Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Tell that to the death squads hunting Berhalter on the other threads...
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? CG has now been at or near the top of the list of our players' performances in games against The Netherlands, England and Germany. Is there anyone else who can say that?
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Let's see. . shall we move the man who shut down Asamoah and Ruud and the English offense to a new position. I'm inclined to say NO!! CG is the among the top performing players for this team and will be one of the biggest reasons for our success in the WC if he starts. the man is MONEY.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Im going to be "that" guy that disagrees.....Gibbs man marking abilities are better than any player in the pool in my opinion unless its a situation specific match up a la' Gooch v Borgetti in the last Mexico match up... I say you leave Gibbs at LB, he excelled man marking Asamoah, and he was effective getting forward dispite what everyone is saying. He has a great shot which dumba$$ Josh Wolff tried to re-direct (??????) and he also got forward and combined with Bobby Convey quite a few times. Also compliment that with the fact that player ahead of him, Eddie Lewis, Bobby Convey, DMB, is going to be very offensive and is going to push the LB for the opposing team. I think he is great cover for that option. He allows us to be more dangerous from the left side, still have a decent attacking foray every now and then, and also utilize his man marking ability which is the best in the national team pool in my opinion. This is a guy who has marked three high level international caliber players out of games (Joe Cole, Ruud Van Nistelrooy, and Gerald Asamoah). My eleven looks like this, post germany friendly.... Keller Dolo - - - - Pope - - - - Gooch - - - - Gibbs Beasley - -Reyna - - -Donovan - - Convey Johnson - - - McBride
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? I think it all depends what team were playing. the best 4 right now are probably Gooch, Gibbs, Pope, and Dolo.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Gibbs would be starting at CD, but sadly he is not getting first team games, so he can't.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? That wasn't a 3-5-2 formation, it doesn't matter what was announced, watching the game it was clearly a 4-4-2. One game doesn't make the man but with the roster deadline coming up it certainly can help push a player on or off the squad.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? 1. He's been rounding into health at a new club. 2. I guarantee this isn't gong to matter if he's playing well and fit.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? One question that no one has really discussed here yet, and I'm loathe to start this discussion here, is what does this performance from Conrad say about Pope's resurgence over the past couple of months? Is it real, or a mirage created by not-so-great competition, when compared to the level needed to start in a tough WC group? That factors a lot into where Gibbs plays. And we don't know the answer.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? I mentioned this in another thread and it's a good point to bring up. Pope is still a huge questionmark to me and might have been exposed just as much as Berhalter was today. Unfortunately that question wont be answered until June. Gibbs is a starting centerback in my book.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? As I mentioned in other threads, Bruce would have been better served going to Europe and playing some decent club sides rather than scheduling cupcakes in April-May. This current German squad is pretty mediocre by its lofty standards but it showed why MLS is not Bundesliga. And you wouldn't have known this by playing the Norwegian C-side, Latvia and Jamaica.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Yes, I agree to a point, but conversely, if a healthy Dempsey, Pope and LD play the Bundesliga might be looking less impressive, and MLS more. Hell, Wolff was looking pretty good out there. What if he would have stayed out there with those guys. As you know I was very worried about this squad playing today, but I have to admit I was nicely surprised in the first 60-65 minutes (I expected the worst as you know. I expected to be dominated from minute one until the had scored three or so) Happy to be wrong. My friends and work friends in Germany agree unaminously. For a B squad with mostly back ups/bubble players, and a couple of no hopers the US "impressed" them. They expected what I did from MLS. Total butchery. Wasn't even close uintil the breakdowns. Yeah, the mistakes happened, and the pros made us pay, but what if Schweini and Ballack don't play either? Again, the differences would look a lot less again. Make no mistake, The B'Liga is clearly better, but we are definitely on the right track. Especially versus German B'liga players. There is no denying that. Try as you might. I know you can't help but spin negatively, you are old school German (like my parents and relatives), it's engrained from birth. Dad - "What 100 on the test? No one else got above an 85. What? You go this 1 point extra credit wrong! God you are useless. Don't come to me all proud with that garbage." Sound familiar. Bet it does. The guys took some lumps, but they did OK. Ever improving. It's not the B'Liga, but give us LD, Clint and Pope for Euro Beercrapper and you know what? Germany gets much closer to those weaker teams, and we get much better. Believe it.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Starting back for vs the Czechs: Cherundolo---Onyewu---Gibbs---Lewis If Gibbs can play that well vs Germany then he beats out even a healthy Pope. Come on folks. This isn't that hard. Arena has had this six-way logjam at CB with four spaces open. he needed to see the three he had healthy today much more then he needed to see the only other option he had, Pearce. Gibbs had played fullback before and Conrad and Berhalter are unsuited to play outside the middle. So Gibbs got the spot and did better then the other two playing in their natural positions. But unles something weird happens, the left back spot in June will be manned by Lewis and Hedjuk.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Amazing how much things have changed from last year when we were wondering if Vanney or Burciaga would be the left back. We have some pretty good choices now. I would agree with those who say that we need a player that can contribute to the offense at left back. This is not to take anything away from Corey, who had a wonderful game. He could well end up starting at central defender. And there will be some circumstances or even entire games where for tactical reasons we may want more of a pure defender at left back. By the way I don't think that the main threat to Lewis starting is Gibbs. I think increasingly Convey is making the case he belongs on the field somewhere. In midfield, we already have (with a big assumption they are all healthy) Mastroeni, Reyna, JOB, Beasley and Donovan. (I wouldn't put Dempsey in the same class). I think it is more likely that Convey displaces Lewis than one of the Big 5 midfielders
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Just for those who missed it the US started out in the basic 3-5-2 with 2 defensive midfielders. Then when Wolff was off injured the US switched Dolo back to right back moving Gibbs over from left center to left. My problem with Gibbs is that his positioning in possession was poor and he was playing too narrow and shallow allowing Germany to push up on us. This can be changed but Lewis as a natural wide player does not have this problem. While his positioning was poor when we had the ball in our half once he advanced past the halfway line and was combining with Convey he did well.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? I disagree and would recommend watching the game again. That was an uneven box 4-4-2 from the start. You have to look at the positioning of the whole back line. Conrad and Berhalter were clearly playing like centerbacks in a 4 back line. Gibbs never played like a left centerback in a 3 man back line. He was out further left from the start and pushed forward long before Wolff went out. Dolo was expected to overlap more than Gibbs but that doesn't make it a 3-5-2. Dolo was playing the rightback spot not a rightmid or right wingback. The midfield was a slanted box with Convey out more to the left and Wolff more central just like the box is played with Beasley and Donovan. It's a pretty common mistake on here that people go with the formation listed instead of seeing how things play out, just like the qualifier in Salt Lake against Costa Rica.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Lets not get too excited. He held his own but his passing and ability to cross are not good enough to play LB in a 4-4-2. Too many times his passes either went out of bounce or to the Germans. He can play LB in a 3 back formation but his best position is LCB in a 4-4-2. He should start alongside Oneywu, Dolo, and Lewis--that is our best back line. Still think Albright should be backup RB/LB and bring along Conrad & Spector to be other backups on backline.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? I lean toward the view it was a 4-4-2 mainly because Cherundolo seemed to be playing pretty far back. But given that Wolff was in there for only seventeen minutes, the verdict has to be inconclusive. I wouldn't take Gibbs' playing so far left as evidence either way. He was playing that way because the guy he was marking (Asamoah) was playing so close to the touch line.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? FWIW, I am not German but grew up on Euro soccer, a great portion of which was German. And then I ended up with a lot of German friends and neighbors over the last decade or so and have become a big Germanophile and a WWII history buff. With that out of the way - the US deserves credit for playing a decent first half but the Germans were completely disorganized. Who helped Asamoah when he was double teamed? Friedrich is not a real wing-back, not with Owomoyela, Hinkel and Lahm available. Arne is really a central defender and should be playing there. Where was Schneider when Ballack was playing deep? Invisible. Who was supposed to be Lahm's partner on the left? Podolski was too high up and Ballack drifted toward the middle. The above destroyed any semblance to a flank attack the Germans may have had with Lahm pinching in, as is natural for a right-footed player on his off-wing, and Asamoah getting scant support from either his midfield or the central striker (Klose). What was Kehl doing on the pitch. Sebastian was totally useless out of the back. Why are Borowski and Schweinsteiger playing on their off-wings ... permanently? And the entire team was reminding me of bad MLS play - whenever a German midfielder was confronted by an American marker, he inevitably passed backwards. Maybe this is the real result of Klinsmann living in the US. He borrowed his strategy from Greg Andrulis. Not to go overboard here, but if this was a club team and I was the owner, Klinsmann would be out tomorrow and Rangnick or Hitzfeld would be in.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? I don't trust Boca or Pope in the middle as CB's. Both are susceptible to being burned by a quality striker (Pope is too slow these days and Bocanegra regularly gets burned in the EPL). So, Dolo---Gooch----Gibbs---Lewis is our first choice. If Lewis gets hurt, then we probably replace him with Hejduk OR we move Gibbs to the left and put Boca/Pope in the middle. I don't know which I prefer in that case, though. Maybe Convey could play left back, and in a pinch in the WC I wouldn't be surprised if Arena chose this over sticking Boca or Pope in. If Gooch or Gibbs gets hurt, then we have to slot in Pope or Boca there. If Dolo gets hurt we will probably replace him with Hejduk on the right, and it would be very bad for us offensively as Dolo is pretty much our only quality crosser from the right side, and Hejduk can barely kick the ball straight. Spector is also an option, but his shaky play in the EPL places him equal to or behind Boca for the left back spot, which is to say it would require two injuries at least for him to see the field (Lewis AND Gibbs/Boca). I think this is our defensive situation, and basically our starting back 4 is pure class. Any single injury is ok too, but Dolo would be the worst IMO because he's our service from the right side. But defensively, Hejduk has proven he can play on the right or left and do fine vs pretty much anyone (except Arjen Robben).
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? To start: ----------Keller---------- --Conrad-Berhalter-Gibbs- -Dolo-Pablo--Kerry------- --------Wolff-----Convey -----Ching--Johnson----- Then Wolff is off hurt: --Dolo-Conrad-Berhalter-Gibbs- ------Pablo-----Kerry-------- -----------Convey----------- ---Johnson-----Ching--------- Klein comes on: --Dolo-Conrad-Berhalter-Gibbs- -------Pablo-----Kerry-------- --Klein----------------Convey- -------Johnson--Ching-------- Germany played three at the front meaning that our marking backs were reponsible for their wingers. On one side Asamoah was getting a lot of the ball and pulling out wide forcing Gibbs over to mark and Bobby back. On the other side Podolski was non-existent in a Klein like way allowing Conrad to stay inside. We're kind of arguing semantics but you are trying to say that the way we played was how we lined up, which would make Bruce a tactical genius for creating a perfectly imbalanced formation. I'm instead saying that the individual matchups forced Gibbs wide and kept Conrad central but Gibbs continued to play narrow and shallow allowing the Germans to pin us back a few times, I mean when your team has the ball should your left back be standing at the top leeft corner of the box waiting for a pass? Dolo noticibly dropped back and Gibbs over, some of the times, when Wolff went off for treatment and Bobby went inside. Then when Klein came on Bobby moved back out left and Klein did nothing for an hour. Pushing Dolo back put more pressure on our twin dmids, pressure Zavgnin couldn't handle offensively and sometimes even defensively (hesitent to claim a ball which a German attacker then nicked away from him). Losing Wolff was the key moment of this match in determining how much Germany would win by.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Here's the problem. You are putting the situation in a vacuum. If only the Germans had done this or that, then this would have happened. How about the other end of the vacuum? What if the players I mentioned were here and Wolff stays fit. Who would have kept up with them? How many more chances would the US have had? Germany would have had less. The US would have had more time on the ball, the Germans would have been more stressed. The Germans would have had less time and opportunity. Klinnsy isn't my fault, so I don't worry all that much about what he does, or can't do. His problem and Germany's. I don't live in a world if the other team had this player, or would have played this way it would have been worse for us, or they would have been better. What I do know is that if our coach had the options he should of had we probably win that game, and at worst tie. BA would have adjusted and you know what? Outside of Ballack, I finally can say this with a straight face for the first time in my life. We are just as good as them talent wise - sans Ballack. That ain't no lie. Coaching is also a big part of the game and it's not an excuse. Can we take 98 back then? BTW - I love Rangnick as a character, but as a coach I'm not sold, but he id efinitely a character.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? That's not correct, you really should watch it again. It's clear from the first 16 minutes of the match that that was a 4-4-2 ----------Keller---------- Dolo---Conrad-Berhalter----Gibbs ------Pablo--Kerry------- -------Wolff-----Convey -----Ching--Johnson----- This is not a case of Gibbs just covering out wide left defensively, Gibbs is pushing forward up the left side as much as Dolo is on the right. I've watched the beginning of the game over and you guys calling this a 3-5-2 are wrong. A left centerback in a 3 man backline doesn't overlap like Gibbs did in the first 16 minutes. Conrad and Berhalter are the centerbacks in a 4-4-2. Just in the first 15 seconds of the game you will see Gibbs pushed forward up the left sideline, before Germany has even attacked yet. That's a leftback's positioning, not a LCB. It's easy to take the announcer's word for the formation, but you need to look at how they played.
Re: Corey Gibbs -- 2006 Starting Left Back? Agreed - Gibbs was a monster at CB against England before he got hurt. And Convey REALLY suffered from having Gibbs trying to support him offensively. I loved it when he really stuck in that German right on the sideline; but with a less dysfunctional midfield during the Cup, there should be way too much upside for Lewis to support offensively. Convey was trying to play left wing without an attacking mid or a supporting LB....VERY impressed today.