U17 WC: USA - Italy Post-Game [R]

"The goal wasn't offside regardless of whether the player was ajudges to be even with the keeper or not. He was definitely even with the ball, so he was onside. Bad call."

No because he was only even with or behind the ball after it was played forward to him. He had improved his position by being offsides (used to be enough for the call) and then played the ball (gets the call). Watch it in slow motion frame by frame and you will see #5 for the USA nearly on the ground play the ball forward with his head or chest (I hope not his arm but my tape is a little blurred) after the 'keeper loses it. Good call in that the A.R. got it right and the Center respected it. Bad in that we didn't get the goal. I bet a lot of people here would be adamant that it was offsides if it had been Italy and had counted. That's just the nature of the Beastial er um Beautiful Game. Also note that even if the 'keeper was 10 feet tall (long?) he was still nearer the goal than all parts of the 'keeper who at that moment was the second to last defender.

"That one studs up tackle, wow. Yeah that really should have been a straight red."

D@mn straight that. It seemed that maybe they innoculated themselves from a second red once they had one or else it made no sense -- that was a leg breaker plain and simple, maybe having more flexible tissue at his age saved him from the possible career ending 'snap'?

 

The goal was disallowed because the AR called Sarkodie for a foul when he dove to head the ball.

 

Everything I read said it was called offside, you have different inside info?

 

"The goal was disallowed because the AR called Sarkodie for a foul when he dove to head the ball."

"...you have different inside info?"

I'm wondering the same thing as the Center could see and could have called the foul (if it was one) and would not likely be influenced by the A.R. on that. The A.R. has the offsides so that looks more plausible. Not to mention the tape that shows it IS offsides.

 

Galavision sounds like they also believe it was just barely offsides. From what pathetic spanish I can barely translate.

*still watching the replay*
Oh and Cremonese needs a good whooping in a dark alley for the ******** he got away with on Altidore. Soroka had one of the goofiest goal celebrations I've seen, but hell I don't care.

 

Re: U17WC: USA vs Italy (R)

In case anyone is still reading...offside. The rule is two defenders, not one field player. The guy who scored was behind the keeper.

The same call was missed against us when we lost to Brazil in extra time in the Gold Cup a few years ago. Gibbs but not the keeper was between the attacker and the goal, the linesman missed it, Gibbs handled, PK converted, game over.

Great, great call by the linesman.

 

Re: U17WC: USA vs Italy (R)

The rule is also that the player has to be offsides when the ball is played forward. He clearly was not. The keeper misses the ball and it pops out to our guy who taps it in. Not offside.

 

I found this in an article on fifa.com about the Italian coach. What a bunch of bs.

"Sport is a school of life for youngsters, you must never forget that," he says. "And what are the most important things in life? Discipline, respect for others and good behaviour. That's what I teach my players. They know that if they don't fit the profile, they won't be part of my plans." The message could hardly be clearer.

 

Not youth NT related, but tangentially relevant. The quote that I think is going to be a classic for years to come: "We lost four players to the team that won the Fair Play award." (Bruce Arena on the senior NT's Gold Cup injuries)

 

From what I watched in the Korea game, I felt that way too many people were panning the US team, which to me, looked like they had far more real soccer players than the 2001 team, which was the last U17 tournament I had watched. Based on this game, I'd say the reason no US player stood out in the NK game is that not only is the 2005 team physically more athletic than the 2001's, but they also are much more technical as well. The US backs and midfielders repeated hit the forwards with long passes to feet or to space and were able to quickly counter while Italian backs frequently booted the ball out to touch. I also thought our midfield combined very well. The only technical area I was not impressed with (outside our keeper who seems lost on any ball floated his way) was the teams corner kicks. I have also never seen a national team so dangerous on throw-ins.

On the other hand while I think North Korea was under rated by most on BS, I think Italy was very over rated. Only time will tell how good this group will be when the mature, but I think this group is representative of how much US soccer has been improving at the youth level. I have never watched a (male) US national team completely dominate a supposed soccer power the way they outplayed Italy in this game. Its hard to get used to watching US team where the only player that doesn't seem up to level, is the keeper. My have things changed in the last 10 years.

 

God bless Tivo! Just got finished watching the game, and like most here have already said, great win by the kids and Italy looked pathetic with their whining, diving, flopping and cheap shots. PATHETIC!!

What's up with Italy not starting their #10? Looking past the US maybe? Probably figured they cruise through the group.

Was it not the same kid that kicked Altidore on the ground that gave shoved Arvizu in the face earlier? Kid should be tossed from the tourny if not suspended for several games.

Arvizu...wow!

Looking forward to seeing more of these kids!

 

Their #10 got benched the first game and acted like a little prick, so the Italian coach sat him for the first half of our game.

 

Re: U17WC: USA vs Italy (R)

I just do not see it. The US player ran on to the ball. When the ball has headed across the US player progressed. He was onside when the pass was released. It came in off of a corner kick, correct? It is very hard to be offside even if the Italians pushed out very quickly. Maybe it came off a free kick. Either way, the guy was onside.

Also, I do not think it was a foul called. The kick that followed the incident was indirect. If you there is a foul called, you usually have a direct free kick. Of course there are some instances where a foul would be indirect such as obstruction.

 

So I was just thinking. How many nations have made the knockout stages of the most recent Senior WC, U-20 WC, and U-17 WC? Too bad we didn't qualify for the Olympics. I'm too lazy to look it up myself, but I bet it's a pretty exclusive list. Argentina didn't advance at WC02, right? My gut tells me that Brazil is the only South American team to do it. Perhaps I'll do some research during lunch.

 

Hail to Thee, Hack!

Ditto.

A delightful surprise after the North Korea match. Not at all what I expected. Sure, I could have seen a victory. Stuff happens. But a complete soccer lesson? To Italy? Wow.

We absolutely owned the center of the field today, from box to box. Not as strong along the wings. But anybody who played in the middle 2/3s of the field, they did the job.

Very enjoyable. I love to win but I could handle losing just fine if we always played like this. Not that we would lose very often, mind you.

 

Let's compare his career earnings to, say, Beasley's or Johnson's, or even Ryan Nelsen's, when they hang up their boots.

 

Re: Hail to Thee, Hack!

That's the whole point of youth teams and the youth system.

We played in a very mature fashion out there. Ball wise that is. The simple little things we did on the ball are what the more polished countries do. Small things that give a player more time and space, thus opening up the field to all.
It's the difference between being a B nation and moving up to an A nation.

I hope we can continue to play in this manner, or attempt to constantly.

I want to play Brazil or Holland!!! This is how you measure yourself and your program. That is the point.

Let's find out what we can do against teams like this now and what we need to do better.

Want the US game to evolve? It starts here, and it starts against the better sides, win or lose.

Just to re-enforse your last sentence. People say they would rather win ugly than lose. HorseHockeyPucks!

If you play the way our guys did yesterday you will not lose that often and you will only get better.

Yeah, we could lose to a team with an Armas led midfield that plays ugly, but the wins, and quality of wins, would way outshine the occassional loss.

The goal is to prepare players to win the WC...not the U17's.

If you do it's a bonus. Bring on Brazil.

 

That player was on a card, and IMO the AR (who had the best view) pussed out because Italy was already a man down, already half crazy, and, well, Italy. You wouldn't see a Gambian on a yellow get away with that.

 

Or us.

 

Then they got the right result but the wrong call.

 

He really reminded me of Landon Donovan when he was around 20 to be honest. Same kind of acceleration, classy ball skills, and most importantly - flair and confidence. I hope Arvizu continues to play this confidently.

Anyone whether or not he'll be going to college?

 

Not to take anything away from a great performance by the USA, or to deny that the USA's talent pool is getting deeper by the minute, but:

Beating Italy, even outclassing Italy, in a U-17 tournament, is no big deal. The USA has only once finished behind Italy in a U-17 championship. Most of the time Italy doesn't even qualify for the U-17's. The USA has a strong U-17 program, and Italy doesn't. We should beat them every time.

 

It's their national sport; they have extremely well financed, professional sponsored youth development programs for their kids, training them 5 days per week while our kids are getting 3 days per week training at mom & pop local clubs that have the budgets of Milan's or Roma's table scraps; and Italy was good enough to beat out dozens of other European hopefuls to qualify for this tournament.

I'll agree that Italy didn't look good this particular game, but it's a quality win no matter how you slice it. I carped at the kids after the Korea victory, so I'm perfectly willing to poop on the party. But not this time.

 

Donovan has fine touch and is faster, but I've never seen him put on a skills display or consistently take on player after player, as Arvizu did.