MLS Match #19, 7/9/2005: New England Revolution @ Chicago Fire [R]

Discussion in 'Chicago Fire' started by NotAbbott, Jul 5, 2005.

  1. Friendly Fire Fan

    Friendly Fire Fan New Member

    Mar 31, 2005
    I like this lineup b/c I think Barrett has the tenacity and energy to play defense and he has the speed and creativity to open up opportunities for Rolfe and Jaqua to close out. The only real problem I have with it is that it again puts Marsch and Beutte in the middle of the field and there will be no creativity coming out of the middle of the field where it has to begin ala Thiago.

    I think this would be my second choice with Barrett running with Jaqua although if Herron could get untracked on his shooting accuracy and begin to anticipate a little better than he has so that he is in position (not offsides) for a head-flick from Nate, then he would be a possibility. Unfortunately, I don't think Dave will put Barrett into the starting lineup with first place points on the line. Barrett works hard at doing whatever it takes and I like that.

    As far as Rolfe for Thiago, CR has played attacking mid on a number of occasions during his college career and with the Fire Reserves. He is almost as quick as Thiago and has a little more size than Thiago. Defensively, he will create havoc for the Revs midfield when he tracks back. It would be good, it seems, to slide him into that position so that we do have a contingency for Thiago if he is unavailable at any time in the future.
     
  2. partycentral

    partycentral Member

    Nov 10, 2003
    Naperville
    No, not at all. The passing in the midfield, especially by LA, and especially in the second half, was very bad. They looked like they were a family kicking a ball around in the park, not pros who were trying to win a game.
     
  3. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    Wow. Issues abound.
     
  4. UDPride

    UDPride Member

    Jun 13, 2005
    I dont think I quite said this. What I said was he played some midfielder in college and didnt have any real issues at that position. What he gives up in possible scoring chances closer to goal, CR gains in more touches on the ball in the midfield and gets an opportunity to face the goal more, rather than have his back turned to goal and checking in to receive passes. He tends to make players around him better so more touches is usually a good thing.

    I think CR's success at striker or midfielder is in large part directly related to the players around him. The kick-and-run thing was a miserable failure from the beginning and only in the last two weeks did the Fire start looking to get more balls to his feet. This side of the equation probably caters to him very well, provided he can win balls in the midfield. Remember, hes 5-8. Thiago doesnt win too many high balls either. If Thornton can learn to play balls from the back, that would be a major step in the right direction.

    With Thiago out, CR to attacking mid is probably as good an option as any at this point. Id allow for a mulligan game to get his feet wet and accustomed to the new players around him however. Asking a rookie to carry the freight isnt exactly the easiest of challenges. Given decent balls to his feet however I feel he will perform well anywhere on the field.
     
  5. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078

    his printer ran out of color ink... so he can't read his emails at the moment
     
  6. dabes2

    dabes2 Member

    Jun 1, 2003
    Chicago
    Remember my post on labor day. Between now and then, there will be roughly 5 out of 8 weeks with half rosters. The results are going to be screwy, they are going to count, and fans will still be asked to pay $18 parking, $3.50 Sprites and $7 pizzas to watch MLS B.

    No sport with more credibility than the WWF would allow this to happen. It's garbage, garbage, garbage, garbage, garbage. Even Peter Wilt buys into this as a business necessity, but I hate it. I went to the home game vs. Columbus at the end of last year with Chris Carieri and Kelley Gray at forward, and that's when I just went over the edge on this issue.
     
  7. emprof

    emprof New Member

    May 27, 2005
    Chicago
    Almost every comment I've read in these threads portrays Rolfe's ball-handling skills as terrific. I'm not convinced yet that Rolfe will be an asset as a midfielder. In the games I've watched Rolfe at Soldier Field he has lost the ball too many times, regardless of whether or not a long ball was sent to him. I can't think of anyone to replace Thiago and Guerrerro for the upcoming match. I still see Rolfe at forward with Jaqua. I hope Reiter and Herron have had good practices this week because we will need them to be at their best. I would put one of them in as an attacking midfielder along with Mapp.
     
  8. joshyroundhere

    joshyroundhere New Member

    Jul 20, 2002
    Chicago
    I can grin and bear it with the best of them when it comes to people complaining about the MLS not shutting down during the World Cup (for reference, I would like to see the season be halted, but I can understand why it isn't). And even CONCACAF World Cup Qualifiers can be made a case for. But the CONCACAF Gold Cup is a wholly meaningless tournament in the scope of things. Yes, teams are missing players. That is why MLS created a reserve league - to get these players games so they are not disasters. As far as I know, none of these Gold Cup matches will even be shown on English speaking television (Galavision, Telefutura holding all the US broadcast rights).

    Where do we draw the line, if we go by your idea and shut it down for the Gold Cup? AND WC Qualifiers? Do we shut it down when Dipsy has to go to Africa for a Botswana quallie (RSL would be short talent!), when the rest of the league was here? What about Lubos needing to go to Slovakia for a European qualifier (Fire would be short... well... I guess Reiter could go without complaint..)? My point is that for soccer to work in the USA, it has to be done during the summer. As it stands the league already starts when it is cold in half the cities (April 2) and MLS cup isn't until November 13! It is just our tough luck that a majority of the rest of the world operates differently, taking summers off, making this a good time for FIFA to set aside dates for WCQ and the Youth Championship, etc.. They cannot run a business while having 2, 3, and 4 week gaps between games because of the Gold Cup or WC Qualifiers.

    And I was at that game With Carreri and Gray up top. If our midfield had not been Buete-Capano-Marsch-Perez I say that may have been a more successful game (but, in all fairness, I have always been a Kelly Gray apologist---PS, Kelly Gray could fill in at R-mid if we still had him :) ).
     
  9. joshyroundhere

    joshyroundhere New Member

    Jul 20, 2002
    Chicago
    I think there are a lot of differences in styles of play, etc. in the position shift from forward to attacking midfielder. The A-mid can get started so deep in the field, he will undoubtedly have more time and space to work with the ball. I think what you're seeing from Rolfe is the same thing you'd see from Thiago if we put him at forward - defenders breathing down his neck once he touches the ball, back to goal, trying to get the ball moving and the play flowing. Sometimes its successful, but I don't see a lot of forwards (in MLS at least) that have the skills to be able to hold the ball and distribute it unfettered.

    That being said, Rolfe has the confidence that I don't see in a lot of forwards [overall, but esp. in regards to dribbling], so I think he'd be a good fit.
     
  10. dabes2

    dabes2 Member

    Jun 1, 2003
    Chicago
    MLS misses more players for Gold Cup than for the world cup. The midseason tournaments are a challenge, and it sucks, and I agree it would be a big deal to take that long a midseason break.

    Qualifiers are another matter, and MLS plays during them because they decided it was worth putting out a sub-par product to avoid lower midweek attendance. MLS could easily schedule around those dates.

    But the two things in one season are a complete disaster from my POV.
     
  11. jtlawlor

    jtlawlor Member

    Jan 24, 2000
    Aurora, IL
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    <b>Sat. Dbl-Header?</b>

    US vs. Canada (3:45pm) - Gold Cup viewing at Gingers Ale House.

    FIRE vs. REV's (7:30pm) - battle for first place at SF.

    ... anyone?
     
  12. Friendly Fire Fan

    Friendly Fire Fan New Member

    Mar 31, 2005
    Then I guess you must be watching someone else given the fact that most of us on this website agree on CR's ball skills. Granted, he isn't going to be able to always hit his target but he does better than virtually anyone else on the team, with the possible exception of Thiago. That, IMO, says a lot for a rookie. Secondly, he tends not to lose the ball as much as some other players simply because he plays one and two-touch ball most of the time. His decision-making and ability to create space are excellent.
     
  13. Fires Of Fulham

    Fires Of Fulham New Member

    Mar 30, 2005
    Chicago, USA
    I think I'm game for US v. Canada. Will we have a translator? :)

    I'll be missing the match at Soldier Field since I'll be leaving for Michigan at about 7:00 p.m. :(
     
  14. feuerfex

    feuerfex Member

    Apr 21, 2001
    While MLS could schedule around the few qualifier dates that occur during their season, I'm not sure that your description of the rationale is accurate or complete.

    First, only three of the ten qualifiers fall on MLS weekends. That means that seven of them do not conflict. MLS did avoid scheduling any league matches on the mid-week qualifier dates. (Yes, there is one, but it was caused by a schedule change caused, presumably, by a pointy-ball stadium conflict.)

    When you cancel/reschedule an entire weekend of matches, basically you've got two options. Lengthen the season a week for each cancelled/rescheduled weekend, or squeeze them into the existing league season someplace else. Most often this is done by scheduling them mid-week, usually on a Wednesday.

    Since most of the qualifiers are scheduled in pairs with a weekend match immediately followed by a mid-week match (to lessen the disruption to the club teams involved), moving the conflicted games ahead or back by half a week wouldn't work (keeping in mind the window necessary before a qualifier for players to be released).

    Thus the only possibility, if you're not going to lengthen the season by almost a month, is to stick the rescheduled matches into the middle of weeks that already have matches scheduled on the weekends. This then escalates the number of weeks where teams are going to have to play three matches in a week.

    The MLS regular season is 29 weeks long with a schedule of 32 games. One weekend is reserved for the All-Star game. So there are already four weeks with midweek games. The USOC matches guarantee at least one additional for every team and a second for most likely at least half the teams, and as many as five for up to two of the teams.

    Adding an additional three mid-week matches is going to make it pretty difficult to avoid having some two-week stretches with a match every three-four days for some teams. Considering the displeasure voiced currently about having to play three matches in a week, imagine the noise if teams are forced to play an additional two games with only a three-four day break. ie, five matches with only three-four days between each one. Not good for players, probably close to an OD for some fans, and I'm also sure a strain on other parts of the organization. The possibility exists, for example, of a team having three or four road matches in a row with only three or four days between them. Not a pretty thing to ponder.
     
  15. I have $10 tickets for Section 8 for this match. Show up as early as possible because only a limited quantity is available. First come first served on top of Waldron Deck before the match. Otherwise, I have vouchers that can be exchanged for tickets for more money.

    Also a reminder that I will have tickets for the 2 big games before the match on July 9th. Bring enough cash to buy them. $20 + $5 for AC Milan and $35 for Real Madrid.

    Marcin
     
  16. dabes2

    dabes2 Member

    Jun 1, 2003
    Chicago
    Alternately, they could reduce the playoffs from 8 to 4 teams, freeing up 2 full weeks on the schedule and then you can make the math work without more fixture congestion. And having real rosters for those three games would make a difference. And having a more competitive playoff race would make a difference too.

    I've heard the story about 8 team playoffs helping attendance because the fans stay interested but I don't really buy it. The fourth place team fighting to avoid fifth doesn't grab fan attention for the playoff run. It's only the top 1-2 teams in each conference that start to generate local excitement anyway.
     
  17. Hattrix

    Hattrix Member

    Sep 1, 2002
    Chicago
    I've long thought that the MLS season could get a bit longer. Late March is a fine start time, especially in the Southern markets, and holding a final around Thanksgiving Weekend would be just fine.

    I also think that they absolutely should NOT play during the World Cup, at least while the US team is still in the tournament. That's mostly since there is nearly no market at all for MLS in the midst of the World Cup. If early rounds of the US Open Cup, where MLS teams play USL or PDL teams, could be scheduled for a weekend during the World Cup, that would be a good plan.

    But as for things like Gold Cups and Qualifiers, here's two thoughts:

    1- Consider a big name EPL team that plays a 38 game season, plenty of Champions League games, and a number of FA Cup games--including replays for any ties. Those teams simply can't survive on the strenth of a dozen or so players. All of their stars are going to have to be rested at some point, or will have suspensions or injuries, and their benches will have to step up and get the job done. MLS teams need depth as well, due to call-ups.

    2- Baseball teams have several pitchers. Playoffs in that sport involve multiple games to answer the question of who has the better team, rather than just the best starting lineup with one good relief pitcher. Games like the one's coming up are about depth. Who has the best second string strikers, when they get to have service from first team backs and mids, for example. Or who has the best contingency for central defense in a pinch.

    The Fire, right now, has to adapt a great deal to face NE. Recall by the way that Noonan and Dempsey both scored last time, with Twellman adding a third easy goal when we were pushed up at the end. Basically, the guys that killed us are gone. But we're without the heart of our midfield. This makes for an entertaining chess match, if you know the teams enough to follow the drama.

    So, there are arguments that requiring depth is appropriate. And summer tournaments provide an opportunity for that need.
     
  18. emprof

    emprof New Member

    May 27, 2005
    Chicago
    I would rather have the playoffs reduced to 6 teams playing rather than the current 8 or suggested 4. I agree that 8 teams is too many. Even if the Fire would have made the playoffs last year as the 8th team, they did not deserve a playoff berth. I used to believe that it was a crying shame to have the best players taken away from MLS for USA duty, but now I'm beginning to be resigned to that fact. MLS will need to work harder at finding more professional-caliber players. I don't see how starting in March and ending in November will work. Perhaps you could have more games in March in the warm locales, but it would likely not be fair to play November games there, as well, because it would give the home teams too much of an advantage. I also remember freezing my tootsies off in some of the last games played at Soldier Field, and these were in October.
     
  19. dabes2

    dabes2 Member

    Jun 1, 2003
    Chicago
    I prefer 6 to 8, but it doesn't accomplish my primary goal you need to whack all the way down to 4 to create the two free weeks for games without extending the season.
     
  20. NotAbbott

    NotAbbott Member

    Oct 11, 1999
    My Own Little World
    That's all well and good, but what about tomorrow's match? :D

    Later,
    COZ
     
  21. lemons

    lemons Member

    United States
    Nov 20, 2004
    Club:
    Atlanta United FC
    Right. The match. 4-1 Chicago. ;)
     
  22. Kozy

    Kozy tHE pOPULAR fRONT

    Oct 13, 2004
    check.
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I noticed that Matt Ries is listed after Keller on the Gold Cup lineup. Is he another absentee for tomorrow? If this was covered already, my apologies.

    As a show of sportsmanship, The Fire should at least offer to duct-tape thier
    arms to thier sides, to even it up a bit, or maybe just Reiter. :D
     
  23. Fires Of Fulham

    Fires Of Fulham New Member

    Mar 30, 2005
    Chicago, USA
    From what I understand from the Revolution boards, Reis is going to be made available for the match tomorrow as long as the other two Gold Cup goalies are healthy (which at this late minute it would seem they are). I can't verify that but that's the word on the street.
     
  24. Kozy

    Kozy tHE pOPULAR fRONT

    Oct 13, 2004
    check.
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks, I would like to see him play, (bring his goals against average up) also, he reminds me of "Rob Courdry" from the daily show, without the laughs.
     
  25. emprof

    emprof New Member

    May 27, 2005
    Chicago
    I read that Jaqua is doubtful for today's game. This was in the Chicago Tribune. I don't think he should play if he is not 100%. We still need two players to pick up the slack from creative midfielders Thiago and Guerrerro.
     

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