Mané Garrincha in 1962 .. is incredible ... ¨¨¨6 matches .. 4 goals ... 2 assists .... 2 pre-assists .. against England freekick goal by Vava .....23 chances created ... 62 dribbles completed .... 6 tackles ... etc ....! .................
Yes, for sure. This game vs Chile in the semi-final perhaps his best of the tournament overall IMO: (Interesting to note the indirect free-kick awarded for obstruction inside the penalty area in the first half, and the nature of the sending off which didn't eventually lead to him being banned for the Final of course - it is about on a par with the Beckham retaliation vs Simeone maybe - not very hard/dangerous but penalised for ill-discipline I suppose) I would tend to think still (albeit it's hard to compare between eras indeed) his 1962 tournament might be one of the top 5 World Cup tournaments individually (with Maradona 1986, Cruyff 1974, probably one of Pele's in 1958 or 1970, and also Eusebio 1966 maybe even though he declined a little at the end, especially in the 3rd Place play-off game I'd say). Funnily I think if I try to pick my theoretical idea of an All-Time Brazil XI I have a choice between Garrincha and Ronaldinho, because I think I err towards something similar to the Flamengo system from 1981 in effect, but with Pele as roaming/false 'winger' from the left or the right (meaning Garrincha lined up on the right, or Ronaldinho on the left....but yeah probably at this point I think Garrincha actually) Alternatively I could think of leaving out Zico I guess though (in theory it can mean both Garrincha and Ronaldinho in in a 4-2-3-1 perhaps), or of having a 4-3-1-2 with Zico behind Ronaldo Nazario and Pele as a front pairing, and the midfield being for example Didi or Falcao, Zito or Clodoaldo, and Socrates or Rivelino (so no Garrincha or Ronaldinho in it in that case, in a narrower system with Pele and Ronaldo playing freely and some width coming from midfielders too)....
Are you sure he lost the ball more vs Chile than vs England (I haven't counted so maybe you're right but I didn't have it clearly in my mind in that direction in that respect anyway)? The positive impact arguably better vs Chile (I know it'd be a close call though) in terms of what he does incisively in the final third of the pitch? I didn't remember it clearly before my post earlier but France Football gave 6 out of 6 vs Chile (even with the sending off) and 5 out of 6 vs England (only 4 out of 6 for Pele vs Mexico though seems controversial/questionable maybe for example, except that his own ball losses do number quite a few in that game actually too so it wasn't the most efficient performance...even for the time I suppose the grade implies in theory - it's just one source of course though): https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/1962-world-cup-xi-by-dr-friedebert-becker.2004460/#post-40097319
............. Gk- Gilmar dos Santos Neves FRb- Djalma Santos( Cafu) CD- Carlos Alberto Torres Cd- Mozer or Mauro Galvão or Mauro Ramos .. Lb- Nilton Santos (Roberto Carlos ) DM- Didi Dm- Zito ... WG --- Mané Garrincha (Jairzinho ) CF- Romário( Vavá, Ademir de Menezes) CF- Edson Arantes Pelé (Rivaldo ) WG- Ronaldo Nazario ( Neymar Jr )
............ For me Ronaldinho Gaucho is fighting with .... or against in Brazilian National team side of all times ..... Ronaldo Nazario(1998), Edu, Mario Jorge Wolf Zagallo, Roberto Rivellino, Paulo Cesar Caju, Neymar Jr.., Pepé, Canhoteiro, Zinho, Bebeto, Muller, Eder etc .... mainly with Zagallo, Ronaldo Nazario(1998), Roberto Rivellino(1970) and Neymar Jr ....
CR7's advantage over Van Basten is dribbling and movement. But it's not a small advantage. At his peak, CR7 was one of the greatest dribblers in European. When it comes to finishing, they're similar. But they are different players. Cr7 is more like Cruyff from Ajax than Van Basten. There are many players similar to Garrincha's style of play in the modern game, such as Figo or Robben. Garrincha is possibly the greatest dribbler in history in terms of dribbles completed. And an excellent corner and free-kick taker. But he also didn't tend to score many goals or assists during his career (Robben and Figo also had these strengths and weaknesses).
CR7 was much better in terms of long range finishing too. Both at free kicks and normal time. He were also better with the weak foot and heading
Most dribbles completed by a European player in a single champions league season Since 2004/05(starting point of the available data) Eden hazard 2014/15 51 Cristiano Ronaldo 2006/07 47 Frank ribery 2008/09 39 Kylian mbappe 2020/21 37 Thierry Henry 2005/06 35 Gareth bale 2010/11 34 Andres iniesta 2008/09 30 Robert lewandowski 2012/13 22 Karim benzema 2008/09 20 Erling Haaland 2022/23 12 Most goals scored by a European player in a single champions league season Cristiano Ronaldo 2013/14 17 Robert lewandowski 2019/20 15 Karim benzema 2021/22 15 Erling Haaland 2022/23 12 Kylian mbappe 2020/21 8 Thierry Henry 2002/03 7 Gareth bale 2013/14 6 Frank ribery 2008/09 4 Andres iniesta 2011/12 3 Eden hazard 2014/15 3
Agree to disagree I guess mate. Look at some of Van Basten's Ajax solo goals though, and look at C.Ronaldo's dribble success rates (and the fact he doesn't have better dribble solo goals than those MvB Ajax ones). I could probably agree to better at dribbling, but for me it would most definitely be a small gap comparing prime dribbling to prime dribbling (the only fair way to do it). MvB was a bit better in tight spaces at least I think too. Cruyff was far more of a playmaker than CR7 (and I'd tend to think also more of a team player in his early Ajax years compared to Man United CR7, though maybe that's a little harder to be sure about). I can agree a bit more on what you said about Garrincha (especially Figo in Barcelona-era has some similarity I think; not totally though); I'd add that there is definitely some similarity with Stanley Matthews (and Tom Finney, possibly Omar Corbatta too apparently?), and Julinho for that matter I'd say, among the other old-school wing-forwards, although in some ways Garrincha was kind of unique I guess, all in all (ok every player is I guess, but he was definitely distinctive in certain respects I think in his style and qualities).
............................ On World Cups in general dear mate has much more players ... with greater tournaments too !! Players with most goal involvements in a single edition: Ademir and Just Fontaine *The Brazilian Ademir was involved in 15 goals at 1950 World Cup (scored 9 and assisted for 6). His record is still unbeaten but was equaled by Just Fontaine 8 years later (13 goals plus 2 assists). *Raymond Kopa made 9 assists at 1958 World Cup: the record in this category. PLAYERS WITH MOST GOALS + ASSISTS AT SINGLE WORLD CUP EDITION Player Country Edition Goals Assists Total 1 Ademir Brazil 1950 9 6 15 Just Fontaine France 1958 13 2 15 3 Sándor Kocsis Hungary 1954 11 2 13 Gerd Müller Germany 1970 10 3 13 5 Raymond Kopa France 1958 3 9 12
Yes, that's nice info. Unfortunately we can't witness Ademir's performances in full of course, so it's even more difficult to compare (and that's true for Kocsis too even, and also Kopa if thinking about the fact for some of the games only highlights can be seen, even if more footage was broadcast back in the day than can be seen now I think - we can at least see some full performances by Kopa in that 1958 World Cup though). The number of 9 assists by Kopa is in doubt I think, because I remember that we seemed to establish it was a little lower (still about 7 at least though IIRC) because some highlights had appeared to show him with one or two assists which the full game footage doesn't show (so maybe the number 9 came from people looking at the highlights, unless it was rightly or wrongly reported at the time too which I don't know....). For example Piantoni's goal vs Brazil was not from a Kopa assist actually. But for sure anyway, regardless of that, Kopa was a star of the tournament for sure (it's hard to be sure about it definitely but when I extended to 10 options I had both Kopa and Fontaine from that year as other choices I was thinking about, along with Jairzinho 1970, and Kempes 1978 I think...plus those others I mentioned before).
............... I think Cristiano Ronaldo is better than Van Basten, above all, due to his longevity and professionalism Cris is Group A already the History of the Football ... I'm not saying that in a bad way. You know, I'm a huge fan of Marco van Basten. Injury beat Van Basten in 1993. how injuries defeated Ronaldo Nazario, simple as that. ........ yes for Talent and technical abilities of Marco van Basten and Ronaldo Nazario they're amazing to watching them in the field ... But Cris ... 39's old he's still playing .. and well sometimes ....
.......... I counted Kopa assists ... he has 2 assists against Brazil ... 2 assists West Germany ..... 3 assists Paraguay ... 1 assist ...Northern Ireland ... and one pre-assist 1 Piantoni's goal in the fourth goal !
This was a rough attempt I'd noted down when I was crazily trying a top 40 for passing/dribbling/goalscoring all combined; it is the attempted approximate order for the dribbling component of that (as with all the components the positions of the likes of Pedernera and Meazza for example being very approximated obviously) - overall placement I'd settled on for all 3 things combined in brackets: 1: George Best (22), 2: Diego Maradona (6), 3: Johan Cruyff (2), 4: Ronaldo Nazario (8), 5: Lionel Messi (3), 6: Pele (1), 7: Michael Laudrup (10), 8: Ronaldinho (21), 9: Luis Figo (27), 10: Dejan Savicevic (32), 11: Roberto Baggio (11), 12: Zico (4), 13: Rivelino (36), 14: Giussepe Meazza (13), 15: Florian Albert (37), 16: Thierry Henry (18), 17: Zinedine Zidane (17), 18: Eusebio (20), 19: Franz Beckenbauer (25), 20: Roger Piantoni (31), 21: Gianni Rivera (16), 22: Gheorghe Hagi (14), 23: Bobby Charlton (23), 24: Jimmy Greaves (30), 25: Robert Pires (34), 26: Adolfo Pedernera (40), 27: Cristiano Ronaldo (15), 28: Kazimierz Deyna (24), 29: Marco van Basten (9), 30: Juan Schiaffino (38), 31: Ferenc Puskas (5), 32: Alfredo Di Stefano (7), 33: Rivaldo (39), 34: Nandor Hidegkuti (19), 35: Fritz Walter (29), 36: Dennis Bergkamp (26), 37: Michel Platini (12), 38: Kenny Dalglish (28), 39: Didi (33), 40: Enzo Scifo (35)
I guess in a way you kind of do agree with me (in terms of 'talent and technical abilities') then, and if we would differ on a 'greatest players' listing it might be more likely to be in terms of weighting of prime vs career (also considering bad luck with injury etc)....
............. You like of Football by the way .... really hahahaha crazy Ranking list at all ! Congratulations man !
I remember when I had been looking at it, but I think it's maybe quicker to look up the excellent work of @wm442433 and refer to that (I believe we had agreed on the same number eventually): Football Yesterday & Today: Raymond Kopa - Statistiques détaillées en Equipe de France (footballyesterdayandtoday.blogspot.com) So discounting the pre-assist (I would need to check the footage again, but I expect I would agree with you if you have seen it) would knock your figure down to 8 narrow (Opta) assists I suppose. And it looks like you are counting one more vs Brazil still, compared to wm442433 (if that 2nd Brazil one is not the Piantoni goal): It looks like the full Brazil-France match isn't on Youtube now (the Brazil-Sweden Final is though still), but here it is on Footballia: France vs. Brazil 1958 | Footballia
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Diego Armando Maradona ... did it to elect the best players of the Football History ,... Maradona said : 1. Alfredo Di Stefano .. 2. Johan Cruyff ... 3. Lionel Messi ... that C. Ronaldo was the best at the moment ... in the World ... from the History .. he spoken with the journalist there no Jodan no Jodan ...
Hmm, crazy is maybe right lol: I just randomly remembered about this song I knew when I was young (I didn't know it was from Scotland though)!