U.S. vs. Guatemala - Revs (R)

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by The Magpie, Sep 7, 2005.

  1. KevTheGooner

    KevTheGooner Help that poor man!

    Dec 10, 1999
    THOF
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Andorra
    I think people are being unfair or unrealistic about TT on the Nats board. This guy has always been a loooongshot to make the '06 roster. I think Arena is blooding him with an eye towards '10. With that objective in mind, I think TT did just fine. He was everywhere, tough in the air, and really a handful for defenders. His timing is off because he is adjusting to the pace of the international game...it seemed like he rushed himself everytime he had the ball in and around the box....or he was caught in two minds when he had more time (i.e. when he chested the ball down instead of a header or volley).

    There is a reason Arena is putting TT in there, beyond blooding him: the guy is a phenomenal athlete...something you can't teach. But you can teach him to play at this level with enough reps.
     
  2. Feldspar

    Feldspar Member+

    Nov 19, 1998
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Exactly what I thought too. It's hard to think of two US national team forwards less suited to working together than Jeff and Taylor....
     
  3. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm betting if Johnson and TnT had more time up top together last night with Lady-Cakes behind feeding them, one or the other would have scored. They were just starting to get on the same page.
     
  4. Aquarius21

    Aquarius21 New Member

    Aug 15, 2004
    Plano, TX
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know that our players are getting blased on the nats boards, but frankly, i don't go to those boards that often b/c it's hard to find someone who knows what they're talking about. Yes, Twellman missed a sitter, but stuff like that happens. The fact of the matter is this was a B team in Guatemala and managed to get a point on the road. That's really all that matters in qualifying. If we win on the road, fantastic, but CONCACAF is really hard to play in and getting a point on the road is still a good result.

    It's also funny how well anyone of the players who started yesterday look good when they're with the A team. Good players with experience and leadership make the inexperienced look good. This isn't our WC team so quite frankly, i don't know why people are starting to panic.

    Dempsey and Twellman were trying. It's obvious they aren't Bruce's first choices and he's looking for subs next year. The conditions in which they were playing tested them... I don't know what Bruce wanted them to do so I can't really base an opinion on what they achieved last night. The midfield had a hard time delivering the ball to the forwards, and I feel Cunningham and Twellman don't compliment each other at all. But this was an experiment in which Bruce wanted to see who would step up. We may see more games like this as he continues to look for players he can use next year.
     
  5. JohnnyRev

    JohnnyRev Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Boston, MA
    There's a reason why Cunningham was the first to be subbed out. As people have noted, he doesn't work with other players. Too selfish.

    I actually think Twellman improved his chances last night. His all-around effort was very good, and he provides good defensive pressure on the opposition backs. Not that he's going to be a starter in the WC, but he's a good option off the bench.
     
  6. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    While I agree that this was an experiment last night, I don't agree with Bruce's thinking in who'll step up. It's tough to get anyone to step up if they're not playing the position they're best at.

    If you want to give these guys an honest shot at making the WC roster, then let them each do what's the best for them and the team. Pairing Cunningham and Twellman was a failure as soon as I saw it. They just won't mesh, they play too much of a similar game as a matter of fact, and that's not how Twellman is at his best. He's not a pure dribbler, he's not really a back to goal guy (both of which he can do, don't get me wrong), he's a great poacher though. Put someone up top with him like a McHead or EJ, and Twellman will have the perfect complement up top with him.
     
  7. REV-OKe

    REV-OKe Member

    Apr 4, 2001
    the speed of play at the internationl level argument is by and large a myth and poor excuse, esp when you are playing a minnow like guatamala. guatamala would not be a mid table MLS team.

    TT blew his 2 chances plain and simple, and I've seen him bury them with speed and precession in other games.
     
  8. REV-OKe

    REV-OKe Member

    Apr 4, 2001

    agree 100%.
     
  9. Aquarius21

    Aquarius21 New Member

    Aug 15, 2004
    Plano, TX
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And I agree with this. Twellman's not a dribbler and Cunningham never passes the ball. I know people have been shouting about how Cunningham is perfect for the Nats, but he's too selfish
     
  10. John_Harkes_6

    John_Harkes_6 New Member

    Mar 29, 2000
    Baltimore, MD.
    Not to troll but I think honestly this was Bruce's thinking. The guys who were playing last night are not the first choice at any of the positions. If I was Bruce I would be looking at these guys who were playing slightly out of position b/c their best possible quality for making the roster is flexibility. Bruce knows what a lot of these guys can do in their regular position. He can watch MLS game tape to see Twellman and Dempsey play in their comfortable roles.

    Last night gave Bruce a chance to see what happens if he plays someone out of their natural position. Can Twellman play as more of a holding forward in the mold of a McBride as well as a poacher? Where can Dempsey play effectively at the next level? He actually got to see Dempsey in two different spots last night which was good. If Dempsey can only flourish as a D-mid than he is in trouble behind Reyna and Mastro. However, if he can prove he can spell Donovan at A-Mid or Ralston/Q at RW then his chances are better. It is all about rounding out the roster with depth right now.

    Also - to be a little of a troll - if Twellman wants to make the roster as a poacher he needs to bury one of those two opportunities he had.
     
  11. Revs-West

    Revs-West Member

    Mar 24, 2004
    WWTS (What would Twellman say?)
    "Crap...I need to bury those"
    or
    "Crap...I need better service"
    or
    "I neither hurt nor helped myself".

    I'd have to go with number one. I don't think he is too happy with the results of his performance. I certainly think he is less happy than the Bruce though. Watching game tape may make him look a bit better as his off the ball work was top notch. Cunningham is done I think, he showed nothing to make me say that he is a good "team" player.

    Dempsey needs another match. He needs to improve his "foul weather" game a bit. Subtlety is hard to how on a wet pitch. He needs to show more adaptability in that regard. I will say that at least he tried to show some creativity when so many others were very stale and unimaginative.
     
  12. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Actually none of your comments were trolling. C'mon, we expect more from DC fans. :D

    Fair comments all that you said. To me though, as much as I'm a huge Twellman fan, he's never proven he can do what he does for the Revs on an international level. So while Arena can see him do that on an MLS level, that doesn't mean he can at a higher level, so playing him out of position doesn't really show him anything (see Kreis re: MLS games).

    I do agree with needing roster flexibility, that part is true. But the US has no real goal poacher on their team, if we haven't learned that yet then we're missing something. Twellman could be that guy. To me, playing him where he was played last night, you may as well just play him as a goalie, because he's going to be equally as succesful (read none) at each position.

    Dempsey is a different case, and I do agree with your comments on him.

    I also agree that when Twellman has a sitter, he's got to put it away.
     
  13. goussoccer

    goussoccer Member+

    May 23, 2001
    Avon, CT
    With only three subs per game and a long campaign coming our way, Bruce does need to think about flexibility. The Landon sub last night was a perfect example. Switch two positions at once with one sub.

    If you recall, in game earlier this year, Bruce actually had Twellman playing right midfield for a couple minutes at the end of the game!! I am sure that wasn't an attempt to find Taylor another position or gain flexibility, but was done out of necessity. I bet Bruce would want to avoid that at all costs when it comes time for the WC. Hence, players that can do a couple of different things will have a leg up on those that can't - especially when it comes to subs. I think that will be what clinches a spot for Dempsey and if Taylor just nets a couple of goals between now and June '06, I think he will have a great chance too. Ralston needs to keep that engine going as reliability and consistency is also a key trait. How incredible would that be - three Revs on the USMNT in Germany! Not good for the Revs perhaps, but still pretty cool!
     
  14. John_Harkes_6

    John_Harkes_6 New Member

    Mar 29, 2000
    Baltimore, MD.
    No offense - but if Ralston is in Germany - and has a chance to be on the field we are in trouble. I like Ralston - always have since he was with the Mutiny. When he teamed up the Mr. Fuzzy Hair it was great to watch. I also think he was one of the best selections in the entire Allocation Draft. However, Steve has gone down hill recently and I don't think he has the ability to get up and down the line on the right side.

    Prior to his goal against Mexico I was screaming to get him out as he was creating no offense down the wing. Even for the Revs this year I don't think his play has been stellar.

    Question is who would replace him. Quaranta had his moment to shine last nght and fell short - whether that was from coach instructions, fatigue, or simple nerves. I want to say Klein but I am thinking he is LM but I could be wrong on that.
     
  15. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agreed. Unfortunately so.

    Yeah, Q didn't represent himself or his game very well last night. But they've got time to find someone or someone has time to step up ... hopefully.
     
  16. REV-OKe

    REV-OKe Member

    Apr 4, 2001

    it may also serve to realign the midfield - change the tactics to suit the best 11 we have.

    a box midfiled, w/overlapping outside backs could work well with the guys bruce likes -

    obrien/mastro & renya as the d mids/distributors
    DMB & Donovan as the free amids/
    Lewis, and (maybe ralston? please not albright) as outside backs/wingers


    i would even consider putting obrien/mastro(or possibly dempsey) in the dmid role, move renya to right outside back, lewis left outside back, and put dmb and donvan at amid.
     
  17. Sean Donahue

    Sean Donahue Member

    Aug 31, 2001
    Massachusetts
    I assume you not including Cherundolo was not done purposely?
     
  18. Hagbard Celine

    Hagbard Celine Member+

    Oct 7, 2003
    Simsbury, CT
    I think Bruce's intention was to keep Ralston on the team as a steadying influence during qualification. He didn't want to throw Q into a starting role when qualification was still in jeopardy. Ralston provided the team with a stable influence...he's a guy that may not make a lot happen these days, but he also doesn't make a ton of mistakes. Now that we've qualified, I expect to see a serious hunt for a replacement for the right side. I'd be very surprised if Ralston is in Germany.
     
  19. Sean Donahue

    Sean Donahue Member

    Aug 31, 2001
    Massachusetts
    While I agree Ralston has not been at his best recently for club or country, I think his performances that got him into the spot he currently seems to have need to be considered. He had a great Gold Cup performance in last years edition and continued that into the earlier games in qualifying this year. Recently his form seems to have dropped considerably, but I'm not ready to say he's past his peak yet. I think he will and should get a few more chances to see if he can get back to that form and if he does he will make the roster and have a shot at starting.
     
  20. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think there is a small chance that Ralstons relatively poor showing across the board this season may be the residual result of that bad Viral bug he had shortly after the season started where he lost 12 pounds and was out for weeks. Sometimes having a bug like that can have an impact on level of fitness and ability for many months and will only be overcome with a few MONTHS of rest. Obviously, playing First Div soccer is JUST the opposit and on top of that Ralston has also been playing International games as well. This having been said, the Ralston of next spring and summer may be a lot more like the old Ralston. Unfortunately, I think it's more likely that Steve is on the down slope.
     
  21. REV-OKe

    REV-OKe Member

    Apr 4, 2001
    i suppose. but i don't think cherundolo is better than renya. and he doesn't hit crosses like ralston.
     
  22. bostonbully

    bostonbully New Member

    Aug 21, 2003
    Boston, MA
    I agree with those who deem Twellman a class-A poacher who absolutely NEEDS someone to feed him balls in order for him to do his magic.

    A few comments by Soccer America got me thinking that Twellman really does need to put the ball in the back of the net in a meaningful match for the US right now -- and not just in the MLS or in camp with the Nats. That is, if he's given another chance.

    Thursday's Soccer America e-Letter (under a column marked Losers, as in Winners & Losers):
    "Losers:

    New England forward TAYLOR TWELLMAN, so prolific in MLS, failed in his 11th appearance to hit his first international goal despite a handful of golden chances in the USA's scoreless tie with Guatemala."

    More noteable was Soccer America's player rating:

    "3 Taylor Twellman"

    Twellman was the only 3. Few 4's. Everybody else was 5. Only one 6 (Marcus).

    Didn't see the match yet but thought this review was quite, umm, eye-opening.
     
  23. Tobas

    Tobas Member

    Jul 22, 2004
    Littleton, MA
    Twellman when he came to MLS was a pure poacher. He has started to get some skill as a target forward in the McBride mold the last couple of years. He is not nearly as good at the target position at this point as McBride. I would put Twellman tied for third with Casey behind McBride and Ching in this role. Granted, this role is not needed, but against some openents it can be very helpful.

    If Twellman is to ever become a first choice starter for the US, it will likely be in more of this role with some scoring too. I think Twellman still has a chance to become a good target forward if he can just keep improving his game.

    This should be true for '06, but down the line he will get another shot if he continues to improve his game in MLS.
     
  24. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    Goal-scoring is always a percentage game. What percent of high-quality chances do you put away? What percent of medium? Etc.

    I've never seen Twellman as someone like Ruiz (or EJ with the USNT) who siezes the few chances they get.

    When the Revs are playing well, I actually find it rather maddening watching Twellman squander chance after chance (some high-quality, most less). But there's something about him; his intensity and focus seems to build over the course of the game and he becomes most dangerous at the end.

    He doesn't get that kind of service at the international level against quality opponents - and he's not likely to. Arena can't afford the luxury of giving 90 minutes to a guy who needs 4-5 good chances to get his goal. Wednesday's game is just more evidence that Twellman really hasn't advanced his game, as far as scoring goes.

    Sure, if Arena made Twellman the top-choice forward, playing with the "A" team, for 4-5 games in a row, Twellman would get his share - just like McBride does. But, in order to get that chance, you have to be much more opportunistic (a la EJ).
     
  25. JohnnyRev

    JohnnyRev Member

    Feb 23, 2001
    Boston, MA
    Soccer America has been bashing Twellman for weeks. To give him a 3 for the Guatemala game just proves how stupid and biased they are. Convey, Quaranta, and Vanney were terrible. Cunningham was awful. And Twellman gets the only 3?

    Twellman played as well as any other field player. Mike Woitola is obviouisly an idiot. His player rankings are always absurd. How can you give them any credibility after this?
     

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