So, while watching the game this morning, I was thinking about whether or not the Man U rivalry is as big as it once was. Personally, I think it's not close to what it was a few years ago. Gone are RvN, Teddy Cuntingham (that's for Rick), Keane, Keown and Vieira. Play today, aside from Scholes running over Rosicky, was pretty clean. Even the rhetoric between SAF and AW isn't what it was. SAF even admitted we were the better team today! Has Chelsea's ascension coupled with all the new blood coming in lessened the rivalry some, or is this just a lull? I'd like to hear from both sides on this one.
The rivalry is still as big, when you hear the Manchester United fans chanting "Same Old Arsenal Always Cheating" you get the idea. I live in Manchester and now Arsenal have the bragging rights its going to be great when i go back to school
If today didn't prove that this remains a massive rivalry, I don't know what will. You don't need in-the-tunnel vitriol for a rivalry...just great games and lots of back-and-forth play.
Its still big, but I think that the media isn't playing it up as much anymore and there doesn't seem to be as many personal player grudges either. I'm also glad that we didn't have to see Reyes getting fouled and diving repeatedly today.
Not that big at all. It was only a rivalry because both sides were the top two in the country and bad blood had accumulated as a result. That just isn't the case anymore. Still a big game but more hype than anything else.
^^ Sums it up pretty well. If Spurs were any better in the league the past decade, it would've been bigger than the Arsenal-United rivalry.
Yeah, I consider ManUre-Arsenal a bigger and more important rivalry than Arsenal-Spurz. I mean, what have the Spurz accomplishment in the past decade?!?!?!? Nothing from what I last remember.
Hell, last season was the first one in a while that I could feel the Sp*rs rivalry from over here. Competing for 4th place made me wish death upon the entire team and their supporters. Not to mention Rick telling me his horror stories from games at WHL.
I agree. Hatred is not a rivalry. I hate Chelsea and ten years ago I couldn't stand ManU. Put both of them mid-table however, and I couldn't care less. Sputz I root against if they are 7th of 17th. The defining issue for me is that rivals mean as much without table coming into it. Your rival can stink and you still look forward to the game.
I've disliked Manu since their early dominance of the Premiership. It's not a general dislike of the top team, as I never had any problems with Liverpool when they had their period of success. General arrogance and money I guess. As for Manu vs Arsenal, Sky have built it up over the late 90s and early 00s and obviously because of the importance of the result in previous seasons where it might be a title decider the players took it very seriously indeed. Personally I thought it was a great game yesterday, pretty good even for the neutral, but no blood and guts Vieira vs Keane, Keown vs RvN, Lehmann vs well....anyone who wants it. But Rick is right the one I most want to win is the derby... (btw, did anyone notice Cesc in the postmatch interview referring to it as a 'derby' yesterday ?)
He probably likens it to Real Madrid/Barca. Which, for the last decade at least, isn't all that inaccurate. However, it's not a derby the way Arsenal/Tottenham is, and they'll always be the bigger rival. For me, winning the title at WHL was 10x sweeter than winning it at Old Trafford.
Beating Spurs will always be bigger to me, but I think it was just so big because of previous incidents and the players involved. I still want to beat them badly, but I think it's "died down" a little from a few years ago.
Chel$ki has taken ManUre's top spot among teams I hate, but it's the attitude the team and supporters have and the mere existence of Rooney, Silvestre, Ronaldo and Fergie that makes me retain my disgust for the Mancs. I recently read David Beckham's autobiography and his descriptions of Fergie just verify everything I've ever felt about him. Treated Beckham like scum for simply having a family and wanting to have a balanced life. He's the polar opposite of Wenger and just disgusts me in every way. How could anyone not see the exchanges between Lehmann and O'Shea and not have the bile bubble up in your stomach towards ManUre? I still hate 'em and always will. As an American fan, that hatred probably came first for me...
I think this nails it pretty well. This has really been more of a "Sky" rivalry, since we were the top two teams for almost an entire decade and they could hype it for the entire week prior to a match, much like they love to do with Liverpool-Chelsea. The fact that there have been some great games played between the two teams (from a neutral standpoint), plus that we met several times in the FA Cup, plus the Keane vs Vieira thing (and Schmeichel vs Wright before) added fuel to the fire. But ultimately, almost no Arsenal fans see us as your biggest rival--I'm guessing its Spurs first, then maybe a couple of other London clubs. The same goes for us, where we have more dislike for Liverpool, and then Man City and Leeds traditionally. But this is still a big match for a lot of fans and especially between Fergie and Wenger given their history. I think it might change when one or the other leaves.
I agree with this. I really do believe that it is only because Wenger appeared on the scene as a rival to Fergie that Fergie decided not to retire. This helped fuel more fun and games between the two sides. But to most Arsenal fans as Achtung has said, Spu*s are our rival and will always be. I will say though that getting in and out of Old Trafford has become more and more worrying, especially considering it's one of those high profile games that tourists will attend. I hope that an unwanted image of English football fans isnot emerging again.........
I disagree. It's unrealistic for a manager to expect a footballer to have no life outside of the game, especially as he gets older. Fergie wanted a 27-year-old, married with kids Beckham to approach ManUre in the same manner he did as a 16-year-old development system prospect. When he put any attention towards his family life, Fergie saw it as an affront to the club. Hypocritically, he seems to have no problem with young single players catting around with soap stars or getting in restaurant scraps (see Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney). Not a coincidence there has been a mass exodus from Old Trafford in the last 2 seasons... Beckham's celebrity outside of the game is a different animal, I understand - but I attribute that more to the English press than Beckham himself. His goal vs. Sociedad yesterday wasn't a fluke...he remains an effective player. On the flipside, see Arsene Wenger's handling of Jose Antonio Reyes and Cashley Cole. Reyes's personal life was affecting his relationship and performance at the club, but there were no public tongue-lashings by Wenger. I don't need to address the Cole situation - Wenger handled it behind closed doors, with class. Now that I think of it - this kind of thread is exactly why the rivalry is still strong...