St. Louis Expansion Talks!

Discussion in 'St. Louis City SC' started by Tad Ghostal, Jun 11, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You're kidding, right? Do you seriously think that watching your kids play at SportPort is the same as MLS? Do you really expect people to continue following some high school team after their kid has graduated?

    Of course not. This is not a small, rural town on a Friday night where the whole town goes to the local school football game. The fan base for pro sports and little league are not the same thing. St. Louis is a great baseball town, but when I was in little league I don't remember anyone watching except parents.

    In fact, if random old men came to little league games that their kids weren't in, wouldn't we worry?
     
  2. MiamiAce

    MiamiAce New Member

    Jan 12, 2004
    Miami, USA
    Just out of curiosity,

    Is there a likely scenario in which Kansas City Wizards can move to St. Louis?

    It would seem to me this would be a beneficial move for everyone (minus the few dedicated fans of KC), but I must admit, I'm not informed on these situations as some of you are. I just don't understand why it's necessary for MLS to hang onto a very small market like Kansas City with all its troubles and still no investor. St. Louis makes total sense. Am I wrong?

    Any chance?
     
  3. McGinty

    McGinty Member

    SKC/STL
    Aug 29, 2001
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    (takes a deep breath)

    I suppose there is a chance in the Dumb & Dumber "So you're saying there's a chance" sort of way. It doesn't appear that the people currently trying to bring in a team are at relocation.
     
  4. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Garber says:

    "Expansion, as I mentioned, will happen next year in Toronto. The next team, our 14th team, will be in the Midwest--Cleveland or St. Louis, two cities that are vying for that 14th team. The 15th and 16th we hope to happen by the end of the decade. That will be in either St. Louis or Cleveland, possibly Philadelphia, San Jose, and Milwaukee is another market where we're making a lot of process. We have a lot of cities that are interested in being number 15 or 16. Then we're going to take a deep breath and stop for awhile. We want to maintain that 16 team league size for a number of years to let the game grow and be able to manage where we are competitively with many new teams coming on in a short period of time....We should be in a position to finalize and announce [the 14th team] by our All-Star game. That is what our goal is."

    Complete press conference transcript at:
    http://unitedmania.matchnight.com/umindex.cfm?page=ARTICLE&show=18913

    Sounds very promising that even if St. Louis isn't #14, we're the front-runners for #15.

    Sweet.
     
  5. soccertom

    soccertom New Member

    Jun 2, 1999
    Hey Seph,

    I think you may have misunderstood the point of the previous poster.

    I believe the poster is referring to the long standing idea among thousands of old time St. Louis area players and fans. The question has always been why should we care about paying for big time Pro soccer when we can watch the top leagues in St. Louis for free. That idea has been discussed in St. Louis soccer circles for decades. In fact there was a long period of time when that notion was very true. Not any longer but @ one time yes. Certainly during the 1920's through the 1980's the highest level of adult men league play in St. Louis was comparable to what one might see in the NASL. Literally during the 1940, 1950's 1960's and 1970's the St. Louis area had incredibly strong Men's Adult Leagues. The Saint Louis area players selected for the 1950 World Cup team were plucked directly off those Semi-pro Leagues in St. Louis. During the 1960's and 1970's leagues in St. Louis such as the Busch Major League attracted a tremendous amount of fan and media interest. Those teams were National powers populated with several hundred pro caliber players. Quite frankly some of those teams and many of those players could have competed in the NASL but of course the players had jobs and families to worry about. So to make a long story short there is a long standing feeling among a bunch of St. Louisians that they shouldn't pay for what they can see for free. Of course that thinking is way outdated but it still exists.
     
  6. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I really don't think that's the way fans here view it any more. You can't compare the attitudes of St. Louis fans pre-MLS to St. Louis fans now.

    The soccer landscape in the U.S. has changed a lot in the last 15 years. We're really not even talking about the same fans that were around in the 1970s, unless MLS' target market is for 55-year-olds.

    Assuming that sports is all about marketing, (which seems like a pretty safe assumption) MLS is going after kids and young adults, and to us (I'm 31) MLS is soccer in the U.S..
     
  7. McGinty

    McGinty Member

    SKC/STL
    Aug 29, 2001
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Good post, Tom, but the previous poster essentially said that people only want to watch their kids play, implying that the area is only made up of soccer parents and not fans. It doesn't sound like he was talking about people watching a bunch of guys who decided against trying to play in the country's professional top-flight division.
     
  8. Atarian

    Atarian New Member

    Aug 31, 2005
    St Charles, MO
    Ohhhhh hummmmm.....
    Are they ever going to break the news of the expansion team for 08. I don't even care if its not even stl. Just throw us a bone MLS please!!!!!!
     
  9. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Garber's now saying they'll announce at the All-Star Game
     
  10. USRufnex

    USRufnex Red Card

    Tulsa Athletic / Sheffield United
    United States
    Jul 15, 2000
    Tulsa, OK
    Club:
    --other--
    Garber never throws us "bones"... just lotsa "chewies"...
     
  11. soccertom

    soccertom New Member

    Jun 2, 1999
    Many of the old time St. Louis soccer mafia still harbor those beliefs. However they all would come ariound and support a MLS team.
     
  12. soccertom

    soccertom New Member

    Jun 2, 1999
    Huh?? What is that supposed to mean? Have all the St. Louis soccer fans pre MLS suddenly died? I have news for you. The largest and most passionate block of St. Louis soccer fans are people who have been dedicated fans of soccer long long before the advent of MLS. Capice?
     
  13. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As a lifelong St. Louisan, I know how old the roots are. I mean, Harry Keough reffed a game I was coaching last week. The attitudes towards pro soccer, however, have changed a lot in St. Louis and in the U.S. in general in the last ten years.

    Twenty years ago there were other leagues around St. Louis that were as good as anything "professional" that was going on. Now, the MLS has actually created a legitimate league that seems built to stay.

    Saying that St. Louis fans won't support pro soccer now is like studying St. Louis' opinions of the Hawks and comparing it to the NBA now. It's an entirely different sport in the post-Dr. J, post-Jordan world, and soccer is an entirely different sport in the U.S. in the MLS era.
     
  14. soccertom

    soccertom New Member

    Jun 2, 1999
    For the most part we are in agreement. My only concern is you paint with too wide of a brush and you are a little cloudy with your sports analogies. Was the NASL a legitamate league? By the way I haven't ever said St. Louis fans wouldn't support a MLS team. Quite the contrary. I'm on record as stating many times that St. Louis if awarded a MLS team would immediately lead the league in attendance. My only point was that there are still some St. Louisians that hold on to the misguided thinking that they can watch top or nearly top level soccer for free by watching the top teams in St. Louis. Can ya dig that?
     
  15. Seph

    Seph Member

    Dec 2, 2004
    St. Louis, Mo., USA
    Club:
    St. Louis Lions
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Okay, I can dig that.

    I think the MLS is doing a good job, however, of showing U.S. fans that top tier soccer is better than what we've been watching for years. The MLS is still not providing the level of soccer that some Euro leagues do, but it's getting there, and that is why I believe that people are coming around a little faster than you give them credit for.

    And, like you say, there are enough who have come around that I agree with you about St. Louis attendance on that magical future day when we get a team.
     
  16. Atarian

    Atarian New Member

    Aug 31, 2005
    St Charles, MO
    Does anyone know whats going on at the Fenton soccer park? I passed it the other day, and they are doing alot of work to it. Making it bigger for the college cup I would think, but I dont know for sure.
     
  17. pericles

    pericles Member

    Feb 2, 2004
    St. Louis, MO
    They're adding a banquet room or something. Check the Business Journal. The college cup is at SLU, no?
     
  18. McGinty

    McGinty Member

    SKC/STL
    Aug 29, 2001
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Yes. I believe they have to expand Hermann at least on a temporary basis as well as part of the agreement with the NCAA. That's why I thought the opportunity for an MLS team using Hermann on a temporary basis would present itself. As it looks now, that may not be totally necessary for MLS in St. Louis.
     
  19. Angus Podgorney

    Feb 25, 2006
    St. Louis
    From St. Louis Business Journal:

    Kicking out

    The Anheuser-Busch Conference and Sports Center in Fenton is gearing up for an expansion. Known to many as the A-B Soccer Park since 1982, the center has developed into one of the best in the nation. Among the latest improvements are a 2,400-square-foot expansion of the kitchen facility, a 220-square-foot expansion that will double the north concession area, and enclosure of the 1,657-square-foot breezeway between the two main buildings with glass and steel to create a formal entryway into the conference and banquet facility.
     
  20. MCreek05

    MCreek05 New Member

    Apr 19, 2006
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Does anybody else feel like St. Louis is being dissed by the moderators, seeing as how it doesnt have its own forum even though Garber has said it is one of two cities in contention for the next expansion team.

    I dont mean to bite the hands that feeds, i just wanted to point out how this is completely ignorant and lacking of any common sense and any logical thought process.
     
  21. USRufnex

    USRufnex Red Card

    Tulsa Athletic / Sheffield United
    United States
    Jul 15, 2000
    Tulsa, OK
    Club:
    --other--
    Just send a few notes to the mods: looks like Atlanta was just added.
     
  22. WarrenWallace

    WarrenWallace Member

    Mar 12, 1999
    Beer and Cheese
    moderators don't add forums. the site admin adds forums.
     
  23. Sport Billy

    Sport Billy Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 25, 2006
    From the St. Louis Post-Dispatch: (by Tom Timmermann) edited for content

    Major League Soccer added another expansion team - sort of - on Wednesday, and while the team wasn't in St. Louis, the city remains a solid candidate to have a team in 2008.

    ...
    While that was happening, the group trying to bring a team to St. Louis was in Chicago to update MLS Commissioner Don Garber on their progress. The league's board meets in Chicago today. The St. Louis group officially submitted an application for a team on Wednesday, though it was in many ways a formality since they already are pretty far down the path.

    "We're continuing to move forward with our plans for St. Louis," said Michael Huyghue, one of the potential owners. "I'm very, very optimistic and I think the ball is rolling, but it's premature to say it's a go. All the work that needs to be done is being done."
    ...

    Garber characterized Cleveland's bid as "almost at the finish line," and cited San Diego and Las Vegas as cities that have expressed interest in a team, but Huyghue thinks St. Louis has a good shot.

    "St. Louis is very much on the horizon for a team," Huyghue said. "We don't have to do anything heroic or Herculean. There's nothing to lessen the league's interest in St. Louis."

    The ownership group has pretty much settled on a Metro East site and recently commissioned a second feasibility study to look at whether Missouri residents would cross the Mississippi to attend games in Illinois. An announcement on a team could come before the start of the World Cup on June 9, and possibly next week.

    The Cleveland group has been pursuing an MLS team longer, but also is held up over the issue of financing the stadium. The Philadelphia project would be built in New Jersey on the campus of Rowan University.

    There also is the chance of the Kansas City Wizards moving. The team has been for sale for more than a year while also trying to get a soccer-specific stadium built somewhere in the area.
     
  24. Atarian

    Atarian New Member

    Aug 31, 2005
    St Charles, MO
    Ohhh hum..........
    How can the Don give San Fran. a team when they dont have a stadium deal yet, but St. Louis and Cleveland are struggling to get everything done for a stadium, to beat each other out for the 08 expansion. Whlie Stl is running around looking for land deals, the Okland A's ownership strolls in and says we would like a team, although we have done anything yet. Oh sure says the Don, just get done in 3 years or less and your in.
     
  25. uclacarlos

    uclacarlos Member+

    Aug 10, 2003
    east coast
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    Well what do you expect?

    SJ had a team and the fans successfully rallied to 2 do a few things:

    1. Stave off moving to H-town for another season
    2. show their strength in numbers and begin to exert political pressure and keep MLS in the public's eye continuously
    3. Teach KC fans to do the same, which will more than likely be the saving grace for KC.

    Garber promised the fans that MLS is not abandoning the market. SJE proved that the market is completely viable. It's just that SJE owned by AEG and playing in Spartan Stadium [/spit] wasn't going to fly.

    Kudos to Don and kudos to MLS for keeping their word.
     

Share This Page