherundolo and Suarez and Barrett.

Attacking midfield isn't too bad with Martino and O'brien. And don't forget about the other very young attacking midfielders that could emerge by 2006 - Capano, Mapp, etc. Then there's Donovan who can slide into that. I also feel this is Mathis' best position when he decides not to be so lazy. (Just put in the tape of U.S. playing right after the Mexico game in Columbus back in 2001.) Although I think Bruce should leave Mathis out of the next friendly as a bit of a wake up call to start picking up his play. I realize he's injured but he should work harder on fitness of do something to improve.

At forward, we're loaded with players. All the good youngsters like Buddle, Johnson, Quaranta, Barclay, Donovan, Twellman, Casey, Wolff, Mathis, and Cunningham. Then if Mcbride continues to play well, he may get a spot. Then there's Faria if he gets naturalized. And there are many other players I'm forgetting.

 

Oh i forgot about Akwari. He definately deserves a chance to get one of those outside back places. And Yi and other players I know little about in Europe may deserve a place.

 

Two obvious things that differ as you go from defender --> midfielder --> forward that make a HUGE difference.

Defender almost always recieve a pass with all their options in view and typically have more time on the ball than midfielders or forwards. One of the most important aspects of midfield play is body positioning. When you go to receive the ball you need to open your body to where your options are going to be and you typically have some pressure right away. And forwards typically get the ball with their back to the goal making them need to learn how to turn defenders or excell at making good runs. They are almost always pressured the second they get the ball.


So why not Kirovski for right back? 8) I guess I don't know about his speed but he does have some size and does play physical. He can pass well and reads the game. Funny

 

For the outside back position, Gooch and Gbandi have a real shot to make a difference. Of course, one has contract problems and the other injury problems that have prevented them from ever playing a professional game. So, can't annoit them. If they don't pan out, another midfielder might be the answer, which is a good solution.

I see Eddie Pope as far and away the best US defender and a lock, IF healthy. No one else is close to being a lock. Personally, I like Gooch from the Euro list, Gbandi and, Kelly Gray, as my dream four defenders with Pope. Other top candidates IMHO are Boca, Califf, Suarez, Berhalter and Cherundolo.

 

MLS anyday

 

Talking about center mids and outside backs, there's another distinction that hasn't been emphasized -- the kind of running you do.

In the center, you make a lot of quick, darting runs. It's essential to change direction well; that's even more important than being able to win a footrace. By contrast, outside backs rely more on overlapping runs and recovery runs.

While Cherundolo, Reyna, or O'Brien would provide improved skills in the back, they're not ideal for some of the other demands of the job. They have neither the physique of Boca, Suarez, or Sanneh, nor the straight-ahead foot speed of Hejduk, Gbandi, or (again) Sanneh.

 

Shocked not to see Broome on this list. He has improved tremendously and is still learning the position. He also has awesome speed.

 

Re: Re: Re: 2006 Defenders: Europe or MLS?

From what I've seen of O'Brien at Ajax, he plays a somewhat atypical role. Because his team is so dominant, his biggest responsibility is in the offensive build-up. In some WC Qualifiers, the US might face a similar situation, but not often at the Finals.

I agree that Reyna played well at (essentially) the right back slot against Mexico. Still, Ramon Morales did torch him at one point. He needed the cover of three center backs, then.

It's interesting that you like Dolo's speed. I haven't seen enough to really be sure. Against Honduras's forwards, however, he did look unacceptably slow. Perhaps he was just playing flat-footed that day.

 

If you follow the English Premier League (in which many teams play 442, left-sided backs in particular are not the best physical specimens on the field. The most important characteristic is a) being left-footed b) having acceptable skills passing and holding the ball c) being able to harry and at least slow down opponent wingers/wide forwards.

Examples:

Mikael Silvestre - primarily noted for his offense, but is big and capable of playing in the center of the field.

Ashley Cole - primarily noted for his overlapping runs and diving under hard challenges. Occasionally makes glaring defensive mistakes.

John Arne Riise - primarily plays at left midfield now, as his strong suits are crossing and firing in hard shots. An acceptable defensive player.

Granted, in other leagues there may be more of an emphasis on the defensive qualities of outside backs, but in the EPL. Outside backs need to be able to contribute to the offensive side of the game and be just good enough on defense to slow down the opposition until the center-halfs or defensive midfielder can clean up the mess.

Also - in the EPL, outside backs almost never perform man-marking type duties.

 

But if you only look at the dominant teams, you'll always find that their outside backs are more offensively oriented. That's because those teams don't need as much defense.

It's probably better to consider guys like Bridge and Le Saux, who have each played for England. While not as fast as Cole, they have enough speed to get forward, and they're skillful enough to do it effectively. However, they're well-balanced between offensive and defensive play. For MLS fans, I'd suggest Wade Barrett as a lesser version of these players.