If only one of the Red Bulls would have -- then it would have been offside. That being said, it did look amateurish out there for the backline for a while. Also, the infield cutout area was, indeed, awful as before. Both Wynne and Eski did full head-over-heels in the second term. Wynne is a fine player and will anchor the central defense for years. Is it my imagination, or can Adu shoot the rock a little harder than in the past? Also, I just hope ESC is ready for the noise the United supporters will be bringing to the Swamp on the 22nd ...
i wonder if a defender had been back there and stepped forward right as he youri kicked the ball would it have been called offside? Altho, i assume that the reason they were there is because DC was keeping a high offsides line (around the 18 IIRC), so if a defender did go back there presumably the whole RBNY team have been in the 6yd box. And if that happened and we stepped forward would they have been offsides then? Sorry its still early i couldn't think of a better way to phrase that.
Carroll was man of the match to me. Second half he was all over the place. Freddy was good in the second half and should have been in the middle from the start. Olsen at attacking mid?? Ben played hard but that puts both he and Freddy out of position.
The 2nd half was better. I think maybe Simms should tried out at RB, to me in the First half, that Olsen was attempting to go forward down the Right-Wing basically having Simms and Carroll maintain shape in the center with Gros not getting too deep, however, early in the 2nd Half, BEFORE the goals. Olsen & Gros gave the ball away a couple times on the right. I was encouraged that DC managed 2 goals without Moreno/Gomez influencing the play. I think the passive offside rule is a joke. How is screening the goalkeeper intentionally considered "passive"? Somehow, Protective Headgear has become a whole lot cooler.
I posted earlier that you could put a defender in front of them and the defender would still need to run into him if they didn't move in order to make the call. Another option would be for Perkins to stand between them and then he'd need to dive into either guy in order to make a save, so the two players would have intefered with the play. It was a well designed play......why'd they waste it so early in the season?
They weren't screening him, they were to either side of him. Troy could see the ball come over the wall just as well as if they weren't there. But it had to be distracting on some level to Troy.
I highly doubt that. It's not against the LOTG to be in an offside position. You have to be some how actively involved in the play. Just standing in an offside position doesn't meet that criteria. If they just stand there and don't move and aren't really in anyone's way how can that rightly be called offside? Also having a defender back there or the keeper run into one of them to get the call won't work either. With the defender initiating the contact, especially if the ball isn't near them, the ref won't see it as impeding play. I certainly wouldn't.
To quote Bill Shankly, legendary Liverpool manager, "if he wasn't interfering with play then he ought to have been". I agree the goal would have gone regardless,but this is a particularly egregious example of the foolish re-interpretation of the off side rule by FIFA. Standing in front of goal in an offside position has to interfere with the goal keeper. Now if an attacker is in an offside position across the field from play and the ball is not played to him, he was never deemed to be offside under the old interpretation of the law except by incompetent ARs and centers.
A few impressions on the game. Overll I didn't think it was that great of a game. Sure it was relatively high paced, especially the second half, but it was very sloppy, you can tell it was the first game of the season. It wasn't as bad as the LA v NE game, which was atrocious, but it certainly wasn't prety by any stretch of the imagination. The first RB goal was incredible. A perfectly placed shot struck with great pace, just unstoppable. The second goal, while Perkins gets his fair share of blame also involved some bad luck. If Wilson hadn't been standing there for the ball to hit off of him and land at Buddle's feet, Perkins would have been able to collect the ball easily on the bounce.. I'd put 95% of that goal on Perkins and the rest to bad luck. One thing that I think really hurt us in the first half was the pairing of Carrol and Simms. It seems that they were both at the same place at the same time and were getting in each other's way. There spacing was way off and it really hurt us. The second half was very good, but Simms was subbed out and I think that made the difference in the spacing in the midfield. Eski's goal was gorgeous. When it went in I almost dropped my daughter in excitement. Wynne got caught watching the ball and Eski peeled off his back marvelously (no pun intended) to volley home. Very good striker play. The second goal was very good build up and Olsen did well to find Erpen. He hit that shot very well and with the screen Meola didn't see it until too late. I really thought we would get the third. We played the second half with much more urgency and a little more directly. If we can play that way from the start of a game we'll be very hard to beat. One thing we didn't do well, and we haven't for some time now, is getting good crosses in from deep. As for Freddy I thought he was OK, but that's about it. One thing I did like is a few times he took off on a dribbling run down the middle of the field. this is where he should be doing those types of runs. Usually he got fouled and a few times he lost the ball. If he could pick his head up a little more and look for a teammate when he does it it will be very effective. NY's backline has gotten faster and could catch up to Adu and also made sure he wasn't going to get a shot off, ala the LA game last year. For the first game and with a short turnaround time I thought the field was in good shape. Lastly, I must admit that NY had a pretty good travelling contingency. They sat a few sections over from me and did a good job cheering.
Yeah, well, Chuck Norris could play central defense from the right back, too ... I chatted with one of their yell-leaders at the interval, and he was rightly worried that they might not get that kind of support at home when the sponsor isn't picking up the tab. But I must applaud the Red Bull company for investing coin in the league and "Cuban/Maloof-ing" the team -- sparing no expense for the well-being of the players (bearing in mind that, neither the Kings nor the Mavericks have won an NBA title yet ...).
Incidentally, the FIFA LotG website has a handy flash animation displaying offsides and the concept of offside and interfering with an opponent. The specific example they use is, drumroll please, a player in an offsides position obstructing the view of the keeper, deeming it a valid offsides call. So, sure, Ye Lowbred Knurl (It's an anagram, NY fans. Look it up.) may well have asked the refs if it was OK beforehand, but given the quality of your average MLS ref, much less Brian Hall, that's not saying much. That's like asking a monkey if it's OK to throw feces at the zoo on your next field trip. Sure, it's OK for the MONKEYS, but everyone else at the zoo might get a little PO'd. If you're in an offside position, and you interfere with the goalkeeper's view of the ball, you're offsides, plain and simple. Cheatin' Mo sounds good to me.
For you guys getting your panties in a wad over the Djerkitoff fk, this exact kind of play has been happening in the game for at least a year and maybe two. I have seen it in Euro leagues and South American leagues. And sometimes those players don't even stand still. I have also studied this in refereee certification classes. Perkins could see through the "offending" players and was not blocked. The only way I see to get around this is for Perkins to dive into one of these guys as he is trying to make a save. Otherwise, get used to it, and expect to see more of it.
I wasn't at the stadium (had to attend a birthday), so I saw the game on tv and after the third giveaway you could clearly here the people boo Freddy the next time he got the ball and gave it away. Didn't happen at all in the second half but for a period in the first half he was getting booed it was clearly heard.
Heh, keepers should do that. That'd hopefully put an end to an ugly play. If you can execute a great free kick like that, what's the point of having the guys on the line anyway, apart from blocking the line of sight for a brief instant, so the keeper might not be able to see just how much the ball is curling where. I mean, they can't touch a rebound, and they'd serve as impediments to the keeper or retreating defenders on such a rebound. It still seems crappy to me. But perhaps I'm still bitter about the MLS Cup '98, where a Fire player in an offsides position screen Utd's keeper from a a successful shot on goal (almost exactly mirroring the FIFA LotG animation).
I thought Bennie was the man of the match. He played like he did 8 years ago before the ankles crumbled. He was a thorn in the red bulls side and was very disruptive in the middle. Sims was a non-entity and seemed to be lost and out of possition most of the time. Freddy looks bigger to me, but he needs to learn when to pass and when to take a guy on the dribble. By passing once in awhile he will make the defender think pass instead of dribble. Carroll and Erpen looked pretty good to me also. Brandon was terrible and Wilson was ok. Sure was nice to see Esky pull one out of the air and rocket it into the goal. He almost took Tony's face off with it. Perkins was not at fault on the first goal. Got to give jerkoff credit as it was a great shot. The problem I had was with the foul being called. It was a weak call. Other than that we were lucky to salvage a tie with Perkins in goal. He played terrible, as bad as one of Nicky's worst games. If he wants to stay in this league he had better play better next game. -The Far Side
That's interesting. I have to wonder if the boos were coming from people right below the camera. Sitting in the nest, there were all sorts of chants and songs coming out from the loud side, but there were no boos except for some of the bad calls that Hall made.
Here are some points I garnered from the first game of the season: 442 versus 352 (or whatever it is) 442. It was apparent that the tactics changed in the second half. Gros (especially) and Wilson were much more pushed up with and it was obvious that by the end we were in our more familiar ‘flexible’ 352 (Wilson – Erpen – Prideaux) with Gros supporting (mightily at times) the right flank. The 442 really will not work long-term. Why do I say this? Gros and Wilson could not get involved. Even a team with as legitimate a wide threat as MetroBulls did not really press play from those positions. Henderson had very little impact. Stammler was the same. I thought Mo Johnston would work the wings more, but he did not. Even with only 4 guys (or 3 plus Freddy), we did pretty well in the midfield in the first half. We pursued the ball well and fought hard. But this was a substandard midfield we were playing. Stammler and O’Rourke are not starting MLS quality. Guevara was decent. Henderson had a quiet game. But we are not going to be able to enjoy this much possession with a 4 man midfield against the majority of MLS clubs. True, Djorkaeff was having to drop deep and gave MetroBulls a 451 look at times. But Wynne and Mendes added NOTHING out of the back, putting even more pressure on the MetroBulls midfield. Another point. Most folks didn’t really like what Clyde Simms gave us in the first half, but he was active and disruptive. I don’t think that our 4 man midfield with Gomito in place of Simms would cover as much ground as it did against MetroBulls. In sum, with MetroBulls generally lower-than-average midfield and the fact that we had a more active ball-pursuing midfield with Simms in the game than we might have with Gomito, I am even less-convinced that the 442 is the way to go. I would rather keep the 352 and hope that Gros can continue to play 1.5 positions by nominally getting back like a right back. When we went back to a more conventional look in the second half (at times it was more 3-4-3, other times 3-5-2 other times it was more 3(1)-4-2), I thought that we were better balanced. And Wilson and Gros definitely had a greater impact on the game. So did Freddy, as he was not forced to provide width in attacking positions. Freddy is less dangerous when he is wider than the channels. That being said, I would still consider going with a 442 against a team that is seriously dangerous from wide positions. Chivas could be such a team. Dallas could be such a team, though I think they are better in 433. I don’t think that I ever want to see a 442 that has Namoff and Wilson as the fullbacks. We need better attacking support than those two can provide from the position. Alecko Eskandarian It was great having an actual striker on the field. Esky was direct and moved very freely considering all of the niggling injuries. He was definitely more dangerous than at the beginning of last season, though he clearly wore down a bit as his lack of game action caught up with him. Last season I felt he was overworking on the ball-chasing and defensive duties and that this pulled him mentally and physically out of the place he needed to be to make his runs and finish shots. That beautiful goal was the perfect thing to reaffirm Esky where he needs to be and what he needs to be doing. He had plenty of space and Gros struck such a beautiful ball that Alecko had all the time he needed to weigh it up and time his shot. That was a real striker’s goal – the kind of finish that we didn’t really see last year even during our ascendant moments in the regular season. Being a Liverpool fan and seeing the return to effectiveness of Robbie Fowler leaves me really hoping that Esky can come back in similar fashion. I have always seen a lot of Fowler in the way Esky plays – neither guy is a tremendous athlete, but few can rival their ball-striking ability or their ability to get just that inch or two of space they need to create a chance. And both need to be at peak fitness in order to play their game. Here is hoping that Esky can find that place again over a run of games. Freddy Adu I guess great flair players tend to fade in and out of games, and this was on exception for Freddy. On the one hand, it was great to see him clicking with his teammates. There were very few instances where Freddy was calling for the ball in open space or whatever. He also did better not losing the ball on the dribble (his first touch was much better when receiving passes with his back to the goal). He is clearly stronger. That being said, I thought he clogged stuff up too much, particularly in the first half. I wanted to see him release the ball sooner when he was wide and quit trying to steer the ball to guys who were not in really dangerous positions to begin with. I don't have too much trouble with his choices about when to beat a man and when not to beat a man. I felt he went away from dribbling at an opponent too much last season, in his efforts to prove to Nowak that he could play the system. In the second half, he used his time off the ball much better. He found better space and seemed to see the field better too. I think that a big factor in this was the greater impact Wilson and Gros were having on the wings (allowing Freddy to drift closer to the middle again). I really liked the impact Freddy had on the second goal and I am glad that he initiated scoring. But MLS is the only league where he would have shown up on the scoresheet. He still needs to have a greater impact in order to justify the decision to go to a 442 and give him a starting berth. Brian Carroll Brian was quiet during the first half, but he was not ineffective. During the second half, he was very involved both linking and disrupting. DC is a better team when he is part of the transition from the middle third to the attacking third. Last night we really struggled to generate an effective counterattack because Jaime and (even more) Freddy slowed things down with a lot of touches. But when guys like Carroll and Gros helped support the attack and gave Jaime and (especially) Freddy a chance to move purposefully off the ball and find a good position. It made them much more dangerous once they received the ball. BC is not a flashy passer, but he is getting to the point where he is more efficient with his touches than Ben Olsen, who is admittedly more ambitious. Josh Gros I really hope that Gros did not hurt his ankle too badly, because he was a lion all game. He covered huge amounts of the field – truly playing endline to endline in a fashion that would have made Earnie Stewart proud. He tracked Henderson relentlessly and was very disruptive on some other tough plays. He made key interventions on dangerous passes to Djorkaeff and ultimately Edson Buddle (when he picked up the injury). On the other end of the field, he overlapped well (great run-in on Meola) and passed and crossed in such a way that no one could complain. I wish he had gone bike on the great cross that he got at the top of the box midway through the second half (his utilitarian looping header still almost climbed over the Widebody) but I don’t know if the bike is in his repertoire. He also went ‘hard’ on Taylor Graham after the shot-attempt. I thought that it was a bit harsh that he picked up the card, but it was understandable as he dived in to the tackle and Hall wanted to send a message in a tough ‘derby’. Though it was clearly a foul, Gros got a lot of the ball. In a lot of ways, Gros is like an amalgam of Dema and Earnie. Dogged like Dema, with more of the athleticism of Earnie. I only hope his technique continues to improve. Josh bleeds for DC United. Just like Brian Carroll and Brian Boswell. These three players are the best testimony for the Peter Nowak era. None of them might even be in the league right now if they had not been brought along so well by Nowak. Erpen/Defense Apart from free kicks – of which we gave up too many – we really were not stretched too much by MetroBulls. I thought that Djorkaeff and Buddle were pretty isolated for long stretches of the match. I thought that we would be struggling more as MoJo worked the inside/outside game to Buddle by alternating his build-up play from the flanks to the center. Granted MetroBulls still got very little attack out of anyone besides their four main threats (Guevara, Djork, Henderson, Buddle), but we should still commend Erpen and the backline for limiting the chances. MetroBulls drastically under-utilized Buddle. If DC had a striker with his attributes, I guarantee that we would destroy the LAGals all-time regular season scoring record. Even if he was lazy. I don’t see how MetroBulls are going to win lots of games with black holes like O’Rourke and Stammler in key positions. Canero was a little better when he came in for Stammler, but he certainly wasn’t playing like a chalk-hugging wide guy – pumping crosses into the mixer. Erpen in particular showed great awareness of the position of the ball on the field and avoided making excessively risky plays. Solid tackling, decent distribution and pretty good organization all things considered. Troy Perkins I was bothered more by the flapping (on the Parke near-miss for instance) than the bone-headed play with Prideaux. Perkins looked so much more assured coming off his line in the preseason than he did on Sunday. He needs to be more decisive so that he is not hand-cuffing himself when he gets to the ball. Often it seemed like he thought he had left his line early enough to make a catch, only to find play faster and requiring a punch. But his punching was very poor (on several occasions). On the Prideaux play, it was Troy’s call, but Prideaux should have had a better position. Why was he not staying goal side of Buddle, or at the least between Buddle and the ball? I think that Bobby B would have been in a different position. Troy was surprised by Brandon’s position and it slowed down his decision-making. Lots of room for improvement. I agree with comments I have seen elsewhere that Troy’s distribution looked better. He picked some guys out very well with long passes. Particularly along the left-wing. Benny Olsen Great effort as usual. Olsen gets too much respect from Brian ‘the Wry One’ Hall. Hall called an acceptable game by MLS standards, but all of his winks, knowing smiles, etc show just how much he treasures his position as the big Kahuna amongst US officials. Back to Benny, he made a higher percentage of his ‘clever’ passes than usual, but he was still too profligate. I liked the shot he attempted (something he really quit doing for stretches last season) and his interplay with Moreno and others was useful. I wish that he would use Carroll more to settle down the attacking build-up. I think he forces the ball too much when he is the ‘attacking midfielder.’ I do get tired of the ‘game within the game’ thing between he and Djorkaeff. Especially when he gets into his histronics. John Wilson I thought Wilson was much more prudent about when to come up the wing and when to stay put. I also think he played decent positional defense, given the weak make-up of the MetroBulls on his side. Some folks have complained that he gave Stammler too much room with which to cross – but I didn’t see many dangerous balls coming in from that side. I think he wanted Stammler to have enough space to try to initiate offense rather then immediately locking him down, which would end up forcing the ball back to the more dangerous feet of Guevara and Djorkaeff. When he did make it up field, Wilson was fairly effective. He whipped in one very dangerous ball that tied up Tony Meola and was only partially cleared, resulting (IIRC) in Filimeno’s shot from about 20 yards or so.that could have been a goal if Lucio were dialed in a bit better. Minor MetroBulls Notes Marvell Wynne had a good game and kept it simple in his first big match. I was not impressed too much when I saw him in Charleston – the speed was in evidence, but the tackling ability was not. I honestly think that Freddy and Jaime fiddled around too much going mano a mano with the fancy footwork, when they should have just used their momentum and space to beat him as Josh Gros did four or five times in Charleston. On the other hand, there were enough kind bounces that I am fairly assured that Jaime will fare better against Wynne (and Mendes) later in the season. In general, MetroBulls defense looked pretty solid. Parke was much better than usual. Graham is very reliable. By the end of the season, there are going to be a number of overrated center-backs (Curtin, Goodson, etc) who look inferior in comparison to Big Taylor Graham. The Fans The atmosphere on television was tremendous. This was a great crowd, a loud crowd and a fun crowd. Watching this match was a treat for a whole host of reasons (opening weekend, big rivalry, great soccer, etc). But an amped-up RFK was a big part of the whole experience. P.S. Our team was very fit. They will have to be this season if we pay at that rate for 32 games. I am glad we are not going to be over-extended by other competitions.
Wow. Long but great post. When United was really starting to flail in the first half the formation essentially boiled down to a 6-0-4 or a 7-0-3. With all 6 or 7 defenders just strung out from sideline to sideline. I'm OK with defending with numbers, but they need to pressure the ball and not just be passive. This wasn't the ideal personnel set that we'll see. Boz was sick so Brandon moved into the center and Wilson came into the lineup. I think the nominal defensive formation that we'll see when Namoff is out is Prideaux-Boz-Erpen-Gros. I don't understand your criticism of Namoff. He broke back into the United lineup as a right back under Ray Hudson in a 4-4-2. He's got good attacking skills, too. It would be interesting to see if Namoff gets himself back into the lineup and if it displaces Gros or Prideaux.
I'm not saying the whole stadium booed Adu nor the majority booed Adu. If you taped the game or if you can catch on on MLSNET.com you'll clearly hear he was getting booed in the first half when he was repeatedly losing the ball. I suggest you check the game before claiming I was wrong, I'm not saying I agree with the booing I'm just telling you what happened. IT DID HAPPEN, check the tape the group I saw it with all heard and we couldn't believe it was happening.