I pay for season tickets. 3 of them. Have for 4 of the 5 years since the Comets came back. My wife and kid really enjoy the games and it is good ball and the organization puts on a very professional production. You are a loser for making fun of somebody for spending their money on season tickets to the Comets.
Ha ha. Great point Skipper. Of course they are. Everything the FOUR different ethnic leagues in Chicago do is better than the rest of the country, why, probably even the rest of the world put together. NFL Football? Nope. the FOUR different ethnic leagues in Chicago are better Norwegian Sovereign Wealth Fund? the FOUR different ethnic pension funds in Chicago are better. Patek Philippe watches? the FOUR different ethnic guys selling watches on tables in Chicago are all better quality The list is endless.
My friend, this is a problem I can't help you with. I apologize if I've offended your rational decision making capabilities, but I'm not sure how or why someone who lives in a metro area with a first division professional team in the MLS feels compelled to buy SEASON TICKETS for lower level minor league indoor soccer. Professional production you say? Maybe. But so is Ringling Bros Barnum and Bailey Circus and I'm not rushing out there to buy season tickets for that. Good ball you say? Compared to what? Certainly not your MLS side. And most likely not compared to the NASL or USL Pro, either. Now that doesn't preclude the Comets home games from being competitive, if that's what you mean by "good". But closer inspection reveals that to be nowhere near the truth either. To date, the Comets have played seven home games. Four of those seven have been complete blowouts with a combined score of 58-14, including the recent 18-2 thriller v mighty Tulsa. So in essence, you've bought SEASON tickets to watch 3 of a possible 7 competitive games in a low level minor league, against the likes of Milwaukee, San Diego, and St Louis. Now I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you REALLY wanted to see those three competitive games, even if it meant paying for seven so far. But why season tickets? Were you afraid that tickets would not be available or that you would not get a good seat? I can't imagine there's a bad seat anywhere in the house in the Independence Center. So maybe you were fearful that tickets wouldn't be available? Maybe....except for the fact that the Comets are averaging appx 4,300/game in an arena that seats 5,800. That means that a quarter of the arena is EMPTY. But hey, knock yourself out if it makes you feel better.
I have season tickets to the Comets as well and enjoy my front row seats for the same price as my MLS season tickets in row 20. I enjoy both of them and since I'm not such an expert as AEK, I can enjoy the MASL games, even the blow outs. I'm not dillusional about the skill of the MASL players and the challenges the leauge faces, but I love the MASL and I'm tired of the "bashers". If you think the league is so crappy.....then please go an post on the ethnic leauges forums. I'm sure there must be FOUR different ones . Also, my son and I currently run the BASL (Basement Arena Soccer League), maybe we could get you to come and ref some of our games as my wife seems to always call the game my son's way. We don't serve beer, our goals are much smaller than regulation (we got them from Hidalgo LOL), but we have fun which is what it is all about!
Stellar response. I would have expected nothing less. You're worried about ME bashing the league? Your league boasts owners the likes of Thomas Guerreiro and Dion Earl, has single game attendance figures of 75, boasts numerous teams whose standard mo is to take reduced rosters on road trips and not dress players for matches against substandard opponents to reduce operating costs, and has teams dropping like flies, but you're worried about ME? Even your absolute best franchises can't draw more than a few thousand per match. Your largest market struggles to draw more than a few hundred. The league operates under two scoring systems and can only employ local referees. You routinely have scores of 18-2. And you're worried about ME? But then again you pay the same amount to watch soccer's version of roller derby as you do to see first division play, so I guess it can be expected. Ah, but I see now...those Comets seats are FRONT ROW. Got it! Btw, you're not one of THOSE guys, are you? You know, the ones who love to rub elbows with low level minor league athletes..... Goodness, I'm starting to feel a little Bull Durhamish here.
Brilliant response. Poor little aek gets trounced again. I love the BASL reference too. If you do have the little guy come over to give your wife a break from refereeing then he can really hammer home the BS in BASL. Actually Dion and Thomas Anthony Guerreiro are gone. For someone who wants fans to have an epiphany and discover one of the FOUR great ethnic leagues in Chicago that are equal in skill and higher in pay than MASL, you sure don't like the fans What's wrong with some fans supporting the game? What's wrong with a family going to a game and enjoying the match? Why bash fans? I know fans bash you as a ref, that's the nature if the job and you signed up for it. Also I don't think anyone here is one of "those" guys. What's so wrong with a father taking his son to a game and having his child get an autograph. That's a good thing, maybe your idea of being a dad is to regale the child with tales of your refereeing career, but some people like to get out of the house. Sad Anyways I am off to Columbus for the weekend and then a meeting about the minor leagues re-alignment for the rest of the week. Might even be a former Kitchener Ranger in attendance
When someone is jumping for joy to compare and contrast a team/teams they like to the likes of Sacremento, Oxford, Seattle (old), and Turlock you know exactly what quality is truely in these leagues. 90% of the fan base wants to cut teams like that, meaning the ones that the ethnic leagues might actually compete against, no one wants to see play. I know its the "same league" but if you actually followed indoor, you would realize in this "league" there are the real and the "hey your here so the real teams dont have to travel and fold." Alert us about our misfortune of paying to see the Comets or Blast or teams as such instead of $2 rec/beer league soccer in Chicago, that will be like watching Sacremento hold a inter-squad, when you feel the level of play in these ethnic leagues hits that standard.
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here my friend but I know exactly why the PASL teams were brought into the league. That being said, 2/3 of your "league" is comprised of PASL teams, so you just can't ignore them, much as you would like to. The very reason those teams are "in" your league is because even your very best teams do not draw enough fans to make traveling cross country to places like San Diego and Dallas economically feasible. In other words, even your very BEST teams are minor league, third division quality at best. Now if you're dumb enough to pay first division prices in Baltimore to see the blast when you have DC United nearby, I can't help you with that. But even in Baltimore, the Blast can't draw major league crowds, and THAT is what this thread was about, wasn't it? I mean, big markets like Chicago and Deteoit can't draw four figures. How do you expect the league to make it? Or do you believe Baltimore, Missouri and Milwaukee (maybe St Louis) will simply play only against each other? What you're seeing is the gradual demise not just of the league but of a niche sport whose time has come and gone, at least on a major league level. In case you haven't noticed, the only successful franchises are in mid to moderate sized markets. The problem you have though is that there aren't enough of these markets geographically close enough to each other to make a professional league viable. I think the continuous struggles of this league verify as much. Unfortunately, without enough viable teams/markets available, this league will be nothing more than a small handful of legitimate franchises beating up on the Washington General quality rest of the league. If you want to pay top dollar for that, so be it. Your choice. But it's quite obvious based on league wide attendance figures that most savvy consumers aren't buying what the MASL is selling.
AEK - I don't think we are paying major league prices for minor league teams in the MASL. I'm sure the ticket price for Arsenal is much more than Sporting KC and as I said before my Comets tickets are less than Sporting KC. I take my family of 4 to the Comets game, have a total of 4 beers, 6 hotdogs, 8 sodas for a litte over $100, have fun, made friends with the people around us. I guess to the logic you have applied (1) All MLS ticket purchases are stupid because there are at least FOUR divisions in Europe that play better soccer than the MLS. (2) All movie theatre purchases are stupid because you can just wait and watch at home. Why pay more for the in theatre experience. Its entertainment and experiences that we as a family talk about, look forward to, and have fun! I am excited to see the Mustangs play in KC again and I'll enjoy the game and talent for what it is.
San Diego, Baltimore, Dallas, Monterrey (kind of, skill wise yes), Milwaukee, Missouri, Rochester, Syracuse. There are a few on the cusp as well. You're argument about Chicago-ethnic leagues was the skill level is close to or the same or even better than most teams in the MASL. My argument was you're comparing the ethnic league to the bottom feeders of the league that are here to keep the above mentioned teams in business long term, not to actually compete currently. The idea, whether right or wrong, is that by playing the "big boys" and developing rivalries the bottom feeders will become middle feeders, and than possibly bigger. I'm not here to nor will I argue if that strategy is legit or not, but it is what it is. For the league to be "national", those crap teams have to be in the place currently drawing 700 fans or less a game. You're trying to, I guess, prove how good Chicago men's leagues are. That's all well and fine, but when your argument is based off of "hey, look at these guys on this video they play for (insert bottom feeder team here). They play rec ball so why would I go to Mustangs games", it makes your loved ethnic leagues look worse, IMO, in peoples eyes.
I am not hiding behind the keyboard. You could have one of your private investigators find me pretty easy. Hell you can just private message me. I appreciate you taking a pot shot at my profession. Just like you said maybe you have a complex maybe your wife or girlfriend or daughter has a thing for fireman. I can take pride in my profession everytime we roll out the door its for somebody in distress but you have me beat not everybody can be a attorney and a ethnic league card thrower. Must make the kids smile when you go to career day. Its not Rossi and I don't care who comps your tickets. I will ask Gordy next time if I get a chance to talk to him. I am sure he is very proud of your douche baggary in his name on here. I will say all the times I have testified in court for abuse cases and standard of care and arson cases I don't think I have ever met someone so full of themselves as you. You remind me of John Larroqutte (not sure if that's spelled right ) from night court. Later douche going to follow Rancho seco and the Comets as you have began to bore me. I think minor league soccer would be better than minor league back and forth with you. Come on over when Chicago comes to town..
I don't think I'd say San Diego, or Dallas is in the top of the league as far as skill goes. Even the Ambush beat San Diego. And Dallas just does not look that good. A lot of their players are over the hill also. Rochester and Syracuse are not very good also. Detroit can play with them. The East is not very strong this year. IMO, Baltimore, Missouri, Milwaukee, and Monterrey are the top four teams. San Diego is as good as St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, Rochester, Syracuse, and Wichita. As far as off the field goes, just look at the attendance records. Any how this thread is bringing out the worst in all of us. Nothing to do with the 12/27 games. Not sure why the other thread was closed regarding the Chicago ethnic leagues and the MASL. I mean why not keep it open? They can debate all day there.
I think you entirely missed my point. Or at least the main gist of it. I'm not trying at all to prove how good Chicago's ethnic leagues are, nor was I comparing the teams/players in those leagues to "bottom feeder" MASL teams. My point was that the SKILL LEVEL in the major divisions of those ethnic leagues is on par with, if not in some cases better than all but a handful of MASL teams...hence, why would I go see the Mustangs? You cant compare the two on a team by team basis simply because ethnic league teams don't regularly train together. The only thing you can do is compare their respective talent/skill levels. And because I know the majority of these players on a first name basis and have reffed them ALL, I can tell you first hand how good they are. IMO, the talent/skill level in the "bottom feeder" teams you mentioned is lower than the good major division teams in the Chicago ethnic leagues. I know that because I had quite a few of Seattles players on my own team that I coached. Several of them could not make the roster of the top end ethnic league teams yet still played regularly for Seattle. I would say you have/had about 8-10 teams at that level in the MASL. Of the remaining 10-15 teams in the league, I would say that the SKILL LEVEL of all but 2 (maybe 3-4 bc I havent seen San Diego or Monterrey) is comparable to that of the good major division ethnic league teams. Notice I said simply SKILL LEVEL. That doesnt mean RWB Adria or San San, for example, can go out and beat Rochester, primarily b/c Rochester trains on a regular basis, but it DOES mean that the skill level is similar. If you knew anything about the players in these ethnic leagues you would know that to be true because virtually all of them have played on teams like Rochester, St Louis, Milwaukee, Syracuse, Mustangs, etc. Not the so called "bottom feeder" teams but rather the middle of the road and slightly above former MISL teams. The exceptions, IMO, are Missouri and Baltimore. The skill level on these two teams is definitely better than that found in any of the aforementioned ethnic leagues. As such, why would I go pay to see the Mustangs play when only ten percent or so of the league (MASL) is better skill wise than what I can find on a Friday or Saturday night at the Odeum? And its blatantly apparent that most soccer enthusiasts in Chicago feel the same way. There's no other way to explain why a metro area of 9 million people cant draw more than a couple hundred people to a "pro" soccer game.
Your probably right. It is hard to understand why Chicago can't draw a better crowd. The only issue I have with that is the NY Arrows never drew well back in the late 70's and early 80's. Is Chicago marketing their team like St. Louis is? I see the Ambush all over the city. Krispy Cream, gas stations, Imo's, etc. a billboard, and at almost every local sporting event and community event they have a booth setup. Indoor never really did well in LA, NY, and Chicago except for a few years with the Sting.
Well, if THIS ^^^^ IS true, then a team comprised almost entirely of Chicago ethnic league players is at as good as if not better than all but four teams in a 23 team MASL. I know for sure the Mustangs have beaten Rochester, Detroit and St. Louis, so this sounds about right. I also know that Chicago has played Milwaukee VERY closely this year so the gap between these two teams isnt all that great.
as far as NY is concerned, thats a VERY finnicky sports market. there is SO much top level professional sports there, as well as so many other entertainment options, that its VERY understandable why the Arrows didnt do well. IMO, it doesnt matter how Chicago markets their team, people will not go...at least not to see minor league soccer. The ethnic leagues have quite a bit to do with it. as for St Louis, its a perfect fit for the MASL. Mid size city, soccer fanatical, long/storied tradition, and not as many pro sports or entertainment options as bigger cities like NY or Chicago. No MLS team either. If you had 10 St. Louis or Missouri's in the MASL, it would flourish. But you dont. Or at least you dont have them geographically close enough to make travel costs viable.
Well, your logic is a little skewed because the American fan doesnt have access to the top four leagues in Europe. Those leagues arent viable options for him/her. Nor are they entertainment dollar competitors of the MLS or MASL. I believe I read on another post that the tickets to a Comets and Sporting math are the same price, albeit located 20 rows apart. Hence, my argument. Lastly, if you look at it from a family entertainment perspective, maybe....but a) I'm not sure many/most fans view it simply as family entertainment because if that was the case EVERY arena would be sold out in the MASL (quality of the product DOES count, no?), and b) I can STILL find more enjoyable things to do with my family of four for less that $100 or so that ALL family members (including my 6 year old daughter) would enjoy. One of the reasons the Hispanic leagues are so popular here in Chicago is because a family of four can go see MULTIPLE games on the same night for a fraction of that $100 cost. In any event, lets be serious here. Even though a side benefit may be family fun, the PRIMARY reason most fans go to MASL games is for the product on the field.
Therein lies your answer. The Sting were able to field players like Pato Margetic, Frank Klopas, Karl Heinz Granitza, Batata, Taso Koutsoukos, Chico Moreira, Frantz Mathieu, Victor Noguiera, etc.... Where do you see talent anywhere ever remotely close to that in the MASL? Chicago draws well when there's quality on the field.
You're counting all the sports entertainment options in two different cities that are hundreds of miles apart. St. Louis and Kansas City each have three major pro sports teams. Chicago has five plus the very popular Wolves of the AHL. Chicago also has far more other entertainment options than St. Louis or KC.
Distance from Kansas City to St. Louis=248 miles, or roughly four hour car ride. I guess by the same token I can include Milwaukee (90 miles and Indianapolis (150 miles) in the greater Chicago metropolitan area? heck, if I tag on another 50 miles or so to that 248 I can also include Detroit, St. Louis, Dayton, Louisville, Cleveland, and Columbus to the Chicago metro are as well...LOL!!!!
Glad you mentioned the Wolves because here's an example of minor league sports that DOES work in a major metro market, and it does so because there's a SIGNIFICANT DISPARITY in ticket prices between the Wolves and Blackhawks. Not everyone can afford $100 a pop or so to see the Hawks, and the Wolves realized this and stepped in to fill a consumer void.
Here's a question for skipper though, and one that may put this whole debate in perspective. If the Chicago Fire were playing in an indoor league with the rest of the MLS, what do you think THEY would draw?